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Covered in Weasels

A couple notes from combat testing

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I do like the changed scatter rules. Shotguns hit harder up close and up to a certain range you are more likely to be hit by the "cloud" of shot. While at farther range their impact is minimized.

 

Could it be better? Sure, but it does add a more consistent heavy damage compared to the flurry of shots with the old rule, that could hit big or not at all.

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Shotcannons in Dark Heresy actually kind of suck. Only War's Ripper Gun is probably a better representative of what they should be. (1d10+8 rather than 2d10 and S/-/6 instead of S/3/-) The problem with both weapons is that they are short-ranged Heavy weapons, which means that unless the wielder has Bulging Biceps/Auto-Stabilized, attached Suspensors, or an enemy that likes standing suicidally close without charging into melee, they're extremely inflexible and are generally outclassed by conventional shotguns.

 

Accurate weapons have flitted in and out of "overpowered", and I honestly can't think of any ways to really solve this problem.

 

One thing I have seen is to either require a half action brace or a called shot modifier (or half action) for fixing accurate.

 

One idea I floated in another thread was it being a -30 modifier to called shots, the talent brings it down to -10, which still cancels out the standard attack bonus (and from a half aim, only +20 including accurate), while untrained snipers have a flat +0 all put together.

 

Bracing works as well, but changes the dynamics of the game more.

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Our group playtested Accurate weapons with an alternate rule: the bonus damage dice are only granted if you spend a Full Action aiming. We liked the way this rule played; it let you fire quick snap shots that did "only" 1d10+4 damage with 3 Pen when needed, but if you really wanted to put the hurt on somebody you'd take a Full Aim and let loose on the next turn. Telescopic sights already have this limitation built in so it doesn't require any core rule changes, and the lack of a Bracing requirements prevents awkward rules abuse with suspensors/Bulging Biceps.

I really like the fact that a good aimed shot with an Accurate weapon can take out an average enemy in one hit. So many games have no way to one-shot enemies with a sniper from hiding using RAW, but the Accurate weapons can do that and feel great to use. Therefore, I think nerfing the damage is not a good idea because it saps much of the fun out of Accurate weapons. Restricting the bonus damage to Full Aimed shots keeps the high damage potential but makes the players work for it a little more.

 

Enemies can also counter sniper-wielding players by shooting them while they are Aiming. If the player elects to Dodge the hit, they lose their Aiming bonus. This encourages more tactical combat as players are encouraged to snipe from a safe position rather than running about in the open 360 no-scoping n00bs.

This is also an indirect buff to Called Shots. Since players have to spend a Full Action aiming before they can get the bonus Accurate dice, they will be more inclined to spend their following turn to make a Called Shot. With the talent that lowers penalties for Called Shots, they'll only miss out on the +10 to hit from Single Shots. Called Shot would not be objectively better than a normal attack in all situations, but it would be far superior if your target is in cover.

Edited by Covered in Weasels

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Could you try out the ammo acquisition rules and see what your players think of those? Bonus points if they have one of the guns that get's shafted completely by the rules (Bolt Pistol/Bolter, the shotguns, stub revolver and bows/crossbows are some more common examples)

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Could you try out the ammo acquisition rules and see what your players think of those? Bonus points if they have one of the guns that get's shafted completely by the rules (Bolt Pistol/Bolter, the shotguns, stub revolver and bows/crossbows are some more common examples)

Do you mean try out the alternate acquisition rules you proposed? We've been using the RAW rules so far and haven't run into any issues, but my players tend to use pretty common weapons so buying ammo isn't a problem (I think the rarest gun used by anyone atm is the sniper rifle, which uses bullets very slowly and has a rather large clip). I'll run your suggestiond by my players and see what they think, but we tend to deal with carrying capacity and ammo in a fairly abstract way. For us, the DH2 ammo system saves a lot of time and makes it easier to focus on investgation and combat.

With that said, I can see where the DH2 system would get strange at higher levels. Fuel for flamers is by far the weirdest to me; why does someone get so many fewer shots when requisitioning hand flamer fuel than when buying regular flamer fuel? It's a flammable liquid, not some magical fire-juice that comes in Pistol and Basic flavors! The bow/crossbow example is odd too -- while the Warrior walks into the store and buys over a hundred autogun rounds, the Assassin carefully selects three arrows from the display and buys them individually :P

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They might as well throw in acquisition rules for equipment by planet type also. Feral and Feudal worlds might be pretty darn hard places to find standard ammunition. You could find arrows, bolts, and fire bombs galore though.

Edited by Elior

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I meant more the basic rules applied to the trouble weapons, but if you would test out my first rough draft, I would appreciate that too! I built it to allow the more realistic approach of buying just flat ammo. It still needs work to tweak the values (like I see your issue with the hand flamer flasks, though that at least could be said to be under pressure, the arrow/quarrel one or any low ammo capacity weapon is just silly, the bolter/bolt pistol even more so). What do you do with your players when they want to "top off" a clip or have 2 half full clips (firefight, then swapped a fresh clip in before the next).

 

Yeah Elior, that is another issue, I didn't want to jump into that too early, but situational rules could be great.

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Elior,

From a post in BC's House Rules forum, and is useful in adjusting Acquisitions by technology level...

 

Technology

 

Primitive worlds are devoid of any real technology more advanced than the wheel. Be it through environmental demands or perhaps just an apocalyptic warzone, there are virtually no vox transmissions, cogitators or servitors to speak of on the surface outside of tombs or ancient alien sites.

Examples: Death Worlds, Khurse (surface)

 

Moderate planets have rudimentary technology available. Motorized vehicles, electricity, running water, the occassional food distribution machine and cogitator with perhaps some public address systems. Very basic turrets, gun servitors and servo-skulls are unlikely on these worlds but not unheard of. There may be one poorly maintained long-range vox frequency used to coordinate with ships in orbit.

Examples: Sacgrave (I realize the book says Sacgrave is on par with Q'sal in Tech but I decided I don't dig that - dude is freaking stuck on the surface) , Harvest Worlds

 

Advanced civilizations have technology commonly distributed among the populace and although advanced items are worn by perhaps the elite of society, they remain rare. Servitors of varying kinds, automated defenses and alarms, servo-skulls and cogitators are commonplace however. There are two constant main-stream vox frequency used for distribution of information across the planet (one military-esque, one public) but it is a closed system, much like virtually every kind of cybernetic system to be found on these planets.

Examples: Poorly supplied and maintained Forge Worlds, Forge-run trading outposts - Khurse (Orbit), militarized planets

 

Peak worlds are as rare as they are wondrous. Technology abounds and if it is not freely traded among the society those who have access to it are ubiquitous. Servitors of every kind are as common as the populace, state of the art automated defenses and alarms protect some of the most beautifully constructed infrastructure ever crafted and cogitators that can calculate Warp jumps within minutes are commonplace. Multiple main-stream vox frequencies are a constant, many for private use, some for entertainment, and some that have a use beyond understanding.

Examples: Well supplied and maintained Forge Worlds, Terra, Q'sal, Mars

 

 

Availability for Technology Acquisition Tests

Primitive   -30

Moderate +0

Advanced +10

Peak +30

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