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pearldrum1

Starting a game with no tactical marines or devastators.

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What problems will I encounter with this? Should I open my game to more players to fill the gap?

 

I have a Black Templar psyker (I know, I know), a Space Wolf Assault Marine, an Ultramarine TechMarine who exhibits all the traits of a natural leader, a normal human cross over from DH Ascension, and an Daughters of Death (custom female chapter) Apothecary.

 

Edit: Words is hard.

Edited by pearldrum1

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Tacmarines...kinda suck, imo. Jacks of all trades, masters of none, which has never been my interest point in a game but to each his own. They can plug holes pretty well. They're OK but not necessary in a game the way they are in the fluff, ESPECIALLY not after everyone can buy the Forging the Bond Talent and benefit from other Chapters' Squad Modes (albeit at higher cost, but Cohesion is laughably easy to stockpile to absurd levels under the RAW).

 

Devastators are a little different, I consider them pretty important especially as they are the most effective Specialty to deal with Hordes. It will probably be easier to overwhelm a party lacking a Devastator with hordes than without, and hordes above Magnitude 20 get exponentially deadlier with every +10 Magnitude, such that they need an effective PC counter. That being said, psykers are an excellent horde counter, and anyone can bring along a heavy flamer or heavy bolter. And properly-built assault marines can chew through hordes too, but they'll be at higher risk since horde melee attacks cannot be dodged/parried (unless you're a Tyrannic War Veteran).

Really you have your most important specialties: Apothecary (to keep everyone alive, and even decent at in-combat healing too) and Techmarine (for all the special technical stuff that most Astartes can't learn early on). Both of them are still efficient deathdealers too! 

 

As to your mortal character: DW and Ascension do not play well together, in part because of mortal squishiness, in part because a mortal skillmoney will remove any skill-related challenge that might actually frustrate an Astarte, in part because Ascension is not a well-designed game addition. And part of this is speaking from experience of having a Desperado in my Deathwatch game for awhile, not just general Ascension-hate. Also remember this guy cannot benefit from Squad Modes AT ALL, which will decrease his survivability even more.

Edited by Kshatriya
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OK, so they will either adapt to deal with hordes early on via psyker or someone will bring a heavy bolter to the party. That is fine. I may still let another player join as tac or devastator depending on difficulty.

 

The human ascension character will be an odd test run. The player running him is co-GMing the game with me. So, if they die, they die. Oh well. They can either join in later as another Astartes or not. It shouldnt be a big deal.

 

Awesome advice, thanks.

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As noted, you can cover the lack of a devastator easily.

A backpack ammo supply full of metal storm shells and a heavy bolter is available to and useable by anyone.

Crowd control problems solved...

 

To be honest, five players is probably enough. Plus, a force of mostly specialists requires an intelligent approach to tactics - which in turn will help stop the Ascension player being too overwhelmed.

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What's a Black Librarian Psyker?

 

Also we have a group that has no devastator marine, it consist of an Ultramarine Tactical Tyrannic war Veteran, and two Salamanders, one a apothecary the other a tech marine, both are armed with heavy flamers and both have cleanse and purify and one of the flamers is the special Salamander type, so we are kinda covered when it comes to hordes. even our Ultramarine is coming to enjoy the smell of promethium in the morning.

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That should have read Black Templar Psyker (Librarian).

 

And that sounds wonderful. In their intel briefings, if they haven`t gotten the picture, NPCs may make suggestions to bring horde-friendly firepower. I am a sweetheart GM like that.

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That should have read Black Templar Psyker (Librarian).

So I'm really curious as to why you decided to allow this, and which powers you gave it, and how you changed the Chapter's philosophy to account for it.

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For the love of Sigismund, change it to a Red Scorpion Librarian, they're just as puritanical and worship the Emperor as a god, please please, I'm not sleeping tonight if you don't. sob

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Hahaha, I didn`t mean to give anyone a stroke.

 

He had a really good backstory and his roleplaying is awesome. A lot of self-hate and weariness to use his newfound talents. A lot of Inquisitorial eyes on him, and basically is on a suicide vigil to `right` his `wrong.` It is really fun.

 

We are homebrewing `chapter` powers for him. And now we may start pulling from the Red Scorpions. Do they have chapter powers listed in a supplemental?

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That should have read Black Templar Psyker (Librarian).

So I'm really curious as to why you decided to allow this, and which powers you gave it, and how you changed the Chapter's philosophy to account for it.

 

 

We didn`t have to. He developed his powers after years of service during a battle against psykers on Geonide. It was the only thing that allowed him to save his squad. Rather than kill him on the spot, knowledge of his abilities were harshly repressed and he was immediately sent to the Deathwatch to atone for this. His character is the epitome of a rich roleplaying experience. That is the only reason I allowed it. The interactions and RPing are worth the canon-sodomization.

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phew, so is he a blackshield with black templar modes and no longer able to return to his chapter because of his shame and sin?

 

Red Scorpions are in Honour the Chapter pgs 34-36

 

Also what will happen when the Primarchs Curse kicks in, he'll be going against 10000 years of conditioning just trying to stop himself committing suicide.

Edited by Brother Anselm

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Yeah, that is going to be hillarious. Again, just more self hate and projecting his own inward emotionally problems outward on fellow psykers. I am sure he will be even more reluctant to use his powers, and yadda yadda. No black shield. We wanted other players to see his Black Templar shoulder pauldron, and then witness him use his powers and delight in their respective responses.

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I would be very careful, A Black Templar Librarian is a fairly powerful combination, Bonuses to both WS and WP can only increase his effectiveness with his force weapon, add in his Chapter modes and he becomes very very dangerous to psykers and demons. Too much so in my opinion

 

I've read the new fluff about Black Templars losing their psyker abilities in the past and maybe regaining them again in the future, its a bit of a cop out as far as i'm concerned. God knows why it was written.

 

But as your player has said, your games not canon, so anything goes, still I would hope any Black Templar he meets in the Deathwatch will go ape-**** and attempt to remove his head, I know mine would.

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I've read the new fluff about Black Templars losing their psyker abilities in the past and maybe regaining them again in the future, its a bit of a cop out as far as i'm concerned. God knows why it was written.

 

Ughghgh they changed that for some reason? Just ugh. WARD

 

Look it's entirely possible that the BTs HAVE recruited an Aspirant who later manifests psychic powers. It's just that...then they probably kill them because Abhor the Witch. They wouldn't pick an already-psychic boy to undergo implantation...they'd either call for a Black Ship or (more likely) just kill him. They don't have Chapter psychic powers, period, not because they couldn't if they didn't want to or couldn't probably learn the genetic psychic stuff in Dorn's genome, but because it's not part of their Chapter culture. As for existing Marines who exhibit the talent, I like pearl's idea of sending them into exile to regain their honor in glorious death.

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I've read the new fluff about Black Templars losing their psyker abilities in the past and maybe regaining them again in the future, its a bit of a cop out as far as i'm concerned. God knows why it was written.

 

Ughghgh they changed that for some reason? Just ugh. WARD

 

Look it's entirely possible that the BTs HAVE recruited an Aspirant who later manifests psychic powers. It's just that...then they probably kill them because Abhor the Witch. They wouldn't pick an already-psychic boy to undergo implantation...they'd either call for a Black Ship or (more likely) just kill him. They don't have Chapter psychic powers, period, not because they couldn't if they didn't want to or couldn't probably learn the genetic psychic stuff in Dorn's genome, but because it's not part of their Chapter culture. As for existing Marines who exhibit the talent, I like pearl's idea of sending them into exile to regain their honor in glorious death.

 

 

Yeah, I agree. It is really the only way I could make it work in my head. Essentially, Gunter was one of the baddest mother fukkers in the Chapter. He had no clue he was psychically attuned. So, when the heretical sorcerers were putting damage on his squad, and essentially wiping them out, the Emperor spoke to him and the psychic backlash killed the enemy and saved what was left of his team. Of course, the team didn`t know it came from Gunter. So, when he got back he had to confess. I mean, a stoic templar of his calibre would not hide that. The Chapter Master/Chaplain/insert anyone here who would help ease the process for you/ took pity on him and sent him to the Deathwatch for an indeterminate amount of time. He will regain his honor in the face of insurmountable odds. He will return to the Black Templars on his shield or not at all.

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UPDATE: We got a Dev. Still no Tac Marine, but I am alright with that. The final tally is 5 Marines (Librarian, Tech, Assault, Dev, Apothecary) and one Ascension Level Human. I hope it makes for some really good interactions and more reactions to situations that immediately opening fire.

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I am not sure. I just sent a text to find out.

 

The Ascension PC is being run by a friend who is essentially `co-running` this game with me. As we are on opposite sides of the world, this will allow play to progress a little faster and more smoothly. I know the PC`s backstory - an ex penal legionairre recruited by Ordo Hereticus Inquisitor as part of his retinue - but more than that, I couldn`t tell you.

 

He has history with DH but none with Deathwatch, so he wanted to bring his character over. We both have no illusions as to how squishy his PC is in contrast to the rest of the Astartes, so he won`t be charging any horde front lines. He will be a nice in-between for normal humans and the Astartes and hopefully will produce some really good RP experiences/encounters.

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i'm just saying if he's a Vindicare or a Primaris Psyker...well, those 2 careers are considered stupid broken, as in nothing else in the book can come close to matching them except maybe Inquisitor. This is because of DH's bad psychic system (mostly fixed in subsequent games) and the Vindicare's ability to dodge everything. The other bad thing about Ascension is how Influence obviates normal Social skills, but also just doesn't work as-written, at all.

 

A Guardsman can go into, I think...Stormtrooper (which is neat but the gear it gets falls really flat at the Ascension level of play, let alone keeping competitive in a Deathwatch game; I would suggest beefing this up with better weapons available cheap for the character), Inquisitor (can be psychic, just have a lot of institutional power but not really broken per se) or Vindicare (just flat broken because of its dodging power).

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Hmm, well he isn`t a psyker at all, I don`t believe.

 

By allowing him access to cheaper weapons, do you mean the weapons listed in the Deathwatch CRB or the weapons listed in DH Ascension?

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