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neodruid

Force to move monster

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Hello,

On some hero weapon cards (equipment from shop) for surges player can move back monster back one space. What happen when Ovelord cant move back one space back monster especially with larges figures. I assume in this case the figures are not moved back at all.

Correct me if I am wrong.

 

neodruid

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In the case that the monster is absolutely surrounded on all sides (or in the case of a large monster that can't move to a space where it can legally expand), it's a bit fuzzy whether the monster would not move, or would be placed in the nearest empty legal space. Steelhorns' ability specifically mentions "or closest empty space".

You may want to submit a question to FFG via the Rules Questions link in the footer. When you hear back, please post back here and on the FFG Sez thread on BGG: http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/863073/ffg-sez-thread-link-to-wiki-in-1st-post-unoffici

(As a side note, if moving a large monster, the large monster shrinks to the targeted square, is moved one space by the hero, then expands from that new space.)

Edited by griton

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Thanks, 

It explain on my question.

We can say in general if there is no statement "or closest empty space" then a monster is moved only one space if able.

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And even if not, the "closest empty space" is always the one where it originated from. The only case this doesn't apply is where Steelhorns has entered that space.

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When moving Large monster like Shadow Dragon with Crossbow who gets to expand the Monster after the move (Heroes or Overlord)?

 

If Heroes that makes Crossbow very effective clearing corridor from monsters like dragon since you can move dragon 3 Spaces/shot.

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Q: I have a question about the crossbow and large monsters: How does the 1 space movement work for large monsters? Does the hero get to shrink the monster to 1 space, move it 1 space, and then expand it in any direction the hero chooses?

A: Yes, the attacking hero chooses how the large monster moves. The large monster does indeed shrink and expand following normal monster movement. The monster shrinks from the targeted space.
 
 
 
Emphisis is mine as it could be easily missed, but is very important.
Edited by RagsMckay

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I'm not 100% certain on the answer to your question Jirgen, but I would say the OL is the only player that can end a monsters move using the expand feature.  If you read the rules book concerning Large Monster movement, it goes to explain that the OL player is the person taking advantage of expansion, not heroes.  That's a good enough distinction, and makes the most sense.  There is a serious difference between the cross bow moving a dragon one space, and moving it four (with expansion).

 

Whoops, it looks like I stand corrected.  RagsMckay has the answer.  I don't agree with that answer one bit, but if FFG Sez, well, that's what they Sez.

 

-Cursain

Edited by Cursain

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Cursain I too were refering to that part of the rulebook, since the rulebook talks about Overlord expanding the monster. Sound starange that crossbow bolt has more effect on dragon than goblin.

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The crossbow will only move any creature one space. Large creatures shrink at the target space (the space that the attacker was aiming at with the crosbow) and then moves one space and is expanded again. This will cause the creature to move only one space.

 

I don't think a crosbow is more affective against a dragon than a goblin. The creature is still only moved one space regardless of what the large creatures orientation before or after the move.

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I think what Justin is saying, unfortunately, is that if the dragon is here and is shot by a Crossbow like item:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/3awxkgs4fg5ux5w/Crossbow1.png

 

It can get moved by the hero using the crossbow to here:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/s383jyj6fbyk5sn/Crossbow2.png

 

Crappy, but it's what Justin said....."The large monster does indeed shrink and expand following normal monster movement."

Edited by Cursain

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Q: I have a question about the crossbow and large monsters: How does the 1 space movement work for large monsters? Does the hero get to shrink the monster to 1 space, move it 1 space, and then expand it in any direction the hero chooses?

A: Yes, the attacking hero chooses how the large monster moves. The large monster does indeed shrink and expand following normal monster movement. The monster shrinks from the targeted space.

 
 
 
Emphisis is mine as it could be easily missed, but is very important.

 

 

Think the important thing is what RagsMcKay wrote (especially what he emphasised).  You can only move the monster from the space it was targeted from with the Crossbow/Leather Whip.  So in your example it only works if the heroes attacked the dragon by attacking the top two spaces the dragon occupied.  If the heroes attacked the bottom two spaces, they could only move the dragon back one row (provided they wanted to move the dragon up).

 

So while yes they could move the dragon a considerable amount, they can only do that if they target the right spot.  They don't get to shrink it from any space they want, only from the spot the dragon was hit from.

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Ok, now i understood the importance of that sentence. It makes it bit more stable, but still think it should be rather sliding not moving.

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I don't think a crosbow is more affective against a dragon than a goblin. The creature is still only moved one space regardless of what the large creatures orientation before or after the move.

This is only the case if the movement is in the direction towards where the rest of the monster was. e.g. If you shoot a dragon in the face and make it move forward, it moves a lot more than if you make it move backward.

 

 

The net result is that while many Overlords take large monsters for their movement flexibility and blocking ability, they need to adjust their tactics if the party has something that can move creatures.

 

Lots of people think "OMG! That's so overpowered" ("That" not referring to anything in particular) until they realize that it has a counter. But once that counter comes into play, there's often counter-counters that can be brought to bear, and the cycle continues. Example: Large Monsters are countered easily by forced movement which is less effective against lots of small creatures packed together which is countered by blast which is less effective against spread out ranged creatures. And that's just one chain. 

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