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Davor

What do you really want X-wing to be?

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It's a fun game. I didn't expect it to be anything like games workshop. I think thats the wrong view. FFG made a fine game that combined their best methods 1. Board, 2. Cards. It's pretty clear that its not (100%) so much "tabletop mini wargaming". Very obvious in fact. If its not what you think it should then there are alternative games. 

My gaming group jumped into this game full steam just three weeks ago and we have or are already amassing 2-300 pt fleets and working on building a large scale table. That is as close to anything GW that I want to do in terms of gameplay. I'm tired of the overpriced (rules determining mini cost among other issues) that GW did. I like the relatively 'low cost to high playability' that X-wing provides. With X-Wing you can have a fighter group and play a standard game for $50-60 bucks or so in investment compared to GWs (last time I cared to check) $250 bucks investment to play a "standard" game not to mention the assembly and "fixing" of some models, painting, etc,etc. WAY EASIER ON THE MIND AND WALLET.

 

X-Wing is a fine start. I hope it has a long life. I like that they are adding expansions in the form of the "cinematic" big ships. I want to see more variety though which is likely a contradiction to some of what I've already said but thats just a couple more of the finer and cooler examples of fighters such as the Z-95, one or two more TIE variants, etc. But what I'd love to see would be a "third faction". Maybe some "Scum and Villainy" such as pirates, smugglers and bounty hunters. Hounds Tooth, IG-2000, etc. A Virago at some point. And thats because by and large they already have the main trilogy covered in terms of on screen fighters which makes me worried about future content. FFG says they have many things planned BUT how far? To what extent? Another year of waves? I surely don't know.

 

What do I want X-Wing to be? ALIVE years from now. Thats what.

Edited by Clan Blaster

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What do I want X-Wing to be? ALIVE years from now. Thats what.

I second that! X-Wing is, IMO, unique amongst the more popular tabletop games at this stage for several good reasons.

Firstly, the game is balanced! Sure, there is some 'no brainer' combinations (Tycho and PTL, etc), but in my limited experience you can bring what you like to the table and still have fun. You can choose how to play without exposing yourself to a thrashing. There is no 'unkillable' combo, and that is the most important thing in a game like this.

The second important thing that this game has is a very good 'scale of investment.' You can choose your level of commitment (both in time and money) and not be punished for this choice by those with a larger pool of resources. I look at what GW has done with 40K over the last 5-6 years and it makes me wince. I am sure I am not the only person who enjoys gaming (and has done for 2 decades) but has other commitments for their time and money which are far more important. I like that I can still pick up what I like and be able to play without having to spend a ridiculous amount of money on a model that is required to play competitively.

I hope that FFG keep the game balanced and stays true to course thus far. I would like to see a greater level of integration with the SW RPG line, but that may just be wistful thinking.

In short, I want this game to be what it is; balanced, accessible, and enjoyable.

As a post wave 1 player I just wish I could get hold of Wedge. ;-)

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I hope we can refrain from telling people what they should or should not play... My apologies if I mis-read that.

 

I wouldn't consider anything GW does as being a wargame. Maybe Warmaster, but that's it. There are just way too many stupid rules in their games, plus the army-of-the-month, plus non-stop escalation. It just doesn't do it for me. That's not the sort of thing that I want to see in X-wing. But I think it's reasonable to see rules that make sense.

 

I think FFG has done a good job limiting the escalation, but it is there. The game is predicated upon special abilities and combos. Some are better than others, and they're all costed the same (or close enough that any difference is irrelevant), regardless of their effect. These special abilities are the exact problem that GW games suffer from, which is why I urge caution with their use. It's the same problem M:TG suffers from, and their solution is to artificially limit card usage (max of 4 of a given card, banning any cards not currently in print, etc.). So it's a concern.

 

Things I'd like to see... lots of re-paints for everything (my comment in another thread about re-paints was not that they're bad, but that I think that their introduction so soon hints that we're going to be limited in how many different figs we have), figs with no cards, card packs with no figs... pilots able to use different fighters (Tycho Celchu in an A-wing?! He flew TIEs and X-wings...), a master list of all special abilities with rules for designing our own pilots (maybe there could be a small point savings for going with official pilots). 

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I hope we can refrain from telling people what they should or should not play... My apologies if I mis-read

I think I may have missed something. Which post were you referring to?

I have to say I agree with you 100% regardless. Enjoy what you like and don't be down on anyone for liking something else or something different. People should express their own view but accept others. Enjoy the game for the reasons you enjoy it.

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I wouldn't consider anything GW does as being a wargame. Maybe Warmaster, but that's it. There are just way too many stupid rules in their games, plus the army-of-the-month, plus non-stop escalation. It just doesn't do it for me. That's not the sort of thing that I want to see in X-wing. But I think it's reasonable to see rules that make sense.

 

Epic: Armageddon was a wonderful combined arms Wargame. Shame they never properly finished it. Saying that the fan community has done a good job of finishing it off.

 

I think FFG has done a good job limiting the escalation, but it is there. The game is predicated upon special abilities and combos. Some are better than others, and they're all costed the same (or close enough that any difference is irrelevant), regardless of their effect. These special abilities are the exact problem that GW games suffer from, which is why I urge caution with their use. It's the same problem M:TG suffers from, and their solution is to artificially limit card usage (max of 4 of a given card, banning any cards not currently in print, etc.). So it's a concern.

I think they should be fine, They have said that they want to do about 30 ships, at the most 3 new cards per ship (which is probably more than there will be) that is still only 90 upgrade cards, over the course of 3 or 4 years. They have far more time to test, balance and see past cards in use them than MTG who release 100 cards every 3 months with a core set of 300 odd cards every year or 2, or GW where they are pumping out a Codex with 20 or 30 models with upgrades every month.

 

One of the reasons it's so balanced is the speed they are taking the releases.. 12 ships in a couple of years compared to 40 or 50 SKUs a year for most Wargames.

 

Things I'd like to see... lots of re-paints for everything (my comment in another thread about re-paints was not that they're bad, but that I think that their introduction so soon hints that we're going to be limited in how many different figs we have), figs with no cards, card packs with no figs... pilots able to use different fighters (Tycho Celchu in an A-wing?! He flew TIEs and X-wings...), a master list of all special abilities with rules for designing our own pilots (maybe there could be a small point savings for going with official pilots).

They have said at some point they have about 30 ships planned, and that is before Rebels and the new trilogy. So I think we will see more ships coming. However the re-paints are a good way to breath fresh life into old ships and bring them up to the point they need to be at.

Edited by Rodent Mastermind

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I was not referring to anything you said, CagoDorn.

 

As DraconPyrothayan discussed in his fleet-builders thread... Character-building and improvement would have been very nice. I'm not sure how well it would fit the game as currently implemented, since improvement implies that you don't forget old skills just because you learned new ones, and the game right now allows only one skill per pilot.

 

I suppose I'm a bit odd about games. I find most of them to be lacking. I've been playing for a long time, have a large collection, and have played many more. I'm happy enough when I can find one that's good enough. Even when I do, I sometimes design my own anyway. We all do what we do for fun. For me, game design is fun.

Edited by Hawkeye88

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X-Wing is a fine start. I hope it has a long life. I like that they are adding expansions in the form of the "cinematic" big ships. I want to see more variety though which is likely a contradiction to some of what I've already said but thats just a couple more of the finer and cooler examples of fighters such as the Z-95, one or two more TIE variants, etc. But what I'd love to see would be a "third faction". Maybe some "Scum and Villainy" such as pirates, smugglers and bounty hunters. Hounds Tooth, IG-2000, etc. A Virago at some point. And thats because by and large they already have the main trilogy covered in terms of on screen fighters which makes me worried about future content. FFG says they have many things planned BUT how far? To what extent? Another year of waves? I surely don't know.

 

 

Between the new Rebels cartoon, the sequel trilogy, and the vast expanse of EU they can dig through, FFG is not lacking for content to be made. Add in the various repaints and/or ship enhancer expansions they can do, there will be plenty of life in this game.

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I want my xwing to be fun, balanced, accessible, and affordable; pretty much in that order with the 3rd relying both on the 2nd and fourth.

 

There are no "unbeatable" lists, dice have some variance but not nearly as much as many other games, and skill really matters to differentiate games/lists.

 

I'm an experienced player and was playing a semi competitive list against my friends 8yr old with Vader and even though I won in the end he had fun with the "characters" and even with rudimentary piloting skills and a little help from me remembering options, was able to keep Vader alive and attacking for 4 rounds.  It's that kind of play balance, fun, and accessibility that really makes this game different and POPULAR

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They have said at some point they have about 30 ships planned, and that is before Rebels and the new trilogy. So I think we will see more ships coming. However the re-paints are a good way to breath fresh life into old ships and bring them up to the point they need to be at.

 

Is that 30 include the current releases? 

 

 

 

Between the new Rebels cartoon, the sequel trilogy, and the vast expanse of EU they can dig through, FFG is not lacking for content to be made. Add in the various repaints and/or ship enhancer expansions they can do, there will be plenty of life in this game.

 

Logically I understand the scope of what is potentially available. Rodent Mastermind said they have 30 ships planned. If true that would delineate some sort of cut off point and likely not too in depth into the EU and since the Rebels toon is in 2014 I'm thinking anything "new" from that source isn't likely to coincide with X-Wings plans too soon and most likely have not been as of yet. Granted they can plan quite a bit. Right now I believe the most important releases in terms of seeing how the future of the game will shape up to be will have been the release of the HWK-290 and the future release of the Aces pack.

 

The question is then when did they state the 30 ships? Does that include the, what, dozen already on the market? If so, that is another year and a half or so, if not, then that is 2-3 years. 

There is also the question of what the market will bear and in light of what will fit into the game. I personally believe that people would have no problem buying, essentially, the same ships in terms of rules function if for nothing more than flavor. Stats in single digits generally leaning toward the less than 5 range tend to not promote a great variation. But then again maybe its too soon to say. I will likely endlessly speculate but I cannot, in good mind, declare what we will see. I think FFG has the best idea obviously. But in the end I don't believe even they know what will be produced so far into the future. The cinematic big ships necessitating being approved by the licensor is one such minutiae among many.  :)

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Stats in single digits generally leaning toward the less than 5 range tend to not promote a great variation.

That's true, but they have so far done a pretty good job of adding in pilots that are interesting while staying in the somewhat limted values they've built the game around.

The Imperial Aces pilots for example are all quite different and interesting.

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That's true, but they have so far done a pretty good job of adding in pilots that are interesting while staying in the somewhat limted values they've built the game around.

The Imperial Aces pilots for example are all quite different and interesting.

 

 

 

Thats true and will remain so for quite a while. But with anything, there will be diminishing variation strictly speaking.

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That's true, but they have so far done a pretty good job of adding in pilots that are interesting while staying in the somewhat limted values they've built the game around.

The Imperial Aces pilots for example are all quite different and interesting.

 

Thats true and will remain so for quite a while. But with anything, there will be diminishing variation strictly speaking.

Insert purple and black dice comments... Here

I could also see a few different ship base sizes. 2 small bases side by side for a wide base and therefore enhanced arc (kwing and Arc 170) or the same set up just long; the hawk would have been good for this.

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I really wish to see the 'outstrider' from the shadows of the empire nintendo 64 game...that would be amazing. For me this would help make X-wing a campaign fought across the universe. Without the big names like han and luke. So I can get a story with a couple joe-blows and one guy in a medium/hvy ship. A small group of rebels are doing their best, well away from the main characters they are helping. I know you can do that now but theres no way I could ever field the falcon without knowing han was in it =P

 

I also feel pritty sorry for imperial players who have a limited look to their models. But that would be realistic for a mass produced super power fighter. Each to their own ;)

 

-Muz

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Honestly.  I want the game to be fun, not about three or four specific lists that dominate all, like in some other games.  Part of the fun is just throwing some stuff together and playing with friends or a playgroup, and bringing new folks into the game. 

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I just have to say how much I love this game. Not only is it Star Wars, but it is REALLY fun to play.

Not to bag on GW, but I used to love their games (and I spent a lot of money on it) but with their recent price increases (most recent that is) and X-wing I really think it may be possible that I never play GW again.

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Since the game seems to have very good tournament support, I'd like to see more support for casual playing, even roleplaying to some extent. I'd like to see linked missions and campaigns, and a greater variety of tokens to use as obstacles and objectives, to give us good-looking stuff to use when creating our own missions.

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I hope we can refrain from telling people what they should or should not play... My apologies if I mis-read that.

 

I wouldn't consider anything GW does as being a wargame. Maybe Warmaster, but that's it. There are just way too many stupid rules in their games, plus the army-of-the-month, plus non-stop escalation. It just doesn't do it for me. That's not the sort of thing that I want to see in X-wing. But I think it's reasonable to see rules that make sense.

 

I think FFG has done a good job limiting the escalation, but it is there. The game is predicated upon special abilities and combos. Some are better than others, and they're all costed the same (or close enough that any difference is irrelevant), regardless of their effect. These special abilities are the exact problem that GW games suffer from, which is why I urge caution with their use. It's the same problem M:TG suffers from, and their solution is to artificially limit card usage (max of 4 of a given card, banning any cards not currently in print, etc.). So it's a concern.

 

Things I'd like to see... lots of re-paints for everything (my comment in another thread about re-paints was not that they're bad, but that I think that their introduction so soon hints that we're going to be limited in how many different figs we have), figs with no cards, card packs with no figs... pilots able to use different fighters (Tycho Celchu in an A-wing?! He flew TIEs and X-wings...), a master list of all special abilities with rules for designing our own pilots (maybe there could be a small point savings for going with official pilots).

 

Not to not pick...but to nitpick he flew an A-wing during the Battle of Endor.

Edited by WarLax

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