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gertat

Corb Polyborg vs Ambush

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When this unit enters play, name a card other than 'Corb Polyborg'. That card cannot be played or put into play as long as this unit remains in play.

If the player playing Corb names a unit that has the ambush keyword and that card is already in play as an facedown development. Later when a player is attacked can the attacked player ambush with that unit?

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Ok developments are in play.

Can I even play the named card as a development?

I think this can get really comfusing.

You have to either show wich cards you play as developments or keep track of wich development was played when Corb was in play or not.

You guys are better at the rules and the implications an other cards and so on but.

If the Wood Elf player get to turn the development over with ambush, you should even be able to bypass Corbs effect by card as Rip dere Eads of

Would really like a answer to this if you have the time

Or if you could adress Corb in your next FAQ

Edited by gertat

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My brother and I talk al lot about this and we have a question.

A development is in play.

When you turn the development over trough for example ambush is that putting it in play.

If It's is this is the answer to The Corb problem we think.

Because then you cant turn that card over because the text on Corb says "enter play or put into play"

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No, ambush is turning devs face-up.

 

Our FAQ team discussed this and it will probably be in the next update to the FAQ. Cards played as developmenst are just this, developments. No name, uniqueness or anything. Rip/Ambush bypass Corb.

Edited by Virgo

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Exactly, you can do that. You draw 2 heroes, you play one and the second one as a development. Both cards are in play, but only one is unique hero, the other one is a development.

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Sorry but I dont understand.

You dont have to answer I will wait on the FAQ.

The thing I dont understand is this.

If playing as a development is putting the card in play then you shouldnt be able to play a Corb named card as a development.

If you reson that playing a development isnt playing the named card because It's a development should mean that the Corb named card hasnt entered play yet.

Then when you ambush the card with the reasoning above should mean that because the unit didn't enter play as a development it should enter play or be put into play when you ambush with it.

It got enter play sometime.

Until the FAQ comes out we are going to play that you cant ambush with the Corb named card.

Thanks for the discussion

Edited by gertat

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There is no support for the idea that you cannot ambush a card already in play named by Corb. Ambushing is neither playing nor putting into play a card. These are the only two things Corb prevents. The only question is can you play it as a development after being named by Corb.

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 i do believe that  the example with two heroes is quite reasonable. (one played in a zone - entered play, anther one was played as a development - development entered play, not specific card).

@Gertat - If what You're proposing was correct - an ambushing card was entering play - using Rip dere Eads Off on Grimgor (as a development) would result in triggering his forced effect - which by any means is not happening;)

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cparadis and Rodzyn.

The things you point out is precisely the problem we have with the card.

If you say ok to one thing it mess up an already exsisting rule and if you dont it dont make any sense either

For not having a better way to describe it (english not my native laungue) "philosofic" point:

A card has to enter play sometime.

Edited by gertat

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A card has to enter play sometime.

 

Of course, but the thing is that when you play a card as a development (it enters play) it is just "a card" - it has no name, stats etc.

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I understand that and understand that the rules says that for example Grimgors effect cant be triggered when you by card effect turn a development over.

But all the same the card has to enter play sometime.

If you ambush or turn it around by some by other card effect it still should enter play.

Otherwise when you turn the development it should have not stats, not trait and so on because as Rodzyn said It's not a second hero that entered play It's a development..

If you turn around Grimgor by Rip dere heads of it still Grimgor that enters play even though you cant use his effect.

So still think that you shouldnt be able turn the development a card named by Corb.

So for none of your argument seems to folly any logic.

You just repeats former rulings.

One thing tough that I dont understand is what "put into play" means and when those happen.

Because Corb also prevents cards from being put into play

Edited by gertat

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One thing tough that I dont understand is what "put into play" means and when those happen.

 

You "play" card from your hand paying its cost, and you can "put into play" cards through various effects (Mork's Ritual, Call for Reserves and so on) - it is usually stated in text box. Some effects are triggerd when you play card, some when card is put into play..

 

 

As far as mess with Corb and developments goes.. I have an impression that you're a bit overthinking it:)

 

Otherwise when you turn the development it should have not stats, not trait and so on because as Rodzyn said It's not a second hero that entered play It's a development..

I don't follow this logic :/ Why wouldn't it has stats after turning facup? It enters the game as a development, but after turning facup its state changes, doesn't it? And the same card is already in play, so it seems like turning devs facup is legitimate way to bypass Corb "sanctions".:)

Or maybe I'm wrong?

cheers

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Love this type of discussions and It's great to have you guys to talk to.

Ok It's a bit overthinking but that doesnt mean It's wrong.

But in your last post you just made my case.

Put in to play = is by some card effect getting a unit into play.

That is what Rip de heads of or Ariels ambush is.

And Corbs says just that you cant do that.

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Thats not the point I'm making.

The examples I described above is just an example

Ok if the game cant handle this but

A card has to enter play sometime in whatever matter

If it doesnt It's not a card, it doesnt excist. It's nothing

Edited by gertat

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heh mate, it's too strong for me:)

 

 

A card has to enter play sometime in whatever matter

It does enter the game.

 

If it doesnt It's not a card, it doesnt excist. It's nothing

It's not nothing. It's a development:P

I cannot state it clearly enough:)

btw. Have a nice weekend:)

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Know that I'm a pain in the butt.

 

Now to something more fun

Have printed the great neutral capitalboards that meggypeggs provided.

Just s little bit larger.

It works great

 

1520747_10202970183885032_876371747_n.jp

Edited by gertat

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Thats not the point I'm making.

The examples I described above is just an example

Ok if the game cant handle this but

A card has to enter play sometime in whatever matter

If it doesnt It's not a card, it doesnt excist. It's nothing

If I understand what Virgo is saying it works like this.

 

You play cards as developments. At that time, whatever's printed on the card is ignored. Literally, it becomes another token. Corb can't block you playing Developments, because they don't have titles. They don't have text, or costs, or power. Effectively they're not even cards anymore. But they are in play. Just like damage tokens, resource tokens, and burn tokens.

 

So you have a state where the card hasn't been played, but it is already in play.

 

Ambush doesn't put a card into play, or play a card. It turns a token back into the card it was originally. This is also why cards with the Ambush keyword usually say "when this unit ambushes" rather than "when this unit enters play".

 

Corb doesn't prohibit ambushes, and he doesn't prohibit developments. He only keeps you from playing or putting into play a card. If you turn that card into a development, he can't stop it.

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Starke

You have not answered the problem.

You play cards as developments. At that time, whatever's printed on the card is ignored. Literally, it becomes another token. Corb can't block you playing Developments, because they don't have titles. They don't have text, or costs, or power. Effectively they're not even cards anymore. But they are in play. Just like damage tokens, resource tokens, and burn tokens.

Have understood this all the time

So you have a state where the card hasn't been played, but it is already in play.

Here is what you all dont get.

It's a development that is in play not the facedown unit.

Ok that there is former rulings that explain this and I accept them but they dont work with Corb.

So when you turn the the unit face up with for example ambush that unit has to enter play otherwise you shouldnt be able to play the unit as a development.

Because as you said so for It's a development that has entered play.

Bortom line that you all miss is A UNIT HAS TO ENTER PLAY SOMETIME

As the rules stand right now Corb is a broken card. No one has presented a valid reason that Corb work

Edited by gertat

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That's just it. Ambushers never enter play.

 

One moment the card is in your hand, then a development is played, then it's on the table as a development. That's the card entering play, but not under it's own name.

 

This is basically the same reason you can play heroes and legends as developments. You can't play a legend if you already have on in play, but you can play one as a development. Because it's a development, all the normal (can I play this card legally) checks don't apply. Including Corb.

 

Ambushing is very specifically neither putting a card in play, nor playing a card. It's a card that was already "in play", but you're turning it back into a unit/tactic, instead of the development it was when it was played.

 

Ambushing does invoke the "can I play this card legally" checks, when you reveal the card. So if you try to ambush with a second hero in one zone, or with a second unique unit, then the ambush fails, and the card gets discarded. But Corb doesn't care about ambushers. If he did, he'd have to specify it in his text.

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You play a unit as a development. You're not playing a unit, you're playing a development. The card enters play as a development. When the development is turned faceup and becomes its printed card type, it becomes a unit. But the unit does not enter play because the card was already in play.

 

Gertat, you keep insisting that the unit has to enter play at some point. It doesn't. The card needed to enter play, and it did, as a development. Then, the card just changes its card type, it turns from a development into a unit. When Judgement of Loec turns a unit into a development, that unit doesn't leave play. When Kairos makes developments be units in addition to developments, those units don't enter play. A card enters play when it is played or put into play, when it goes from an out of play zone (deck, hand, discard pile) to an in play zone. Changing or gaining card types while in play is something else.

 

So you can play the card named by Corb Polybog as a development (it's not what's printed on the card, it's a development), just like you can play another copy of a unique card you already have in play as a development. Corb forbids you from playing or putting into play the named card, he doesn't forbid to have the named card in play.

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