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Lee418

A question or two...

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Q1) When Gloria Goldberg uses her Psychic Sensitivity skill to draw a second OW encounter card, does the second card's colour have to match the first card? Or is any colour ok as long as it is one that is stipulated by the OW's encounter symbols? The wording of Gloria's skill is a little ambiguous and could be interpreted either way.

 

Example: Gloria has an encounter in R'lyeh and draws a Red card from the OW deck. Does the second card have to be Red also? Or would a Yellow card be ok?

 

Q2) The Upkeep Phase is split into three steps:

a. Refresh Exausted Cards.

b. Perform Upkeep Actions.

c. Adjust Skills.

 

Some spells state that they may be cast during Upkeep. Do such such spells have to be cast during step b? Or can they be cast after step c?

 

What I'm basically asking here is can you adjust an investigators Lore skill and then cast an Upkeep phase spell?

 

 

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Lee418,

 

     Let me answer them by the FAQ...

 

     A1)  Gloria will draw and read a card which matches any color designated by the Other World through which she's traveling at this time.

 

     A2)  According the rules, you will cast Spells during b.), which means you're actually basing this Turn's Lore/Spell roll based on where you affixed your slider last round (Variant: I DO NOT subscribe to this rule and instead conclude any and all Upkeep Phase Actions in the order decided upon by the player ~ this corresponds to how you want to resolve Spells).

 

Cheers,

Joe

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Thanks Joe.  

 

So the answers were in the FAQ? Doh! My bad. :rolleyes:  Believe it or not I've already been through that thing a couple of times already. Remembering it on top of the core rules is the trick though. ;)

 

1) Got it. Thanks. That's how I've been playing Gloria so far anyway.

 

2) Hmmm..... I got that one wrong then. :unsure:  I agree it does seem a bit odd. But rules are rules I suppose. I can live with that.   

Edited by Lee418
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Aye, Joe's right, and I'm with him on this one, id est I totally ignore the normal a) b) c) order of Upkeep actions and I usually do a) c) b). Mythos strike in the last phase of the previous round, so when investigators start they should already know what happened and adjust their skills to counter-react. Additionally, I don't like the idea of "ok, let's cast this spell and then see what should I do this turn"... )

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I make it harder for myself and play exactly by the rules, so no slider adjustment before performing Upkeep actions! That way you have to always think 1 turn ahead.

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Hmmm, I'm a stickler for that rule and it often puts me in tight spots that put the screws on my strategy. It also felt to me like ignoring it was like ignoring phases and letting each investigator resolve their entire turn fully. I've always been giving consideration to one turn ahead as well as the current turn, and that's always been a huge element of my strategy and my appreciation for high focus. So now I'm curious - how much do you think of focus, is it important at all to you in evaluating the utility of investigators or do you mostly ignore it? How often do you fall back on the more "bendy" focus? So often, that rule is like binding cuffs on my plan, forcing me to reconsider what I can do.

Edited by dj2.0
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:laughter: I see what you mean Dj, but for me ignoring phases was like living in total anarchy, while changing a small point in the sequence of things you do during the Upkeep is simply a different way of seeing something. Agreed, I could play considering this and this will force me to reconsider a little some point in my strategy, but I believe it's not much a big deal, there aren't many things that require you to pass a Skill Check during the Upkeep (Voice of Ra maybe it's the more significant, but still, even having that spell doesn't imply it's used more than 2 or 3 times / game).

 

As for the Focus: sure, it's important. Low focus investigators force you to plan 2 or 3 turns in advance and sometimes force you to chance strategy / reconsider your actions, I totally agree with you on this point :)

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Hmmm, I'm a stickler for that rule and it often puts me in tight spots that put the screws on my strategy. It also felt to me like ignoring it was like ignoring phases and letting each investigator resolve their entire turn fully. I've always been giving consideration to one turn ahead as well as the current turn, and that's always been a huge element of my strategy and my appreciation for high focus. So now I'm curious - how much do you think of focus, is it important at all to you in evaluating the utility of investigators or do you mostly ignore it? How often do you fall back on the more "bendy" focus? So often, that rule is like binding cuffs on my plan, forcing me to reconsider what I can do.

 

What do you consider to be the "bendy" focus? The before-upkeep-actions slider adjustment?

 

Focus is really important to me, loads of times I have been forced into a bad/unwanted situation because the investigator couldn't adjust in time his sliders to overcome some obstacle (rolling to close a gate, pumping Speed to reach a monster and free the way for someone but ALSO needing to pump Will or risk going insane etc etc). Focus certainly binds me too, so the more focus, the better. No wonder Wilson always rocks.

But maybe it has something to do with his Shotgun, too :D

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Yes, strictly by the rules focus is the last thing to change in Upkeep, so I have always included what I want to achieve next turn in my use of focus 1 investigators who have Upkeep skill checks to perform. I've had to make significant sacrifices that way. Often it makes casting spells in Upkeep risky.

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dj2.0,

 

     I can't disagree with you on any of your points, and I too certainly value the use of Focus in my games.  However, the "1" Focus Investigators are already at a disadvantage, so I'm not willing to make the situation more difficult by NOT allowing them a better chance of doing something this round, for a slightly better chance of doing something during the next turn.  Overall, the Phases and the elements of the game weave a great tale and by-and-large, the mechanics stand up to most scrutiny.

 

Cheers,

Joe

Edited by The Professor
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Off the top of my head, Arcane Insight, Third Eye, Bless, Summon Beast Within, Revelation of Script, Azure Flame, Greater Banishment, Voice of Ra, Alchemical Process, Yellow Mist, Feeding the Mind, Cloud Memory and Forced Learning, are all spells which Focus 1 investigators have trouble with because they are Upkeep rituals.

Agreed its not a big deal, at all, its a nuance, but a significant one.

Edited by dj2.0
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Yes, correct, there are a few, and some are quite useful. But still, not so sure the number of times this has an impact on a game is really significant. 1 Focus characters could benefit from anticipating the c) step only in a limited way because they can gain only 1 die. Most of the advantage could be derived from investigators having greater focus, because they can gain a major number of dice in no time, but still, I don't think this is particularly relevant for the way I play (rarely use Arcane Insight, and even more rarely I use Alchemical Process). Additionally, the odds of gaining that particular spell in the turn immediately before you need to cast it are quite negligible, so even playing b) and then c), it's just a thing more to remember during the Upkeep of the previous turn, so, you can accept to have lower Luck for that turn. Really, I do not believe this to be altering the general balance of any game, but I agree with you that playing in this way generates an alteration in the theoretical flux of events

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Another question..... (which I've probably missed the explanation to. :lol: )

 

Under normal circumstances an Investigator my enter a Location, trade items with another Investigator in that location, and then move back out of the location.

 

But what if the Location contains an open Gate? Can an investigator enter that location, trade (with another Investigator standing on an explored marker) and leave. Or must they immediately stop moving and be sucked through the gate during Arkham Encounters?  

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Investigators are only sucked through a gate if they are standing in the same space as a gate when it's their turn during the Arkham Encounters phase and they do not have an explored marker. So, yes, you can enter the space with an open gate (and investigator), trade, and move back out of the space.

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Exactly. And this is quite an important point in the strategy to win certain games. You can toss one of your buddies returned to Arkham an Elder Sign, or a Clue Generating item so that he can actually gather resources for sealing even after exploring the OW. Clearly not something you can rely every time, but it's a good option if you enter a gate without enough clues, or if you lose some of them while travelling in the OW.

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So, yes, you can enter the space with an open gate (and investigator), trade, and move back out of the space.

 

Thanks Tox. :)

 

This situation actually occured in my last game. Mandy was at the Witch House with a gate + explored marker and Vincent Lee was at the Silver Twilight Lodge. I wanted to off load one of Vincent's weapons but suddenly stopped in my tracks when I thought about the gate and it's 'possible' effect on movement. I couldn't find anything in the rules or FAQ, so I elected to play it safe and parked Vincent in the French Hill streets.

 

Oh well. :rolleyes:    

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Julia,

 

     I just finished an epic game this weekend ~ it's the last of my Variant Playtest Games.  Let me tell you, Alchemical Process contributed significantly to the game...and how it ended.  This will be my longest, most involved Session Report...Ever!

 

Ciao/Cheers,

Joe

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Yes, correct, there are a few, and some are quite useful. But still, not so sure the number of times this has an impact on a game is really significant. 1 Focus characters could benefit from anticipating the c) step only in a limited way because they can gain only 1 die. Most of the advantage could be derived from investigators having greater focus, because they can gain a major number of dice in no time, but still, I don't think this is particularly relevant for the way I play (rarely use Arcane Insight, and even more rarely I use Alchemical Process). Additionally, the odds of gaining that particular spell in the turn immediately before you need to cast it are quite negligible, so even playing b) and then c), it's just a thing more to remember during the Upkeep of the previous turn, so, you can accept to have lower Luck for that turn. Really, I do not believe this to be altering the general balance of any game, but I agree with you that playing in this way generates an alteration in the theoretical flux of events

Interesting points, but they raise several more interesting ones here! Firstly, adding a single die to a roll is often a good boost in my games. I am much more secure rolling 2 than 1, and way more confident with 3 rather than 2, so the benefit is incremental. I probably won't roll that 1 die unless I have no choice. 2 on the other hand I can work with. So in that case, the adjustment of one stop can make it viable for me to cast the spell. And by memory that often works out as important, the spell being needed.

We must have quite different games because there are always upkeep spells turning up here :-) and its frequently an issue for me even with 2 focus investigators to get them to stretch the way i want because I have to refocus at the end of upkeep. Plus, the spells often fall on focus 1 guys, and make using them difficult :-)

Edited by dj2.0

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A few more questions....

 

1) At the start of the game Silas Marsh can spend 2 movement points to move to any aquatic location. Does this include Y'ha-nthlei? I assume the answer is no, but want to be sure all the same. 

 

2) When it moves the Hound Of Tindalos moves toward the nearest investigator inside a location. But is the Hound's special form of movement effected by expansion boards? For example: Could a Hound of Tindalos located in Dunwich move to Arkham if there were no investigators inside Dunwich locations? Or is a Hound that spawns on an expansion board confined to that board for the rest of the game?

 

3) I'm just seeking opinions with this final one. Does the use of the special LatT gates have to be a one-or-the-other binary choice? The LatT rules sheet says that the new gates replace the old gates. But would it be possible to play with both sets of gates? Does anyone actually do this?

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Hi Lee!

 

1) Nope. Y'ha-nthlei can be entered only from Devil Reef or when returning from an OW. It's specified "regardless of other game effects", and Silas's special ability is "just another game effect". Please note that there is nothing forbidding him to swim away from Y'ha-trallallà

 

2) Hounds of Tindalos can take buses and trains. Please refer to this entry in the Official Answer from Kevin Wilson pinned thread:

 

Hounds of Tindalos (12/11/06)
Hounds of Tindalos should move between Arkham and Dunwich, yes. If there's no one in Dunwich and a Hound there moves, it should jump to the investigator in a location nearest the Train Station. (And as with Flying monsters, if that makes it exceed the monster limit, it instead goes to the Outskirts).

 

3) I do play with both sets of gates in. I like the idea of having more possible combinations popping up (4 R'lyeh gates? Yeah, I'm in!). The only thing that changes is that it's more difficult that you end the game by having an empty gate stack when instructed to draw a new gate, but, really, this is a minor issue (never ever come close to depleting the stack)

 

Hope this helps!

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Thanks Julia. :)

 

re.1) That's ok then. So Silas can move directly to Devil Reef, stay for an encounter, and then move on to Y'ha-nthlei during the next turn. That's how I figured it worked, so I'm happy with that.

 

re.2) Great. That's one problem solved. But does that same answer apply to Hounds in Innsmouth as well?

Dunwich and Arkham are linked by depot Locations, and the Hound moves between locations. But the depot in Innsmouth is in a street area. Does that make a difference? Sorry if this sounds like a silly question. :rolleyes:

 

re.3) I was hoping you were going to say you used both. I will give it a try at some point now that I know it can be done.

The 'empty gate stack rule' has crossed my mind too, but I don't think it's a problem. To me it seems very similar to the 'empty monster cup rule.' But that rule is diluted as soon as you add expansion board monsters.

 

There is one remaining issue though. The illustrations on the back of the two sorts gate markers are different. Does it matter if you know beforehand whether the next gate is a 'standard' or 'Lurker' gate?

Maybe a gate cup could be a solution to that problem?

Edited by Lee418

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Yes, you figured out the Devil Reef - Yha'nthlei sequence correctly.

 

As for the depot questions, it really doesn't matter if it's a real location or a street area. It's the same for Kingsport (street area as well). There are some speculations about the "what if an investigator is in Y'hanthlei vs The Witch House with a Hound of Tindalos starting in Innsmouth". Some say core Arkham has precedence over Devil Reef + Y'ha-nthlei, some others say to play it literally. Not so sure this was FAQed somewhere, it has been a while since I dived into the FAQ extensively. But definitely the street depots can be used by the Hounds.

 

Finally, as for the gates, I do use a gate cup (a plush pumpkin that once was used to contain sweets). I like the idea of not knowing what gates is on the bottom of the stack, plus in this way some bad gates can return sooner.

Edited by Julia
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Finally, as for the gates, I do use a gate cup (a plouche pumpkin that once was used to contain sweets). I like the idea of not knowing what gates is on the bottom of the stack, plus in this way some bad gates can return sooner.

 

Bad gates can return sooner...... I hadn't thought of that. But the same is also true of easy gates too I suppose.

 

Either way I think I might set aside gate trophies that have been sold. If the stack is ever depleted (unlikely) I can put them back in the cup. The main reason I want to mix the Lurker gates with the standard gates is for variety. I don't want to run the risk of drawing the same gates again and again.

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Clearly, bad gates can return sooner as easy gates. As for setting them aside after having them sold somewhere in Arkham... could clearly work. Dunno. I put them back in the cup simply because I do the same with sold monster trophies, but clearly, rules instruct you to put the gate to the bottom of the stack, so that your idea is certainly more consistent with the rules. In any case, playing with both sets is certainly possible

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