Jump to content
OggDude

Another Character Generator

Recommended Posts

 

 

I'm still getting the crash when adding a new vehicle to a saved character. I thought this might of been from my old imported characters, but even when I make a new character, save it, and come back to it later, adding a new vehicle causes a crash.

 

See the end of this message for details on invoking

just-in-time (JIT) debugging instead of this dialog box.

************** Exception Text **************

System.ArgumentOutOfRangeException: Index was out of range. Must be non-negative and less than the size of the collection.

Parameter name: index

   at System.ThrowHelper.ThrowArgumentOutOfRangeException()

   at System.Collections.Generic.List`1.set_Item(Int32 index, T value)

   at SWCharGen.CharRigger.NewCharVehicle(CharVehicle cveh)

   at SWCharGen.Form1.vehEdit_VehiclesUpdated(Object sender, CharVehicle veh)

   at SWCharGen.EditVehicle.btnVehNew_Click(Object sender, EventArgs e)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.OnClick(EventArgs e)

   at SWCharGen.ImageButton.OnClick(EventArgs e)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WmMouseUp(Message& m, MouseButtons button, Int32 clicks)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WndProc(Message& m)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.OnMessage(Message& m)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.WndProc(Message& m)

   at System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)

I checked the code and the NewCharVehicle method has no code in it now :)  It wasn't needed with a change I made to the last version.  So I have no idea how you could be getting an error in it, when all it does is return.  Is anyone else having this issue with 1.4.4.1?

 

I have been getting the same error on 2 different machines.

 

Yeah, sorry, that's going to be taken care of in the next release.  I thought it was in the previous one.  I've been sick for the past week and my brain isn't working so good :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

Our group is having quite a few new crashes recently, but we'll wait and see how it goes next update. Some crashes are harder to diagnose than others, especially when they happen in unpredictable fashions.

 

The one "regular" crash we have is when more than one person uses the CharGen or saves a file that's used by the CharGen (like a DataEditor entry being modified), since we are all on the same DropBox, the person saving tends to crash the other users of the Editor. It's a very minor inconvenience, since we only use the editor at the same time during games, and our workaround consists in printing pdfs instead of constantly using the CharGen.

I eliminated a majority of those, but if it's still happening, let me know which app is doing the crashing, what that app was doing, and what you did on the other app to cause the crash.  I can hopefully replicate it.

 

Once again, I've been sick and I'm not remembering some of the stuff I've been doing.  I have, in fact, fixed a potential bug that only happens when more than one app is accessing the same data:

 

  • If the GM Tools and the generator were open at the same time, there was a possibility that the generator would get an exception after the character was saved.  This should no longer happen.
 
This is probably your issue and it will be fixed in the next release.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm not sure if this is a bug or maybe something I did and don't remember, but...

 

In the Data Editor, in Signature Abilities, it has "Narrow Escape" and "Unmatched Fortune" listed as AddedItem.
I might have done something to these (I have been adding a lot of data recently), but I don't recall touching either of these yet.  It's nothing major or even bothersome, just something I noticed (and might be linked to other things).

 

 

Also, as I was adding data, I noticed a few entries that have the wrong page numbers.  Is this something you would like us to bring to your attention? (there weren't too many - maybe three or so in the 200+ entries I've edited so far)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks guys.  Took out the custom tag for the two signature abilities, and removed the second Second Chances after replacing it with the first one for a few specializations.

 

And if you do see incorrect page numbers, let me know and I'll correct them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

I'm still getting the crash when adding a new vehicle to a saved character. I thought this might of been from my old imported characters, but even when I make a new character, save it, and come back to it later, adding a new vehicle causes a crash.

 

See the end of this message for details on invoking

just-in-time (JIT) debugging instead of this dialog box.

************** Exception Text **************

System.ArgumentOutOfRangeException: Index was out of range. Must be non-negative and less than the size of the collection.

Parameter name: index

   at System.ThrowHelper.ThrowArgumentOutOfRangeException()

   at System.Collections.Generic.List`1.set_Item(Int32 index, T value)

   at SWCharGen.CharRigger.NewCharVehicle(CharVehicle cveh)

   at SWCharGen.Form1.vehEdit_VehiclesUpdated(Object sender, CharVehicle veh)

   at SWCharGen.EditVehicle.btnVehNew_Click(Object sender, EventArgs e)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.OnClick(EventArgs e)

   at SWCharGen.ImageButton.OnClick(EventArgs e)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WmMouseUp(Message& m, MouseButtons button, Int32 clicks)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WndProc(Message& m)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.OnMessage(Message& m)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.WndProc(Message& m)

   at System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)

I checked the code and the NewCharVehicle method has no code in it now :)  It wasn't needed with a change I made to the last version.  So I have no idea how you could be getting an error in it, when all it does is return.  Is anyone else having this issue with 1.4.4.1?

 

With  characters, that created with old version I have similar crash too. With new characters vehicle adds as normal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

I'm still getting the crash when adding a new vehicle to a saved character. I thought this might of been from my old imported characters, but even when I make a new character, save it, and come back to it later, adding a new vehicle causes a crash.

 

See the end of this message for details on invoking

just-in-time (JIT) debugging instead of this dialog box.

************** Exception Text **************

System.ArgumentOutOfRangeException: Index was out of range. Must be non-negative and less than the size of the collection.

Parameter name: index

   at System.ThrowHelper.ThrowArgumentOutOfRangeException()

   at System.Collections.Generic.List`1.set_Item(Int32 index, T value)

   at SWCharGen.CharRigger.NewCharVehicle(CharVehicle cveh)

   at SWCharGen.Form1.vehEdit_VehiclesUpdated(Object sender, CharVehicle veh)

   at SWCharGen.EditVehicle.btnVehNew_Click(Object sender, EventArgs e)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.OnClick(EventArgs e)

   at SWCharGen.ImageButton.OnClick(EventArgs e)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WmMouseUp(Message& m, MouseButtons button, Int32 clicks)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WndProc(Message& m)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.OnMessage(Message& m)

   at System.Windows.Forms.Control.ControlNativeWindow.WndProc(Message& m)

   at System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)

I checked the code and the NewCharVehicle method has no code in it now :)  It wasn't needed with a change I made to the last version.  So I have no idea how you could be getting an error in it, when all it does is return.  Is anyone else having this issue with 1.4.4.1?

 

With  characters, that created with old version I have similar crash too. With new characters vehicle adds as normal.

 

Ignore what I said, it'll be taken care of in the next release.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Something I've been thinking about doing is creating a "summary" character sheet.  This sort of sheet would be appropriate for one-shot pre-gens (for convention play, for instance), or maybe starting players who may get overwhelmed by the regular character sheet.  I'd like to get some feedback on what you guys might like in something like this.

 

First off, I'd like to make it a single page, but that limits the information you can put on it.  So obviously, not everything will show up.  So, what would you want on it?  Here's what I've come up with so far:

  • Condensed characteristics/attributes/picture on top, with name, species, and career/primary specialization.
  • Skills, maybe just career skills and skills that have ranks.
  • Weapons, something like a cross between shown weapons as they appear at the bottom of the regular sheet, and the format used for the beginner game characters.  Only weapons marked as shown would appear here.
  • A social section with a summary of obligation (max 2), duty (max 2), and morality, plus the character's story.
  • Talent summary (with a max number listed)
  • General gear, with just name, count, and any special feature.
  • Armor, or not.  Maybe just have it part of gear with a soak/def indicator.

This doesn't necessarily need to be a hand-holding sheet, with everything spelled out (e.g., "You deal 6 damage, plus 1 additional damage for every [sUC]"), or does it?  My goal here, really, is to make the generator useful for people running one-shot games at conventions.  In general, GM's seem to prefer simple and condensed pre-gen sheets, and tend to go for just a single sheet.  This can be impossible for campaign characters with lots of XP, but for starting pre-gens, it's doable.

 

If anyone has any ideas about this, or even if it's worth doing, or if I'm looking at the problem wrong, please let me know.  Out-of-box thinking is always welcome :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As you probably noticed at the Megagame ( :)) we've used a modified version of the Beginner's Box sheet for our convention game.  We used to print out longer sheets for earlier games, but found that for convention players, they really want to be able to see everything about a character on a single side of a single sheet, so it's easy to pick up who's who.  A few thoughts I had from when I designed the (totally not automated) sheet I used.

 

When it comes to how "hand holding" the sheet should be, I'd make it very user friendly for anything that isn't the base system rules.  So condensed skills & weapons, "how to use" on Talents and Odd Gear.

 

1) A full skill list takes up a lot of room, unlike a dynamic listing of modified skills, particularly as the majority of characters (particularly for one-offs) are unlikely to have a large percentage of the skills.  It also makes it easier to see what a character does well, because that's what's listed.  A full skill list does, however, have the advantage of a static size.

 

2) If you do Talents, I would love to have the ability to select what talents show.  It's really unnecessary and can be confusing to show things like Grit or Toughness that just factor in to stats or skill rolls.  In addition, Ranked talents can easily be condensed, as can regular/improved/supreme talents.  Some complex rules that are not talents would be nice to put in similarly, like how to do a Treat Injury check. (with surgeon pre-factored in)

 

3) May not need to know what the armor does mechanically, just the armor's name in the soak box would be cool, so a player would quickly know what their character looks like.

 

Anyway, if this comes to be, I'd love to use it.

 

Edit: Example sheet from my last con game

Edited by Quicksilver

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As you probably noticed at the Megagame ( :)) we've used a modified version of the Beginner's Box sheet for our convention game.  We used to print out longer sheets for earlier games, but found that for convention players, they really want to be able to see everything about a character on a single side of a single sheet, so it's easy to pick up who's who.  A few thoughts I had from when I designed the (totally not automated) sheet I used.

 

When it comes to how "hand holding" the sheet should be, I'd make it very user friendly for anything that isn't the base system rules.  So condensed skills & weapons, "how to use" on Talents and Odd Gear.

 

1) A full skill list takes up a lot of room, unlike a dynamic listing of modified skills, particularly as the majority of characters (particularly for one-offs) are unlikely to have a large percentage of the skills.  It also makes it easier to see what a character does well, because that's what's listed.  A full skill list does, however, have the advantage of a static size.

 

2) If you do Talents, I would love to have the ability to select what talents show.  It's really unnecessary and can be confusing to show things like Grit or Toughness that just factor in to stats or skill rolls.  In addition, Ranked talents can easily be condensed, as can regular/improved/supreme talents.  Some complex rules that are not talents would be nice to put in similarly, like how to do a Treat Injury check. (with surgeon pre-factored in)

 

3) May not need to know what the armor does mechanically, just the armor's name in the soak box would be cool, so a player would quickly know what their character looks like.

 

Anyway, if this comes to be, I'd love to use it.

 

Edit: Example sheet from my last con game

Awesome, exactly the feedback I was looking for.

 

So, a few of my assumptions were correct, then.  A single sheet is preferable to multiple sheets.  Hand-holding, when appropriate, is a good thing.  And just career/ranked skills is good so the player knows immediately what he's good at.

 

Selectable talents is also a good idea.  In fact, I'm now thinking that this would be a good addition to GM Tools where you can customize the layout, something like how I do stat blocks, but for characters instead.  You could choose which talents, obligations, etc., to show, and possibly even add your own descriptions for things.  I know Force Powers can actually be rather difficult to read when you lay out all of the powers and upgrades separately.  There's just no easy way to combine the basic power with, say, strength and range upgrades.  Also, the ability to save layouts on a per-PC basis would be a good idea.

 

I'm also thinking that I may be looking at this wrong and instead of creating a pre-gen sheet for existing PCs, maybe have a special class of character called a PreGen that you create just for this sheet.  You could do an import from regular PC, of course, but have a more simplified creation tool, like for adversaries.

 

Or... maybe use adversaries for pre-gens and just expand the stat block concept to a full sheet.  How does that sound?

 

At this point, I could go in any direction with this.  My goal is to make creation of pre-gen characters for one-shot adventures as easy and as useful to GM's as possible.  So keep the ideas flowing :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Awesome idea !

 

My suggestions may be less apparently geared towards convention play and more towards, say, general GM usage, but here goes in case some of it applies to Convention sheets:

 

First off, I think there is a need for a hybrid between the full-feature character sheet and the NPC stat blocks. I've noticed that, especially for some Adversaries, the simple stat blocks can become monumental either vertically (image file) or span so long in the encounter sheet that it crashes (it especially happens with force users like Inquisitors). I think there is a way to create something that could be appropriate for both a easy-to-read tutorial and act as a middle-ground between a character sheet and a stat block, while being useful for GMs and even players (I'm thinking those who reprint their character sheets frequently and don't want to waste too much paper doing so).

 

This idea doesn't involve much space taken for the "tutorial" elements, which often require special layout + quite a bit of text. I'd say, on the top of my head: minimalist layout is useful. I'd go for a two-page concept. Page one is everything you need to see, page 2 is everything you need for reference purposes. This way, someone can print it both sides, recto verso, of a single sheet of paper.

 

Page one is where all the action goes, like you said, you want only the skills with ranks or special talents or uses covered. The information needs to be as little redundant as possible to save space. For instance, if you have chosen to "show" a Vibrosword, then the Melee skill appears (whether you have ranks or not), but you don't also show it alongside the other skills. This would apply to Combat Skills mostly.

 

I'd definately group skills some way, maybe vertically under the Characteristics? Maybe according to the theme (Social / Technical / Exploration / Criminal / Knowledge)? Social is pretty self-explanatory. Technical is Medicine, Astrogation, Mechanics, Computer. Exploration includes Survival, Athletics, Coordination, Perception, Vigilance, Resilience, Piloting, etc. Criminal could be Skulduggery, Stealth, Streetwise, etc. Knowledge is tricky, since you could also group them into the other themes. All I'm saying is that alphabetical order might not be the easiest to navigate when you're at a Convention and glancing at a new system. Is there an "Intimidate" skill? Look up letter "i". Oh it's under "c", Coercion. And even as a GM preparing quick printouts, alphabetical may not be the easiest classification.

 

Of course, all the elements we expect to find on a "first page" are there: Defense, Soak, Critical Injury boxes, WT, ST, and Morality/Duty/Obligation (totals only). I'd keep the ranks in Parry/Reflect on the first page, next to Soak, if any, and perhaps add any Dodge/Body Guard/Side Step/Defensive Stance (or the likes) next to Defense, since you tend to add the setback dice at the same time you need to adjust the combat check for Dodge and remind of your use of Defensive Stance/Side Step/Body Guard (even if that last one applies to allies, it's thematically linked, might as well put it there or somewhere with other "Allies" abilities).

 

I'd be tempted to list active talents on the first page as well as some of the "Passive" ones that you often need to remember you even have. So stuff like Durable (next to the Critical Injury boxes?), Heightened Awareness (in an "Allies" tab?) or Stimpack Specialization is good to be reminded about, but not Enduring, Toughened or Grit, since it's already shown elsewhere. Stuff like Sense Advantage or Master of Shadows is, obviously, very useful on the first page. It's sorting out which "Passive talents" to show that's tricky, and where to put them on the sheet if not in the "Talents" list.

 

I'd treat species features as Talents (like droids not needing to sleep or breathe) or Weapons (like transdoshan claws) or as Skill ranks (incl. the setback removal, boost dice, upgrades, etc.)

 

The number of talents to show would be difficult to manage, even after removing from view the redundant ones. I'd treat Force powers like active talents, which is what seems to be almost the norm visually. Both together may be visually overwhelming and hard to fit on one page. I'd use a relatively small font on all those.

 

Lastly, like you said, the Weapons/Tab/Box bar is very good. I'd really cram as much of the talents related to weapons in it if you intend it for Conventions, like you did with Deadly Accuracy ("bracketed damage numbers are for the first hit only").

 

On page two, which would be the back of the page, I'd use a relatively small font, narrow margins and just cram everything in orderly fashion with page references presented like "Edge of the Empire Core, p.37", or "E-CRB, p.37". But that may be too "data intensive", requiring a reference code for each rulebook, plus a page number entry?

 

It's debatable if page two is really a necessity, but I think it is still useful in emergency. That's where all the class skill table, listed talents, Obligation/Duty/Morality boxes, equipment list with credit cost and encumbrance tally, species features, etc. would be grouped by type. It's also seems like the least complicated page to program, I feel, since it's very compatible with the CharGen Editor/GM Tools as is.

 

Despite the second page not meant to be as visually appealing as the first (small font, more lists), I still wouldn't put too much stuff that would be redundant. For example, since it's not meant to be a full fledged character sheet, there is no need to have a full table detail why Brawn 5 was obtained with Cybernetics, a Strength enhancement on the armor, and 30xp at CharGen, though the armor should definitely be listed as providing the feature (in case the character doesn't wear it), and a parenthesis saying "Brawn +1" would be sufficient in the equipment list for the Cybernetic. Also, no need to list the careers or specializations, or explain which Specialization gave a career proficiency with Gunnery. So the second page, despite being a "list fest"  meant for reference purpose, remains very much like an Adversary description, providing minimum details in a "snapshot of a character" manner.

 

I hope those suggestions might spark ideas!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

New release!  This is really the shake-down release after 1.4.4 where I changed things enough to cause weird problems elsewhere.  It should take care of most of those problems, at least the ones that others or myself have noticed.  I also added a few enhancements as well.  Enjoy, at least in about 20 minutes or so :)

 

Release 1.4.5.0
 
New/Changed Data:
 
  • The Jury Rigged "attachment" for weapons now supports an option to require one less advantage to activate an active quality.
  • Fixed Retrofitted Hangar Bay to cost 2 hard points.
  • "Narrow Escape" and "Unmatched Fortune" still had their custom tag from the editor.  Those have been removed, so they no longer show up as "Added Item".
  • Removed an extra "Second Chances" talent and replaced its use in Hotshot with the remaining version of the talent.
 
New Features/Enhancements:
 
  • Cybernetic Weapon Implant now includes an innate weapon Retractable Light Blaster Pistol, so you no longer need to add one to your inventory.
  • The routine in the Equipment pane for determining whether or not an item can have an attachment has been made more intelligent.  It now determines whether 0 HP attachments can work on an item with no hard points.  In addition, any item that can have attachments will properly display a mod count, and the Combine button will now also see if an item has attachments when figuring out whether or not they can be combined with other stacks (items with attachments cannot be combined with other like items).
 
Bug Fixes:
 
  • The generator could get an error when adding a vehicle.  This will no longer happen.
  • If the GM Tools and the generator were open at the same time, there was a possibility that the generator would get an exception after the character was saved.  This should no longer happen.
  • Accessing certain adversaries in GM Tools could cause an exception if they were saved before the innate skills feature was implemented.  This should no longer happen.
  • The Signature Vehicle functionality was broken in the last version.  This was due to some of the memory managment changes.  It should now work properly once again.
  • If a piece of equipment made a skill a career skill (such as a holocron), the skill calculator would incorrectly set non-career ranks to current ranks, which caused non-career XP to be spent.  This was because it made this check before items were applied to skills and the skill was still seen as non-career.  If a skill was set to a career skill in any other way, it would work.  It will now properly wait until after items are checked before making this change, so XP cost will be correct, and you will be able to change the Non-Career column as needed.
  • When clicking the Show Purchasable Items box in an Equipment pane when showing something other than weapons, you could get a fragment of a scrollbar showing if the displayed grid lost its scrollbar.  This was only a display issue caused by the weapon grid being slightly larger than the other two.  This should no longer happen.
  • Sorting on the price column for weapons, armor, and gear in the Equipment pane would incorrectly sort alphabetically when formatting was applied to the values.  This happened a couple of releases ago.  The price columns will now correctly sort numerically once again, and retain their new formatting as well.
  • The soak bonus for Superior armor would be applied once for each equipped armor.  It will now be added to the armor's soak when determining which soak to use for stacking purposes.  
  • On the printed character sheet, the character's story would sometimes not be displayed if it did not fit on the main social page.  It should now be displayed properly.  Made some assurances that similiar issues would not crop up in other printed sheets as well.  Again, this had to do with the memory management I added to recent releases.
  • If you created a Signature Vehicle, then changed out or removed the Rigger specialization, the Signature Vehicle attachment would remain on the vehicle until you made another change that updated the vehicle pane.  The attachment will now be properly removed as soon as the specialization is made unavailable.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd definately group skills some way ... Maybe according to the theme (Social / Technical / Exploration / Criminal / Knowledge)? ... All I'm saying is that alphabetical order might not be the easiest to navigate when you're at a Convention and glancing at a new system. Is there an "Intimidate" skill? Look up letter "i". Oh it's under "c", Coercion. And even as a GM preparing quick printouts, alphabetical may not be the easiest classification.

This.

I would like to see this even on the "regular" sheet.

I love the idea of the short sheet for one-shots, by the way.

Edited by Lifer4700

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1st PDF

https://www.dropbox.com/s/u4oqtqlhl4wst1b/Apollo%20Sol%20-%20Human%20Smuggler.pdf?dl=0

 

2nd PDF

https://www.dropbox.com/s/l8c28k0oqq156kk/Apollo%20Sol%20-%20Human%20Smuggler%20%282%29.pdf?dl=0

 

 

Ok Oggy, I think this might be a bug...

 

In the 1st PDF is my PC as I think it should be, when I added Gunslinger, I had 2xp left...After I updated the new version of software, I now have 50xp which is the 2nd PDF

 

So if this is correct then I have 50xp now that I have gunslinger because the XP that I spent in certain skills are giving me a retro refund.  If that is not the case then I have found a Bug...YAY??!!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1st PDF

https://www.dropbox.com/s/u4oqtqlhl4wst1b/Apollo%20Sol%20-%20Human%20Smuggler.pdf?dl=0

 

2nd PDF

https://www.dropbox.com/s/l8c28k0oqq156kk/Apollo%20Sol%20-%20Human%20Smuggler%20%282%29.pdf?dl=0

 

 

Ok Oggy, I think this might be a bug...

 

In the 1st PDF is my PC as I think it should be, when I added Gunslinger, I had 2xp left...After I updated the new version of software, I now have 50xp which is the 2nd PDF

 

So if this is correct then I have 50xp now that I have gunslinger because the XP that I spent in certain skills are giving me a retro refund.  If that is not the case then I have found a Bug...YAY??!!

With the fix for non-career skill, you'll need to go over the career skills you got with Gunslinger and select how many ranks you bought as non-career skills.  That'll fix the XP problem.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

1st PDF

https://www.dropbox.com/s/u4oqtqlhl4wst1b/Apollo%20Sol%20-%20Human%20Smuggler.pdf?dl=0

 

2nd PDF

https://www.dropbox.com/s/l8c28k0oqq156kk/Apollo%20Sol%20-%20Human%20Smuggler%20%282%29.pdf?dl=0

 

 

Ok Oggy, I think this might be a bug...

 

In the 1st PDF is my PC as I think it should be, when I added Gunslinger, I had 2xp left...After I updated the new version of software, I now have 50xp which is the 2nd PDF

 

So if this is correct then I have 50xp now that I have gunslinger because the XP that I spent in certain skills are giving me a retro refund.  If that is not the case then I have found a Bug...YAY??!!

With the fix for non-career skill, you'll need to go over the career skills you got with Gunslinger and select how many ranks you bought as non-career skills.  That'll fix the XP problem.

 

 

So I have to find the Skills that Gunslinger gave me and say how many I Ranks I bought in Pilot for the points to level out?  That seems confusing.   I did it and it worked, but is there a way that can be changed?   I know for some of the careers that some skills overlap, like in Gunslinger/Smugg. Pilot there is overlap.

 

**EDIT**

Yeah, I do not get how that worked?

 

I get w/ GS (Coercion, Cool, Knowl Outer Rim, & Ranged Lt)  I only put ranks into Ranged Lt and that was out of my career when I took Pilot.  How does adding GS add 50xp???

Edited by Lancer999

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a similar problem to Lancer999.

 

My character has had 5xp suddenly appear.  On closer examination, it looks like I'm being charged only 5xp for a second rank in a career skill I selected on creation.

 

Is this a bug or do the freebies not count (in which case I need pointing to the rule)?

 

I think this might have come in with the changes in 1.4.4

 

Also, is there a way of adding HP when an Artisan makes intuitive improvements?  I was thinking of making a custom item in the GM section...

 

Will

 

P.s.  Thanks Oggy! This is great.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

1st PDF

https://www.dropbox.com/s/u4oqtqlhl4wst1b/Apollo%20Sol%20-%20Human%20Smuggler.pdf?dl=0

 

2nd PDF

https://www.dropbox.com/s/l8c28k0oqq156kk/Apollo%20Sol%20-%20Human%20Smuggler%20%282%29.pdf?dl=0

 

 

Ok Oggy, I think this might be a bug...

 

In the 1st PDF is my PC as I think it should be, when I added Gunslinger, I had 2xp left...After I updated the new version of software, I now have 50xp which is the 2nd PDF

 

So if this is correct then I have 50xp now that I have gunslinger because the XP that I spent in certain skills are giving me a retro refund.  If that is not the case then I have found a Bug...YAY??!!

With the fix for non-career skill, you'll need to go over the career skills you got with Gunslinger and select how many ranks you bought as non-career skills.  That'll fix the XP problem.

 

 

So I have to find the Skills that Gunslinger gave me and say how many I Ranks I bought in Pilot for the points to level out?  That seems confusing.   I did it and it worked, but is there a way that can be changed?   I know for some of the careers that some skills overlap, like in Gunslinger/Smugg. Pilot there is overlap.

 

**EDIT**

Yeah, I do not get how that worked?

 

I get w/ GS (Coercion, Cool, Knowl Outer Rim, & Ranged Lt)  I only put ranks into Ranged Lt and that was out of my career when I took Pilot.  How does adding GS add 50xp???

 

It may have come from something else, then.  I'll look at your characters again and see what happened.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Selectable talents is also a good idea.  In fact, I'm now thinking that this would be a good addition to GM Tools where you can customize the layout, something like how I do stat blocks, but for characters instead.  You could choose which talents, obligations, etc., to show, and possibly even add your own descriptions for things.  I know Force Powers can actually be rather difficult to read when you lay out all of the powers and upgrades separately.  There's just no easy way to combine the basic power with, say, strength and range upgrades.  Also, the ability to save layouts on a per-PC basis would be a good idea.

 

So, a few of my assumptions were correct, then.  A single sheet is preferable to multiple sheets.  Hand-holding, when appropriate, is a good thing.  And just career/ranked skills is good so the player knows immediately what he's good at.

 

I really like the idea of custom layouts for sheets, particularly on a per-PC basis, thought I definitely acknowledge that it likely would be the most complex to do.  And I also agree that fewer sheets are generally better than multiple sheets, if for no other reason than to prevent killing a forest just to print up a batch of characters ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

 

1st PDF

https://www.dropbox.com/s/u4oqtqlhl4wst1b/Apollo%20Sol%20-%20Human%20Smuggler.pdf?dl=0

 

2nd PDF

https://www.dropbox.com/s/l8c28k0oqq156kk/Apollo%20Sol%20-%20Human%20Smuggler%20%282%29.pdf?dl=0

 

 

Ok Oggy, I think this might be a bug...

 

In the 1st PDF is my PC as I think it should be, when I added Gunslinger, I had 2xp left...After I updated the new version of software, I now have 50xp which is the 2nd PDF

 

So if this is correct then I have 50xp now that I have gunslinger because the XP that I spent in certain skills are giving me a retro refund.  If that is not the case then I have found a Bug...YAY??!!

With the fix for non-career skill, you'll need to go over the career skills you got with Gunslinger and select how many ranks you bought as non-career skills.  That'll fix the XP problem.

 

 

So I have to find the Skills that Gunslinger gave me and say how many I Ranks I bought in Pilot for the points to level out?  That seems confusing.   I did it and it worked, but is there a way that can be changed?   I know for some of the careers that some skills overlap, like in Gunslinger/Smugg. Pilot there is overlap.

 

**EDIT**

Yeah, I do not get how that worked?

 

I get w/ GS (Coercion, Cool, Knowl Outer Rim, & Ranged Lt)  I only put ranks into Ranged Lt and that was out of my career when I took Pilot.  How does adding GS add 50xp???

 

I tried recreating your character as best I could, and I came up with him costing 365 XP.  Now, I'm assuming with Ranged Light that you took 1 rank for free for being human, then bought 3 ranks as non-career.  I set your non-career ranks for RL to 3, which costs 15 additional XP, which is why we're 15 XP off.
 
So, the new one is correct, you just have to set your RL non-career ranks to 3 so it'll remember that you bought them for more XP.  As to why the old one was 50 XP off...  what I did was remove Stealth and Ranged Light as free human non-career skills.  I then bought rank 4 in RL at career XP (20) and bought rank 2 of Stealth at non-career XP (15).  That came out to 35 XP, which when adding the 15 XP spent for your non-career RL ranks, comes to 50 XP.  So, you had apparently not selected RL and Stealth originally as your free human non-career skill ranks.
 
At least, that's what I'm coming up with :)  It at least explains the discrepancies.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a similar problem to Lancer999.

 

My character has had 5xp suddenly appear.  On closer examination, it looks like I'm being charged only 5xp for a second rank in a career skill I selected on creation.

 

Is this a bug or do the freebies not count (in which case I need pointing to the rule)?

 

I think this might have come in with the changes in 1.4.4

 

Also, is there a way of adding HP when an Artisan makes intuitive improvements?  I was thinking of making a custom item in the GM section...

 

Will

 

P.s.  Thanks Oggy! This is great.

I'll have to see your character, and what XP changes you saw.  For the new non-career fix to work, you may have to go back over older characters and manually change the non-career ranks to the number bought before a skill became a career skill.  You do this in the skill pane (a drop-down will appear under the "Non-Career" column when appropriate).  Once you do that, the change is saved with your character and you won't have to worry about it again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Please ignore everything I just said in the last few posts :)  There was, in fact, a bug in the skill XP calculator.  This is a rather major bug, so I just uploaded a fix for it.  Like always, give it 20 minutes or so.

 

Sorry about that.  I had changed some things around when I made the non-career fix, then forgot to change the most important line back to what it was.  The result was that it would charge you XP based only on how many ranks you purchased, rather than what rank you purchased.  So if you purchased only one rank, but it was rank 4, it would still charge you 5 XP instead of 20.  Hence, the weird XP dearth that Lance was seeing.  Those purchased skill ranks add up :)

 

Anyway, it'll work properly now.  Sorry for the confusion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a new problem with the GM Tools version 1.4.5.0. Everytime I create an encounter or modify an existing one the program stops working and I get an error message. This happens as soon as I make a change to the encounters and on different computers.

 

Any ideas?

 

Thanks in advance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have a new problem with the GM Tools version 1.4.5.0. Everytime I create an encounter or modify an existing one the program stops working and I get an error message. This happens as soon as I make a change to the encounters and on different computers.

 

Any ideas?

 

Thanks in advance.

Believe it or not, that bug's been there right along :)  You're just the first person to run two copies of GM Tools at the same time to discover it!  It's been fixed and will be in the next release.  In the mean time, don't run two copies of the GM Tools at the same time, or if you do, don't edit encounters on both of them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...