Tome of Decay / Rot / Generally Not Looking Very Healthy

[51powerski 2]

Whatever the book is called, please give those on the Path to Glory some love and announce already!

 

Previews would be nice too.

 

Thanks! 

[BrotharTearer 21]

Yeah, like that'd work.

[Keffisch 2,642]

Now a preview would be nice..

[Amroth 149]

Yeah I wrote to FFG asking about when a tome for Nurgle might be looking to come out and got this response...... not promising.....

 

Dear Steve,

 

Thanks for your question! However, we don't have anything announced called Tome for Nurgle. Any new and upcoming products will be found on our News and Upcoming page when they are ready to be announced. So I have no way of confirming or denying if this is something that we will ever make for Black Crusade. Take care!

**** *****

Fantasy Flight Games Customer Service Team

customerservice@fantasyflightgames.com

[BrianDavion 18]

that's not exactly a big suprise though.

 

as it wont be tome of nurgle. and any offical announcement of future BC stuff will be on the page and if it's not announced they can't say anything.

 

so really this is just a buncha corperate speak for "I can't say"

[Amroth 149]

Well that's okay then.

 

I called it the Tome for Nurgle because we don't know the name yet and I thought that would be self-explanatory.

 

I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

 

It will be good to have one tome for each of the Gods.

[Magnus Grendel 11,679]

"I can't say"

 

Pah! Lodge medal or it doesn't count.

 

I'm guessing either Tome of Plague, Tome of Decay or Tome of Despair. But yeah, would be nice to know when it's likely to pop up.

 

Based on previous performance (which has been good) I am surprised it's not been announced.

That said, I'm taking the supposed release date of last May for the Tome of Excess with a pinch of salt as it's taken me months to actually get a copy.

Edited September 4, 2013 by Magnus Grendel

[51powerski 2]

Well ofc this thread was firmly tongue in cheek and I wasn't expecting an official response.

 

Kinda dissapointed at the apparent lack of love for the line though.  From my unscientific casting of my eyes over the various 40k forums I guess this line does appear to have the least players. 

 

Maybe that's just my bias though, as of all the lines it's the one I'm personally most interested in. 

 

I was really expecting some info on the Nurgle book by now though.  Does make me wonder though if there will be anything forthcoming after the Nurgle book. 

[Amroth 149]

I'm wondering the same and have to admit that this is my favourite line too, it's the most out there and coolest line.

I hope they do at least keep going until the Nurgle book, then even if there is nothing else after that this game will still an immense work out from me well into the future regardless.

[ronaldo1 0]

Good try!

Whatever the book is called, please give those on the Path to Glory some love and announce already!

 

Previews would be nice too.

 

Thanks! 

[Theofonias 9]

I think that a nod to Planescape's Tome of Pestilential Thought would be a great title

[BrianDavion 18]

anyone else got a mild fear that with DH 2.0 coming out FFG's going to let the "old edition" lie fallow, even when they need "just one more book"?

[Amroth 149]

I hope not especially considering they are only updating DH to bring it closer to lines like BC and OW. BC doesn't need upgrading so they should keep going with the updates.

[bogi_khaosa 267]

I hope not especially considering they are only updating DH to bring it closer to lines like BC and OW. BC doesn't need upgrading so they should keep going with the updates.

 

As far as I understand things, the new DH system is very very different from the BC/OW rules.

[Fgdsfg 1,017]

I hope not especially considering they are only updating DH to bring it closer to lines like BC and OW. BC doesn't need upgrading so they should keep going with the updates.

That's not at all what they're doing, and I have no idea where you heard it.

DH2 isn't getting updated to conform with newer rulesets of the overall WH40kRP system - it's a completely new system, with no relation, crossover or compatibility to the original systems other than on a purely superficial level.

anyone else got a mild fear that with DH 2.0 coming out FFG's going to let the "old edition" lie fallow, even when they need "just one more book"?

It's a very valid fear, and I wouldn't call it "mild". That said, I don't think FFG would be boneheaded enough to let their older systems drop before releasing the supplements that have practically been promised already.

At the very least, I expect to see the current projects finished before they drop the old lines like a bad habit.

[Morangias 465]

I believe the currently announced state of affairs (i.e. DH is entering new edition with completely new mechanics, other lines will be continued as they are right now) is just a way for FFG to keep all bases covered as much as they can.

 

If DH2 sells, they will consequently "update" all the lines to the new system. Most likely one after another, to keep the facade: "Yes, Rogue Trader enters second edition, but other old lines will be continued!" So on, so forth, until all that's left is 2e.

 

If, for some reason, DH2 tanks, the way is still open for them to backpedal on the change by maintaining support for other "old" games, maybe trying a yet different system at some point as either DH3 or second edition of whatever other line.

 

I do not believe they're honestly trying to maintain two distinct systems under the same brand longer than the marketing experts deem absolutely necessary.

[Fgdsfg 1,017]

I believe the currently announced state of affairs (i.e. DH is entering new edition with completely new mechanics, other lines will be continued as they are right now) is just a way for FFG to keep all bases covered as much as they can.

 

[...]

 

I do not believe they're honestly trying to maintain two distinct systems under the same brand longer than the marketing experts deem absolutely necessary.

Absolutely. Which is a pity, because it means that they won't support the other lines more than they absolutely have to before the "new" systems hit.

That said, it could be a while before they take the final decision to start working on other settings than Dark Heresy.

Edited September 8, 2013 by Fgdsfg

[Morangias 465]

 

I believe the currently announced state of affairs (i.e. DH is entering new edition with completely new mechanics, other lines will be continued as they are right now) is just a way for FFG to keep all bases covered as much as they can.

 

[...]

 

I do not believe they're honestly trying to maintain two distinct systems under the same brand longer than the marketing experts deem absolutely necessary.

Absolutely. Which is a pity, because it means that they won't support the other lines more than they absolutely have to before the "new" systems hit.

Yeah, especially since it's quite likely the "old" games will take a hit in sales simply because people will anticipate them being discontinued soon. They really have all the incentives to push the new system at all cost, With the limited pool of talent behind all the games, it's much more reasonable to divert as much of it to DH2 as logistically convenient.

 

 

That said, it could be a while before they take the final decision to start working on other settings than Dark Heresy.

Unless the aforementioned scenario happens and people stop buying other lines in anticipation of their update to the new rules, I don't foresee them rushing too much to announce the jump for other games. Undoubtedly, DH2 will serve as proving grounds to many different ideas, with forum feedback and rules questions shaping the future of the entire 40k RPG line long after the beta is officially closed.

 

That's of course assuming they plan to keep to the same publishing structure with 2e as they did with 1e, with each new game being basically a reprint of the same ruleset with revisions factored in and content adjusted to better match the game's focus. Alternately, they could take it in one of two directions:

 

1. There will only be DH2, but future supplements will feature all that's needed to ultimately recreate the play experience from different lines under the new ruleset (kinda the reverse of what happened with Only War in development).

 

2. Each line will be a truly distinct game, with system built from the ground up to perfectly match the themes and moods of the particular facet of the 40k universe the game's supposed to represent.

[MKX 248]

 

DH2 isn't getting updated to conform with newer rulesets of the overall WH40kRP system - it's a completely new system, with no relation, crossover or compatibility to the original systems other than on a purely superficial level.

 

 

Kind of nuts IMO. One of the biggest reasons I've kept buying the odd book is simply for its 'fairly close' (some minimal modifications usually) cross-compatability for equipment, character, story and NPC ideas. I can have a BC chaos marine pry a boltgun out of the cold dead hands of the deathwatch setting or DH acolytes hiding undercover in an OW regiment. As a GM it's kind of fun taking a pinch from each setting Iike to mix them up as I see fit and want to set a scene... so I'm not really interested in DH2. Like a lot of players & GM's from that first generation era, we tended over the now many years to have modified and buffed off the edges off the original DH game (and RT to some extend) with more open OW or BC rules sets anyway to fix the stuff that's busted and horrible.

 

Back on the Nurgle topic. It'd be a shame if it wasn't released to make up the set, don't get enough Nurgle players and that aspect of chaos was always just so fantastically grotesque that it was a great counterpoint to angry retards covered in blood, crazy stoned hookers covered in...something and sneaky meglomaniac sorcerers trying to be more clever than they actually are and just end up being bastards.

Plus in the past, anything where PC's had to deal with nurgle contagions it had an interesting impact on their character behaviour for those game sessions ranging from 'fairly disturbed' to 'nuke it from orbit and get out of here!'

Edited September 10, 2013 by MKX

[Blood Pact 14]

That was an early argument against the way Exalted 3rd edition has been going. Namely how they're largely dumping the whole mechanics in favour of new ones.

 

But they made a good point. While it makes porting over older specialties (or whatever) very hard, it also means that the flaws and mistakes inherent to the old system are removed.

 

Since at the end of the days, the system is supposed to more or less work without everyone having to houserule everything to fix all the problems that have been discovered over the years.

 

 

 

I also love how it's set in an all new Sector, meaning we don't have to suffer through paying for piles of reprinted fluff. While there is nothing stopping them from eventually releasing a book, or two, that details mechanics of things from the Calixis sector.

[Fgdsfg 1,017]

DH2 isn't getting updated to conform with newer rulesets of the overall WH40kRP system - it's a completely new system, with no relation, crossover or compatibility to the original systems other than on a purely superficial level.

 

Kind of nuts IMO. One of the biggest reasons I've kept buying the odd book is simply for its 'fairly close' (some minimal modifications usually) cross-compatability for equipment, character, story and NPC ideas. I can have a BC chaos marine pry a boltgun out of the cold dead hands of the deathwatch setting or DH acolytes hiding undercover in an OW regiment. As a GM it's kind of fun taking a pinch from each setting Iike to mix them up as I see fit and want to set a scene... so I'm not really interested in DH2. Like a lot of players & GM's from that first generation era, we tended over the now many years to have modified and buffed off the edges off the original DH game (and RT to some extend) with more open OW or BC rules sets anyway to fix the stuff that's busted and horrible.

Oh, no doubt. I think it's completely nuts too, I'm just laying it out as it is. Honestly, I think it's a terrible direction to take things, but if that's what they want to do, I regrettably can't stop them.

On one hand, I like Fantasy Flight Games and (in general) I like their products, so I hope it's a rousing success.

On the other hand, I really hope that DH2 just flat-out tanks, crashes and burns.

 

Back on the Nurgle topic. It'd be a shame if it wasn't released to make up the set, don't get enough Nurgle players and that aspect of chaos was always just so fantastically grotesque that it was a great counterpoint to angry retards covered in blood, crazy stoned hookers covered in...something and sneaky meglomaniac sorcerers trying to be more clever than they actually are and just end up being bastards.

Plus in the past, anything where PC's had to deal with nurgle contagions it had an interesting impact on their character behaviour for those game sessions ranging from 'fairly disturbed' to 'nuke it from orbit and get out of here!'

Agreed.

While there are many interesting facets of the other gods that tends to be ignored, which I find infuriating (Such as: Khorne and his focus on martial prowess and honour, rather than psychotic rage; Tzeentch as a god of hope, changing the fates of those that were handed bum cards in life, rather than just megalomaniac mutative wizardry; Slaanesh as a god of excess, perfection and expertise, rather than just blackjack, hookers and drugs), I've always found Nurgle to be the most interesting, because the idea of him being this caring Grandfather amongst the chaos gods, genuinely (well.. arguable) caring about his underlings and Chosen, imbuing them with immunity to the diseases he fills them with and giving a truly supernatural toughness and fortitude to them, has never been "lost" as 40k has developed.

I think the idea of Nurgle as a god of life will be completely lost, though, since modern fluff tends to put an emphasis on the opposite, with nurgle zombies and whatnot. But he truly is, and although a god of decay, that decay is just straight-up teeming with life, although not always (ever?) pleasant life.

Even in the case of subtlety, I prefer Nurgle over Tzeentch, which is a sad state of affairs brought about by the shallowness of Tzeentchite fluff (and mechanics) these days. Tzeentch should be the schemer, but I always end up thinking of Nurgle when I want that hidden cult that is spreading disease or plotting to open a daemonic portal in secret, or when I want to visualize the idea of slowly creeping heresy, like mold and rust crawling up the spires after slowly engulfing the underhives in widespread plagues of unbelief.

 

[...]

 

But they made a good point. While it makes porting over older specialties (or whatever) very hard, it also means that the flaws and mistakes inherent to the old system are removed.

 

 [...]

While there's an argument to be made that that is the purpose of any new edition - fixing flaws and mistakes inherent to the preceding system - I don't really see that. I'm not seeing anything that DH2 fixed that wasn't already fixable within the boundries of the previous system.

I see lots of things changed, yes, but none that specifically fixes some pre-existing system error, especially without introducing new problems intrinsic to the new system. If DH2 was objectively better than the previous ruleset(s) used in the original system, under the assumption of iterative evolution (i.e. each new edition/ruleset of the overarching system, of which the latest is Only War, being increasingly refined), DH2 would have real merit, and would no doubt be more readily embraced.

But I'm just not seeing that.

There are things that *might* be considered better (such as the Action Point system), but ultimately, that's a matter of taste in most (if not all) cases. But that doesn't mean that it solved an intrinsic problem with the preceding system.

Edited September 11, 2013 by Fgdsfg

[Morangias 465]

On one hand, I like Fantasy Flight Games and (in general) I like their products, so I hope it's a rousing success.

On the other hand, I really hope that DH2 just flat-out tanks, crashes and burns.

Yeah, this is really infuriating. I both want DH2 to fail so utterly that FFG has no option but to cut their losses and keep working on other lines, and I hate myself for wishing such a horrible thing on the genuinely nice people behind the project.

[MKX 248]

I dunno if I'd want to wish them poorly, don't think the margins on things like a published RPG game in this day and age (along with the GW licence costs) are exactly huge and a few big hits to the bottom line might see it into the red, then we'd get nothing for anything.

 

For some background, contemporary Nurgle, (the old WH-Fantasy is more or less the 'classic' as I like to remember it) I'd recommend the Imperial Armour 5, 6 & 7 Siege of Vraks if you haven't had a chance to read them. While it doesn't revolve around Nurgle forces entirely, they do play a fairly large role and for what its worth and I personally thought 5 & 6 where actually some of the best written 40K material around for fluff and stories.

 

(Be prepared to lose a large chunk of wallet unless you can get them on ebay or steal them from friends)

Edited September 11, 2013 by MKX

[Theofonias 9]

I really enjoy the WH40k line that they have.  I avoid their Fantasy and Star Wars games like the play because they use "special dice".  I don't know why it bothers me like it does, perhaps it's because their Fantasy dice was out of stock for so long that people on Amazon were selling them for $60+, but when I see that a game requires dice that is not easily purchasable then I lose interest.  I hope they don't do that to DH2 and the subsequent rule systems.  If they do, they've lost themselves a guy who has bought every book in the 40k series, Dark Heresy through Deathwatch.

[Morangias 465]

Since this topic has devolved in that direction already, and since there may be people here who don't follow the beta, I think it may be relevant to note that FFG made a decision to revise DH2 into something that's backwards compatible.