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MHJFaase

Availability of items

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For me, the influence system in Second Edition needs some attention. Although the influence mechanics seem sound enough, I think it is mainly the availability values in the equipment tables need some serious rebalancing. (for an alternative to the influence system itself, see NimSim's post about influence and subtlety)

 

Here is my reasoning:

The influence system seems to be the primary mechanism by which the acolytes acquire their gear or any services they need. As such I'd expect the sytem to take care of the following points:

Firstly, gear for newly made characters. This should reflect items that the character has retained over his career before becoming an acolyte. We're talking low power level here, so lasguns, shotguns, maybe a mono sword, but probably not a chainsword and bolt pistol.

Secondly, it should provide a mechanism for acquiring gear or services during a mission (we're going to break into the heretic's stronghold and need some explosives to blow out the back door, or maybe the guardsman's flak armor got busted and needs to be replaced. Or the acolytes need to acquire the help from a couple of local enforcers.

Thirdly, it should provide a mechanism for acquiring new personal gear between missions. At starting level this should be comparable to the starting gear; at later levels the items that can be acquired should slowly get more powerful. Scaling up to the far end of the system, for newly minted inquisitors, this probably means they can get their hands on a suit of power armour and a power weapon if they invest some time in it.

At first sight, the current system seems to be inspired by the influence sytem from Ascension (pages 13-18 for those who have that book), although it has new acolytes starting somewhere around 36 influence (25+2d10), and puts newly minted inquisitors at 75 (I take this from the prerequisite for the inquisitor talent, p.66) - for the ascension system, acolytes would have been at influence 1, and newly minted inquisitors at 40. The ascension system, however, had more extensive rules for the use, gain and loss of influence.

The new system is somewhat unclear. On p.131, it is stated "To acquire an item or service, a character must make a requisition test. To do so, the character makes a test (as outlined on page 13), rolling 1d100 and comparing the result to his Influence characteristic." - there is no mention of the commerce skill, no mention of the amount of time it takes to perform the action and no consequences for failure. It does mention an effect on the groups subtlety, which is good during missions (case 2) but probably not applicable when acquiring gear between missions (case 3)

However, Commerce (p.79) states: "A character makes a Commerce (IF) test to acquire a single piece of equipment and, if successful, he finds and acquires the gear sought." it also mentions "If the test is failed, the character cannot re- attempt the test for a number of days equal to the degrees of failure suffered on the test." Still, no mention of the amount of time for the test itself, other than "part of a transaction".

For starting gear, p.59 states "An Acolyte can select a number of items up to his starting Influence bonus value from the Armoury that have an overall Availability of –10 or higher."

Now let's compare this to my 3 cases.

The first is pretty clear: a few (3 or 4, 2 if you're really unlucky.) items of availability -10 or higher. I could get a laspistol, lasgun or long-las, the non-heavy solid projectile weapons (that excludes the sniper rifle, but I don't particularly mind that), a flamer, or any low-tech weapons. The web pistol (-10) stands out, I'd expect that to be a little harder to get. But not much of an issue here.

Krak grenades seem, at first sight, a little too easy to get at -10, but it's an expendable item, so if a single krak grenade is going to be your one saved-up pieces of starting equipment - fine.

Chain weapons seem to be too easy to get. Although their availability is lower than low-tech, all except the eviscerator classify as starting equipment, making the low-tech weapons obsolete other than for style purposes.

Enforcer armor is harder to get than flak armor, and doesn't qualify as starting equipment (at -20) - with an arbites background you do get one of these for starters, but as it's also worse (heavier and less protective) than flak this seems weird.

Also, according to case 3, this means that a fresh character attemping to get one of these items should be able to do so if they have a little time (e.g. between missions). A starting character will have influence between 27 and 45, with commerce (probably) between -10 and +10. That puts the full range between 17 and 55, although let's say between 25 and 40 for practical purposes (assuming the commerce description is the right one).

Because the only penalty for failure is a time before re-attempt, with enough time, any acquisition that can be made with a lucky roll can be made. With a net check of 10, a requisition attempt would average 50 days; this becomes 23 days for a check of 20 and 14 days for a check of 30. (Somewhere along those lines. I can include the whole computation but I think this is enough for argument's sake). For practical purposes, I'll assume any item requiring a net roll of 20 or more can reasonably be acquired between missions (3 weeks time).

So, to acquire an item of availability -10 between missions, I'd need Commerce(IF) at 30. That seems about right. However, playing a highborn administratum character, my Commerce(IF) is going to be around 50. That means I can get my hands on anything of availability -30 or higher. That, in itself, doesn't sound too bad. However, that means I can get a power weapon (sword, axe or maul), plasma gun, bolt weapon (pistol, gun) or hot-shot lasgun. the bolt pistol, maybe. The power sword? questionable. The plasma gun/boltgun? I'd say no. Some care needs to be given to the rarity of some of the, well, rarer items.

Looking at the newly-minted inquisitor, depending on his commerce skill his Commerce(IF) will be 65-105. There is nothing in this book he can't get, although With an availability of -50, the inferno pistol, autocannon, heavy bolter and light power armor might take a little longer to get if the inquisitor hasn't got his commerce skill up to scratch. But I feel the availability of some of those items might be decreased to -70 or -80. If the new inquisitor really cares that much about his gear, it's likely he'll have invested in his commerce skill anyway.

Also, let's take a look at a character who focuses on commerce. I'll take an adeptus administratum seeker (cheap Int and Fel)

At 1350 xp, I'll have commerce at +30, so commerce(IF) is at 65, assuming average influence. This already puts ANY item in the book in reach (effective skill 15, ok, will take a long time for the most rare items) - admittedly, this is not a balanced character, but focusing about 25% of my xp I'd be there at rank 4. this seems too soon to be able to get everything - making a stronger argument for decreasing availability of truly rare items below -50.

Focusing the character a bit more, I take int 50, fel 50, keen intuition, cover-up and contact network (whcih replaces F for IF). This is about 3450 xp (including commerce +30). spending 25% of xp along that line we're talking rank 7, although that probably means we raise F to 70, not 50. This puts Commerce (IF) at 100 on rank 7, meaning that an item with availability -80 is something that can be acquired. I'd propose putting the 'rare' end of items in that range (rather than -40, -50). Commerce(IF) would be at 80 at rank 3 for power players, so they'd be able to get availability -60 items.

One thing I haven't addressed so far is acquiring items mid-mission. Now, we're talking about a single Commerce(IF) roll - no time for retries. For starting characters, availability +20 items have a 50/50 chance of being acquired, although this could be increased to 70/30 if they're willing to spend a fate point if they really need it. All you can get is a laspistol, a knife, or a staff. Not much room here. Replacing a piece of starting equipment is, at a -10, very hard. I don't mind the latter (as stated, to me, starting equipment reflects the valuable stuff you've saved up, not necessarily what you can acquire on the fly) but the availability of very common, easy-to get items should probably be raised a little (at +40, a starting character has a 70% chance of finding something in a hurry)

So to summarize:
- the rules should be clarified on how long it takes to accomplish a test, what the test is (plain IF or Commerce(IF), and what the penalties of failure / possibilities for re-attempt are). The requisition part an p. 131 should probably redirect to the commerce skill.
- the starting equipment mechanism seems ok, the item tables maybe have 1-2 items that should be a little rarer.
- The availability values on the tables should cover a much wider range, say from -80 to +40. The values should reflect the following:
 +40: abundant goods (easy to acquire during a mission)
 +20: common goods (possible to acquire during a mission but not guaranteed)
  -10: starting equipment (hard to get during a mission, but possible to get between missions)

  -30: early game (rank 1-2) equipment (with some difficulty, between missions)
  -50: mid game (rank 4-5) equipment
  -80: late game (rank 7-8) equipment
Note that there is about a 50-point difference in what can easily be acquired during a mission, and what can be acquired with some effort. Also, I'd expect items with even lower availability (-100 or even lower) to be added in rules supplements for higher power levels.

- Availability values should be better balanced against one another

 

I've given rebalancing the availability of items a shot in the following table. Please note that this is without looking at the stats of the items in detail; it's my interpretation of how easy it should be to acquire these items taking the setting in mind. Suggestions on that part are definitely welcome. (anything marked with a ' is changed from the last update).

 

BOLT WEAPONS
Bolt Pistol         –30
Boltgun             –50'
Storm Bolter        –70'
Heavy Bolter        –50'

LAS WEAPONS
Laspistol           +20
Lasgun              +20'
Long-las            –10
Hot-shot Laspistol  –40'
Hot-shot Lasgun     –50'

SOLID PROJECTILE WEAPONS
Autopistol         +10'
Stub Revolver      +30'
Hand Cannon        +10'
Autogun             +0
Shotgun             +0'
Sniper Rifle       –20
Heavy Stubber      –30
Autocannon         –50

MELTA WEAPONS
Inferno Pistol     –80'
Meltagun           –50'

PLASMA WEAPONS
Plasma Pistol      –70'
Plasma Gun         –80'

FLAME WEAPONS
Hand Flamer        –30'
Flamer             –10
Heavy Flamer       –40'

LOW-TECH WEAPONS
Bolas              +10'
Bow                 +0'
Crossbow           +10'
Throwing Knife     +10

LAUNCHER WEAPONS
Grenade Launcher   –20
Missile Launcher   –40'

EXOTIC WEAPONS
Needle Pistol      –50'
Needle Rifle       –60'
Web Pistol         –20'
Webber             –40'

Grenades & Explosives
Frag               +20'
Hallucinogen       –30'
Haywire            –40'
Krak               –10
Melta Bomb         –30
Photon Flash       –10'
Smoke              +20'
Stun               –10
Web                 +0

Melee Weapons
CHAIN WEAPONS
Chainaxe           –40'
Chainblade          +0'
Chainsword         -20'
Eviscerator        –60'

POWER WEAPONS
Power Axe          –60'
Power Fist         –80'
Power Maul         –60'
Power Sword        –50'

LOW-TECH WEAPONS
Knife              +40'
Sword              +20'
Staff              +30'
Warhammer           +0'
Whip                +0'

FORCE WEAPONS
Force Staff        –70'
Force Sword        –80'

SHOCK WEAPONS
Electro-Flail      –50'
Shock Maul         –20

EXOTIC WEAPONS
Hunting Lance      –40'

Armour
Robes                 +40'
Manufactorum Coverall +30'
Hive Leathers         +20'
Feudal Armour         –10
Body Glove            –30
Enforcer Armour       –10'
Flak Armour           –10'
Mesh Armour           –40'
Light Carapace Armour –60'
Light Power Armour    –80'

Weapon Modification
Backpack Ammo Supply –10
Compact              -30'
Counter-weight       -10'
Custom Grip          –30'
Expanded Magazine    +10
Melee Attachment     +20
Mono                 –20
Motion Predictor     –40'
OmnissianSanction    –50'
Photo Sight          –20
Preysense Sight      –20
Quick-Release        -20'
Red-Dot Laser Sight  –20'
Reinforced           +10
Suppressor           –10
Suspensor            –50'
Targeter             –50'
Telescopic Sight     –20'
Vox-Operated         –60'

CUSTOM AMMUNITION
Amputator Shell      –30
Bleeder Rounds       –20
Dumdum Bullets       –10
Expander Rounds      –10
Fragmentation Rounds –10
Inferno Shells       –30
Scrambler Rounds     –30'
Tox Rounds           –30'
 

 

 

 

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That's a really, and I mean really, excellent summary and analysis,

 

I personally am not worried about what a "fledgling inquisitor" can get their hands on. By the time the characters have reached Inquisitor status, I expect equipment choice to be more about what is appropriate and discreet for the mission, rather than what is available. But otherwise I agree.

 

It seems to me that the biggest problem is downtime between missions. You have a system designed around limited opportunities mid-mission (including the 'cost' of Subtlety penalties), being available in a situation where people can use it time and again. There could be months of narrative time between missions!

 

Really, we want a way of limiting resource acquisition during downtime without causing too much player whining or GM-fiat. There are other ways, but that's the one that will neatly adjust the existing system without having to overhaul too much... You know, it occurs to me that if these requisition rolls are meant to reflect the acolytes using their Inquisitorial influence to commandeer necessary supplies, then there's no reason they should be able to do that when not engaged in Inquisitorial business. I mean a cop can commandeer your vehicle, but not just because they feel like a ride in your car.

 

How about amending the rule slightly to begin "While on Inquisitorial business, a PC may attempt to requisition..." etc. I mean of course people don't always know whether you're actually on business or not when you ask for that flamer, but do you really want to be caught by your Inquisitor misusing her name / seal?

 

Also, do we have to assume that the provision of equipment is permanent? Again, if a cop needs to commandeer my vehicle to chase someone, fine. But I expect the vehicle to be given back to me afterwards. Even special ammo can be provided on a "bring me back any you don't use" with a concordant hit on Influence if the provider never sees the PCs again. ;)

 

If Influence represents a PC going: "I am on the Emperor's business - I need that plasma pistol to complete my mission", the owner / custodian / arbites station master / whoever, is probably entitled to reply: "here it is, good luck destroying the filthy daemon, please try not to die before you return it." And I think Influence does represent that.

 

Of course PCs can obtain permanent equipment, but we can limit that in other ways.

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Thanks for your feedback!

 


If Influence represents a PC going: "I am on the Emperor's business - I need that plasma pistol to complete my mission", the owner / custodian / arbites station master / whoever, is probably entitled to reply: "here it is, good luck destroying the filthy daemon, please try not to die before you return it." And I think Influence does represent that.

 

The Ascension system was actually aimed at just that. If I recall correctly, when attempting to "requisition" items, you'd get modifiers based on duration:

+20 for 1 or 2 days

+0   for the duration of a mission

-20  for acquiring an item permanently.

 

And of course, there were influence penalties for those "borrowing with no intent to return" (I think it was 10% of the influence of the person you were cheating out of their stuff)

 

For getting equipment permanently, it had a different system called "commisioning" - this basically meant that you arranged to have an item specially made for you. This was only possible for Imperial items (no xenos artifacts and the like), and could take months. This required an Influence roll only modified for availability, but it could take months before an item was actually completed.

 

It would probably be good to re-introduce the difference. Both rolls could be Commerce (IF), although requisitioning (borrowing) items could be Charm (IF), because that's basically convincing someone he can trust you to return the stuff. The exact mechanics of "Commisioning - Commerce(IF)" would have to be worked out. As you correctly state, it would have to work without too much player whining or GM fiat. I'd also prefer to eliminate the mechanism of rolling over and over again to get the item you want.

 

Example with the current system: Suppose I'm trying to get a rare item and the target number for my roll is 15, and I roll

20, 54, 93, 16, 31, 72, 4. Thats 2, 5, 9, 1, 3, and 7 days lost, for a total of 27 days. Although, on average, the system works out, that's still a lot of dierolls and adding up to determine if I can obtain an item and how long it takes. And you could get players hoping to get a 1, which would succeed in any case (although I'd expect that one easily overruled by the GM - if the availability penalty is worse than your Commerce(IF), forget about it...).

 

I'll see if I can come up with a description.

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Thanks for your feedback!

 

If Influence represents a PC going: "I am on the Emperor's business - I need that plasma pistol to complete my mission", the owner / custodian / arbites station master / whoever, is probably entitled to reply: "here it is, good luck destroying the filthy daemon, please try not to die before you return it." And I think Influence does represent that.

 

The Ascension system was actually aimed at just that. If I recall correctly, when attempting to "requisition" items, you'd get modifiers based on duration:

+20 for 1 or 2 days

+0   for the duration of a mission

-20  for acquiring an item permanently.

 

And of course, there were influence penalties for those "borrowing with no intent to return" (I think it was 10% of the influence of the person you were cheating out of their stuff)

 

For getting equipment permanently, it had a different system called "commisioning" - this basically meant that you arranged to have an item specially made for you. This was only possible for Imperial items (no xenos artifacts and the like), and could take months. This required an Influence roll only modified for availability, but it could take months before an item was actually completed.

 

It would probably be good to re-introduce the difference. Both rolls could be Commerce (IF), although requisitioning (borrowing) items could be Charm (IF), because that's basically convincing someone he can trust you to return the stuff. The exact mechanics of "Commisioning - Commerce(IF)" would have to be worked out. As you correctly state, it would have to work without too much player whining or GM fiat. I'd also prefer to eliminate the mechanism of rolling over and over again to get the item you want.

 

Example with the current system: Suppose I'm trying to get a rare item and the target number for my roll is 15, and I roll

20, 54, 93, 16, 31, 72, 4. Thats 2, 5, 9, 1, 3, and 7 days lost, for a total of 27 days. Although, on average, the system works out, that's still a lot of dierolls and adding up to determine if I can obtain an item and how long it takes. And you could get players hoping to get a 1, which would succeed in any case (although I'd expect that one easily overruled by the GM - if the availability penalty is worse than your Commerce(IF), forget about it...).

 

I'll see if I can come up with a description.

 

Huh! Ninja'd by a book published three years ago! :D

 

I never actually read Ascension. I never sustained a DH game long enough to get that high up (I like to start games at the lowest ranks) and I'd always heard how broken much of it was so I never bought it.

 

Your proposal sounds an elegant way of handling this - i.e. a separate commissioning system. Eclipse Phase has a vaguely similar thing in a way where because your characters are beamed between different planets and space habitats, there can be a kind of reset factor for equipment. I really quite like Influence being something that gets used on a mission-by-mission basis. It puts it more inline with other characteristics in a way and worth building up - even more than one character doing so.

 

Really looking forward to seeing what you do for a commissioning system. I personally think just something simple with a short list of modifiers would work. After all, there are plenty of ways PCs can get things permanently in game (and should). I like the thought of the PCs being gifted a treasured storm bolter from the family vaults when they save some noble family, or a battered IG captain bequeathing them his high-quality chainsword as he dies: "use it well, my brothers!".

 

So much more fun than just an influence roll and it stops a massive accumulation of treasure after a few missions.

 

Hopefully the designers take note and adopt something like this.

Edited by knasserII

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Well, I never actually played ascension - but it was nice to think how my guardsman character might evolve to be a crusader or inquisitor (added a bit of ambition).

 

I've revised the Acquisition skill use a bit (and renamed it Requisition) and come up with a Commisioning skill use. I'm not 100% happy of how it works at higher levels, though.

 

If commisioning items means having them manufactured, it seems logical to tie manufacturing time to availability - power armour is just not as easy to produce as a lasgun. I have some difficulty determining reasonable times, though. I'd like some feedback on that. I've borrowed NimSim's idea of tying availability to the time needed to get an item, although the table works out differently.

 

Requisition - Charm (IF)
Characteristic: Influence
Average Time: Part of a transaction
Use: During an investigation, when a character finds himself in need of a piece of equipment, he can attempt to requisition it. In essence, he uses his authority or calls in favors to find and temporarily borrow the item in question. The character makes a Charm (IF) test to acquire a single piece of equipment and, if successful, he finds and acquires the gear sought. This test’s difficulty is determined by the availability and craftsmanship of the desired piece of equipment, and a modifier based on how long the character wants to borrow the item. One-use items (such as grenades) do not get a modifier based on duration, and never need to be returned (even if unused).
 +20: 1 or 2 days
  +0: For the duration of the investigation
 -20: Indefinitely
In the case of one-use items such as grenades, the character may choose to increase the difficulty to obtain more than one item in a single requisition attempt.
 +10: 2 items
 +20: 5 items
To acquire more than 5 expendable items of the same type, additional requisition attempts need to be made. If a character does not return a requisitioned item after the alotted time, he loses a number of influence points equal to the IFb of the person the item was borrowed from. At the game master's discretion, he may attempt to make amends by returning the item in question. In this case, he regains half of the lost points (rounded down). Additionally, if a character fails a requisition test by 4 or more degrees, the character is forced to return a previously requisitioned item to it's owner (even if it is an item he has borrowed indefinitely). If he refuses, the penalties for not returning the item are applied as usual.

Re-attempt: If the test succeeds, it can immediately be re-attempted up to a maximum number of times equal to the characters Influence bonus during the course of an investigation. If the test fails, or if the maximum number of requisition attempts has already been made during that investigation, the character cannot re-attempt the test for a number of days equal to the degrees of failure suffered on the test.


Commission - Commerce(IF)
Average time: Part of a transaction
Use: A character can attempt to have an item constructed for his personal use. In contrast to requisitioning an item, he will never have to return the item, but it will take time before the item is complete. Also, commissioning items is limited to items of Imperial origin that can be manufactured; xeno or archeotech items cannot be commissioned. To commission an item, a character makes a Commerce (IF) test. The test's difficulty is determined by the availability of the item. The item is always of best quality, but the commission test suffers no additional penalty for that.
When commisioning one-use items such as grenades, the character may choose to increase the difficulty to obtain more than one item.
 +10: 2 items
 +20: 5 items
To acquire more than 5 items, additional commissions need to be arranged.
If the required roll is below 1, the item cannot be commissioned (not even by rolling a 1).
The time it takes to manufacture the item is determined by it's availability (for higher availability items, the item may actually be produced from a store instead of custom-made)
-10 or higher: 1 day
-20 2 days
-30 4 days
-40 1 week
-50 2 weeks
-60 1 month
-70 2 months
-80 4 months
-90 8 months
-100 16 months

If the character fails the roll, the item can still be ordered, but it's manufacture will get lower priority. For every degree of failure on the test, determine manufacturing time as if the availability were 1 step (10 points) lower. A character may have a number of outstanding commissions up to his Influence bonus.
Re-attempt: If, for some reason, the character's influence increases, he may attempt to speed up any outstanding comissions which are delayed because he previously failed a commission attempt. The character makes a Commerce(IF) test, modified by availability and a +10 for every time the test was already attempted. If he succeeds, he manages to get the administratum's priorities straight and removes the delay, although the manufacturing time still cannot be reduced to less than the base amount. The delay never gets worse.

 

Example: Upon being elevated to inquisitor status, Lljenov decides to commission a new suit of power armour for his personal use. With an influence of 75 and commerce +10, He needs to roll below a 5. His commision is approved, but it will probably take some time. He rolls and gets an 86, 9 degrees of failure!. The commission gets hopelessly tied up in bureaucracy; it would take decades to complete the request. Rather than waiting for the administratum to sort it out, Lljenov decides to start a second commission (he can have a total of 7) and gets a 46. That'll still take about 10 years to complete. He gives up for the moment, and starts out on his new investigation. When he returns, his influence has increased by 2 points, so he is entitled to re-attempt the failed commission rolls. He can now re-attempt both commissions, needing to roll below a 17. Neither succeeds, but after the next mission he gains another point of influence and re-attempts at 28 (Commerce(IF) is now at 88, -80 for the availability, and +20 for the previous attempts) - this time, one of the attempts succeeds and he cuts the delivery time down to 4 months (the base amount). 10 years later, he is surprised by the delivery of a second set of power armour...

 

 

I propose to add 2 new item special qualities (although this could be handled in the text description as well)
Special quality: Xenos
This item is of xenos origin and, as such, may not be commissioned. Also, ownership of such an item may be frowned upon by the more puritan elements of the inquisition.

Special quality: Archeotech
Even the Adeptus Mechanicus lacks the means and/or knowledge to fabricate these items and as such, they may not be commissioned.

These might be added to items, although, looking at the list, I don't think there are any items that definitely deserve the label, I'm not familiar enough with the 40K setting to judge that.

I noticed I missed the availability for force fields:
Refractor Field   –50'
Conversion Field  –60'
Displacer Field   –70'
Power Field       –80'


Now, to put the new system through my own scrutiny:
- obtaining starting gear remains unchanged.
- a starting character with an influence of 35 and commerce +0 can commission up to 3 items of availability -30 or better. With an average roll of 50-someting, -10 items (starting gear) take 2 weeks to produce (4 degrees of failure), -20 items take 2 months to produce (5 degrees of failure) and -30 items take 8 months. The last item will take up one of his commissioning 'slots' for the next 8 months, unless his influence increases and he manages to re-roll a better value. A spectacularly bad roll might cause an availability -10 item to take as much time, but that's what (imho) fate points might be used for. (besides, I could see how, after 16 months of administratum bureaucracy, the item finally catches up with the acolyte, by the time he had already forgotten he ordered it...)
- requisitioning items works pretty much as it did before, although it is easier to obtain an item for a day or two. a character might spend a fate point for a +20 on an attempt to borrow an item indefinitely; seems fine. I'm not sure if requisitioning should be Charm (IF) instead of Commerce (IF); but it seemed appropriate. However, it makes the commerce skill less useful, and that might be bad. I felt that a penalty needed to be introduced for particularly bad failures (you're whining to the wrong people to borrow you even more stuff - instead they take back what they previously lend to you. Or, after pestering the local arbitrator, he decides to check out if that weapon you're carrying isn't actually stolen...)
- At higher levels of influence, it's a LOT quicker to requisition the items you need than commissioning them. Effectively, commisioning items becomes a multi-step process where the character re-attempts to get priority for his manufacture after each succesful investigation.

Edited by MHJFaase

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10 years later, he is surprised by the delivery of a second set of power armour...

 

There is way too much in your excellent post for me to comment on in the short time I have before signing off, but I just want to say that this not only summed up the entire Adeptus Administratum in a single instant, but also made me chuckle like a loon! :D

 

I'm filing that away for future use next time someone blows a roll to get equipment. Probably have the darn thing ship around a dozen planets following the PCs before it finally catches up with them! :D

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Hm, I hadn't really thought about that yet.

 

Burning influence could work with both requisitioning and commissioning, I think. It should allow you to gain access to items that would normally be very difficult to attain - although it still shouldn't enable starting characters to obtain very rare gear.

 

The current mechanic for burning influence is listed on page 233: " When attempting an Influence test, before rolling, an Acolyte may choose to decrease his Influence by 1d5 in order to automatically succeed. If degrees of success are important, the Acolyte is considered to have achieved a number equal to his Fellowship bonus."

 

I consider it weird that the DoS is termined by Fb instead of IFb; this may be a typo. But it is not very relevant for this appliance, I think.

 

The system in place would work well with commissioning, given the fact that I already stated it is impossible to commission an item if the net roll would be below 1. Basically, you can automatically succeed at commissioning an item if you burn 1d5 influence.

 

When requisitioning an item, it can work as well, however, in that case it means ANY item can be requisitioned. That's not too bad, although I'd assume any character doing this would then take the -20 modifier for an indefinite loan. At first sight, that would make it more powerful than commisioning. However, there is still the point that even a loan for an indefinite period of time is still a loan - it may be recalled, especially if you later botch a requisition roll. I think that offsets the power of being able to get whatever you want.

 

So, without too much thought, I'm tempted to use the mechanism as is. Should a starting character decide to immediately burn influence in order to borrow something out of his league, remember that it's still borrowed. I think he will be sorely disappointed when he's got to return the goods before having the chance to use them.

 

If you're worried about abuse, you can always add "As with any influence test, a character can burn 1d5 points of influence to automatically succeed at the test. However, if he burns influence in order to requisition an item that he could not normally commission, the longest time he will be allowed to borrow it is for the duration of the investigation"

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Although having had a quick skim through the post and to be honest the influence system in the beta I'm not sure I like the idea of using influence for equipment purchasing. I in my view there should still be influence but this should be for getting hold of thing like loaning imperial guard troops, renting a nobles house so that you can infiltrate a noble group, getting transport from one world to another, etc.

While the purchase of equipment should be from a purchase system although be more balanced than the DH 1 version was.

As to me influence is your standing society how your inquisitor, the Ordos and other group view you. While this might mean you are well received it does not always mean you will be able to get your hand on equipment.

Hopefully over the Bank Holiday weekend I will get a chance to finish reading up and can possibly come up with an idea or two about how I would like to see it work.

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