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azato

My Biggest Complaint with the Game.

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Fantasy Flight, I get the not making a PDF available....I really do. But if you are not going to give us a searchable PDF, PLEASE....PLEASE...PLEASE make a more complete index.  The one given in the book is completely unacceptable...to the point of usually being useless. While a more complete index in the book would be nice, I would be fine with a pdf copy of just an index. That would make the lives of GMs much, much easier.

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Fantasy Flight, I get the not making a PDF available....I really do. But if you are not going to give us a searchable PDF, PLEASE....PLEASE...PLEASE make a more complete index.  The one given in the book is completely unacceptable...to the point of usually being useless. While a more complete index in the book would be nice, I would be fine with a pdf copy of just an index. That would make the lives of GMs much, much easier.

 

Bah! You kids these days with your "Indexes". Back in my day, the first edition D6 game barely had a table of contents! Now get off my lawn!

 

/em Rocking Chair

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Fantasy Flight, I get the not making a PDF available....I really do. But if you are not going to give us a searchable PDF, PLEASE....PLEASE...PLEASE make a more complete index.  The one given in the book is completely unacceptable...to the point of usually being useless. While a more complete index in the book would be nice, I would be fine with a pdf copy of just an index. That would make the lives of GMs much, much easier.

 

Bah! You kids these days with your "Indexes". Back in my day, the first edition D6 game barely had a table of contents! Now get off my lawn!

 

/em Rocking Chair

 

 

I come from the Hero System....so perhaps my expectation is exceedingly high.

 

It came to a head when I tried to look up "ambush". I couldn't find it. I cannot find it by flipping though the book. I know I read it SOMEWHERE but I cannot figure out where...and still can't.

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I'm sure they would of liked to make PDFs more money for them but Disney said no.

Make your own index on a piece of paper, I know it sucks but works for us.

Anytime we have to look something up we note it down with the page #

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Fantasy Flight, I get the not making a PDF available....I really do. But if you are not going to give us a searchable PDF, PLEASE....PLEASE...PLEASE make a more complete index.  The one given in the book is completely unacceptable...to the point of usually being useless. While a more complete index in the book would be nice, I would be fine with a pdf copy of just an index. That would make the lives of GMs much, much easier.

 

Bah! You kids these days with your "Indexes". Back in my day, the first edition D6 game barely had a table of contents! Now get off my lawn!

 

/em Rocking Chair

 

 

I second that. Spoiled "kids"! :lol:

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Honestly, I don't think it was Disney that shot it down. If I remember correctly, LucasArts required a special license for ANY digital game, including pdf releases of RPGs, making it horribly cost prohibitive for any company, even WotC, to bother with it.

 

A better index would be helpful at times, but honestly, I resorted to large index cards with notes, making my own GM screen with my own index of necessary rules, and small post-it flags for things.

 

Like Desslok and NicoDavout, I third the "Spoiled Kids!" comment, as most RPGs really don't have a good index (and sometimes even lack a table of contents), often enough to make the librarian in me cringe.

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The index is pretty cruddy.  I've gone to look up quite a few things, and not found them in the index.  The most recent I can think of was trying t find where it had recommended exp rewards for a session.  I looked under exp, under rewards, it's just not there.  There have been quite a few other things.

 

I'm both a veteran of the old WEG Star Wars, and a big player of Hero System, so I've done both extremes, and I have come to really value a good index.

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I think the index is adequate but then again I have an excellent memory which assists.

 

Also SAGA ed missed out indexes in a few of their books so I've got used to relying on fan created indexes. Far more useful having an excel spreadsheet with everything in it.

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Sir, the possibility of successfully using a role playing game index is approximately three thousand, seven hundred and twenty to one.

Never tell me the odds!!! :D

 

On a more serious note, I've gotten used to lack of useful indexes sadly enough.  Though if you think EotE's is bad, the one in Cubicle 7's One Ring books bordered on utterly useless, to the point that they had to put out a free PDF for download to replace the in-book indexes, which was far more comprehensive and had the right page references.

 

Then again, I'm generally pretty good about at least having a pretty solid idea where to start looking when it comes to finding things in various books, particularly the core rulebooks.

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Sir, the possibility of successfully using a role playing game index is approximately three thousand, seven hundred and twenty to one.

 

I noticed the index was kinda weak as well, maybe we should come up with our own open source one.

This quote just made my week.

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Also SAGA ed missed out indexes in a few of their books so I've got used to relying on fan created indexes. Far more useful having an excel spreadsheet with everything in it.

I was going to say this as well. I want to recall there were even a few without a table of contents, but maybe I'm wrong.

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Fantasy Flight, I get the not making a PDF available....I really do. But if you are not going to give us a searchable PDF, PLEASE....PLEASE...PLEASE make a more complete index.  The one given in the book is completely unacceptable...to the point of usually being useless. While a more complete index in the book would be nice, I would be fine with a pdf copy of just an index. That would make the lives of GMs much, much easier.

 

Bah! You kids these days with your "Indexes". Back in my day, the first edition D6 game barely had a table of contents! Now get off my lawn!

 

/em Rocking Chair

 

 

Yeah, what is with all these spoiled young whipper snappers with their "PDFs" and "Indexes" and fancy schmancy dice that come with the numbers precolored instead of having to fill them in with a crayon!

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Is there a reasonable way to do a crowd sourced index?

Yeah quite easily actually... open a Google Doc to an Excel document... start listing words in one column and pages in the other. When it is completely finished (Thousands of rows), you can drop it into Word and format it nicely with columns, and then PDF your release :)

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Heh....I am no young whipper snapper...and I filled in my dnd dice, back in the day, with crayon....going back to around '79. But I have neither the time nor the brain power to find misc. stuff in these rule books. It takes me long enough just to come up with an adventure every two weeks.  :)​ 

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Heh....I am no young whipper snapper...and I filled in my dnd dice, back in the day, with crayon....going back to around '79. But I have neither the time nor the brain power to find misc. stuff in these rule books. It takes me long enough just to come up with an adventure every two weeks.  :)​ 

I agree...a really good index is invaluable.

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Heh....I am no young whipper snapper...and I filled in my dnd dice, back in the day, with crayon....going back to around '79. But I have neither the time nor the brain power to find misc. stuff in these rule books. It takes me long enough just to come up with an adventure every two weeks.  :)​ 

I agree...a really good index is invaluable.

 

There is an advantage to a community-generated index.  It gets updated to cover all of the books as they get released, so you don't have to look through *multiple* indices to find what you're looking for.  No publisher in their right mind would include a cumulative index in their printed books.  The page-count involved simply makes that a no-go scenario for them.

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Heh....I am no young whipper snapper...and I filled in my dnd dice, back in the day, with crayon....going back to around '79. But I have neither the time nor the brain power to find misc. stuff in these rule books. It takes me long enough just to come up with an adventure every two weeks.  :)​ 

I agree...a really good index is invaluable.

 

There is an advantage to a community-generated index.  It gets updated to cover all of the books as they get released, so you don't have to look through *multiple* indices to find what you're looking for.  No publisher in their right mind would include a cumulative index in their printed books.  The page-count involved simply makes that a no-go scenario for them.

 

 

I didn't read the entire thread so didn't previously see the suggestion of a community generated index. I do think it is an awesome idea!

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Heh....I am no young whipper snapper...and I filled in my dnd dice, back in the day, with crayon....going back to around '79. But I have neither the time nor the brain power to find misc. stuff in these rule books. It takes me long enough just to come up with an adventure every two weeks.  :)​ 

I agree...a really good index is invaluable.

 

There is an advantage to a community-generated index.  It gets updated to cover all of the books as they get released, so you don't have to look through *multiple* indices to find what you're looking for.  No publisher in their right mind would include a cumulative index in their printed books.  The page-count involved simply makes that a no-go scenario for them.

 

 

The other problem with indexes (or so I am told) is that they are very labor intensive and therefore adds to the cost of producing a book. And with products with small margins, this could be very cost prohibitive. I think PDFs, in general, have solved this problem...except in cases where there are no PDFs.

 

Edit - Also given the increased cost, publishers may think that only a small percentage of their customers even care...and therefore choose not to put money where they don't feel the "need" to.

Edited by azato

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