So I had a problem with Space Combat yesterday...

[That Blasted Samophlange 6,923]

I do believe that it has been said already, but if you want more rolls let your players go into an asteroid/debris field. I ran a game where the players had to navigate a nebula where if they clipped a gas pocket their ship would effectively be hit with an ion blast. Then pirates showed up. Made for a tense combat.

Space is big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mind- bogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the chemist's, but that's just peanuts to space.

If space is mostly empty, fill it up.

Give the players something tangible to fly through. OR give them something they don't have a hope of fighting and make them do a chase. That's where a pilot shines.

[LukeZZ 26]

Is there a range limit on the "Gain the Advantage" action?

 

Say, if I detect a small ship at medium range approaching quiclky, can I try to "Gain the Advantage" against it?

If so and I win, can I hit its (unshielded) aft, even if the ship is still at medium range (showing its front to me)?

[That Blasted Samophlange 6,923]

I don't believe there is a range limit. So yes you can hit it at medium if your weapons fire that far. The thing is don't think of a round/turn in such absolutes. Each can be anywhere from a few seconds to a minute. With the above example think of it narratively, you fire a few shots forward the pilot veers off slightly and your shot clips the unshielded section.

[LukeZZ 26]

Yes, but if the target is the players' ship and they stated that they are "charging straight ahead"... well it seems a little odd.

I would understand that effect while in Close range (since you are "dogfighting").

[That Blasted Samophlange 6,923]

A couple of things to remember in addition to space being big, it also let's you every possible direction. The enemy ship could have lowered in a 3d axis to be below or at least at a different angle or orientation to the player's ship.

I have to ask, did the players spend two maneuvers closing the distance? Did the enemy ship move closer?

Remember in This system both the players and gm have the power to say what happens.

[LukeZZ 26]

The characters' ship moved twice, the enemy ship didn't move (was blocking an access port), so even in a three-dimensional space it couldn't have "hit them from below".

Edited August 26, 2013 by LukeZZ

[Misfitsrun 12]

i have not read all the post in this thread yet. in the basic game with the YT-1300 vs 4 TIE/F you could do "Gain the advantage" diff PPP and and nagate the upgrade diff from "evasive maneuvers" for the gunners vs 1 of the TIEs.

[EldritchFire 499]

i have not read all the post in this thread yet. in the basic game with the YT-1300 vs 4 TIE/F you could do "Gain the advantage" diff PPP and and nagate the upgrade diff from "evasive maneuvers" for the gunners vs 1 of the TIEs.

 

Except that Gain the Advantage requires Speed 4+. The YT-1300 is Speed 3. That is the crux of the argument. YT-1300s can't, without upgrades, gain the advantage on anyone, nor can they break an advantage once gained.

 

-EF

[psheppard 34]

Wasn't one of the other questions whether it impacted just the pilot shooting or everyone?  Not that I would take what's in the Beginner Game as canon.

[syrath 1,316]

Is finally got an answer from Sam Stewart

 

'Sorry for the confusion. In general, the rules on page 235 and the rules under the Gain the Advantage should trump any other rules, especially for small ships of Silhouette 4 or smaller. However, in some cases an Opposed Piloting test can determine this instead. If this occurs, it is at the GM's discretion, and because it makes more narrative sense at the time. '

 

​So it appears you can use the piloting skill to override the choice that silhoutte 4 or smaller craft get to choose where to hit, but only if it makes narrative sense.

 

'

[Nashable 59]

Yes, but my concern here was that a group of (for example) TIE fighters chasing a light freighter with turret guns would be wiped out in short order and without much tension since the turrets could fire without penalty while the TIEs had to make constant piloting rolls just to avoid crashing.

 

You would use top of the round chase/opposed pilot checks to set distance/deal with hazards and then the pilot can use their action to fire in the normal initiative. Sam even said on the D20Radio podcast that you do not need to use an action just to keep the ship flying forward.

[Krieger22 2,471]

So you make a roll at the start of the round, outside the normal initiative slots, to determine distance between the chasers and the, ah, chasee? That would explain a lot. If anyone can point me to the relevant page in the rulebook I'd be grateful.

[syrath 1,316]

 

i have not read all the post in this thread yet. in the basic game with the YT-1300 vs 4 TIE/F you could do "Gain the advantage" diff PPP and and nagate the upgrade diff from "evasive maneuvers" for the gunners vs 1 of the TIEs.

 

Except that Gain the Advantage requires Speed 4+. The YT-1300 is Speed 3. That is the crux of the argument. YT-1300s can't, without upgrades, gain the advantage on anyone, nor can they break an advantage once gained.

 

-EF

 

If this is from the beginner game the krayt fang has upgraded speed so it could be used for gain the advantage.

[syrath 1,316]

Although, as written, only the pilot of the vessel gaining the advantage gets the benefits - weapons fired by the co-pilot and/or gunners do not.

 

In the beginners game gain the advantage does specify the other people in the ship also gain the benefits also. I was just reading it just now and I remenered this post. Its described in the final encounter of the beginners game.

[chrisdk 112]

Just because I just stumbled across the thread from a related google search and I cannot believe noone else has mentioned it in three years: Holy Thread Necromancy!

 

Page 240, EotE Core Rules "Stellar Phenomena or Terrain"

"When a ship passes near or through one of these treacherous obstacles, the pilot might need to make an appropriate piloting check, even if he is attempting a starship maneuver that typically wouldn't require one."

 

Difficulty is built like an opposed test where your current speed is the opponents characteristic and half your signature is the skill.

So ... go from open space to the crowded approach lanes of a core world spaceport, the terrifying dangers of an asteroid belt, the unknown properties of a nebula, and all of a sudden your Pilot has to beat 1 purple, 2 red to do Evasive Maneuvers, Stay on Target or just plain moving anywhere at Speed 3 in their Signature 4 Freighter. So you have to have a pretty hot shot pilot to pull it off at any speed above snails pace and even they will appreciate a Copilot using their "Copilot" Actions to downgrade those piloting checks.

Edited October 18, 2016 by chrisdk

[SEApocalypse 4,443]

Just because I just stumbled across the thread from a related google search and I cannot believe noone else has mentioned it in three years: Holy Thread Necromancy!

 

Page 240, EotE Core Rules "Stellar Phenomena or Terrain"

"When a ship passes near or through one of these treacherous obstacles, the pilot might need to make an appropriate piloting check, even if he is attempting a starship maneuver that typically wouldn't require one."

 

Difficulty is built like an opposed test where your current speed is the opponents characteristic and half your signature is the skill.

So ... go from open space to the crowded approach lanes of a core world spaceport, the terrifying dangers of an asteroid belt, the unknown properties of a nebula, and all of a sudden your Pilot has to beat 1 purple, 2 red to do Evasive Maneuvers, Stay on Target or just plain moving anywhere at Speed 3 in their Signature 4 Freighter. So you have to have a pretty hot shot pilot to pull it off at any speed above snails pace and even they will appreciate a Copilot using their "Copilot" Actions to downgrade those piloting checks.

 

It is recommend to keep it at one check and not a check for each maneuver, gameflow and all. Same as for ground combat. 

Now if you fail that check you are naturally in trouble or can't chase your target anymore into the obstacle.

[chrisdk 112]

 

Just because I just stumbled across the thread from a related google search and I cannot believe noone else has mentioned it in three years: Holy Thread Necromancy!

 

Page 240, EotE Core Rules "Stellar Phenomena or Terrain"

"When a ship passes near or through one of these treacherous obstacles, the pilot might need to make an appropriate piloting check, even if he is attempting a starship maneuver that typically wouldn't require one."

 

Difficulty is built like an opposed test where your current speed is the opponents characteristic and half your signature is the skill.

So ... go from open space to the crowded approach lanes of a core world spaceport, the terrifying dangers of an asteroid belt, the unknown properties of a nebula, and all of a sudden your Pilot has to beat 1 purple, 2 red to do Evasive Maneuvers, Stay on Target or just plain moving anywhere at Speed 3 in their Signature 4 Freighter. So you have to have a pretty hot shot pilot to pull it off at any speed above snails pace and even they will appreciate a Copilot using their "Copilot" Actions to downgrade those piloting checks.

 

It is recommend to keep it at one check and not a check for each maneuver, gameflow and all. Same as for ground combat. 

Now if you fail that check you are naturally in trouble or can't chase your target anymore into the obstacle.

 

Hm, I seem to be missing that recommendation, could you point me to where in the rules I find it. Or is it "just" forum consensus that I am unaware of?

And considering that System Strain is really hard to remove, there will generally only be one Pilot Only Maneuver per Round per Ship anyway. And most encounters are unlikely to have more than three or four acting vehicle/vehicle groups. So not too much of a hassle if it gives your pilot something to feel awesome about. In this situation I'd say a small hit to gameflow is worth it for the extra fun for the pilot player.

[SEApocalypse 4,443]

 

 

Just because I just stumbled across the thread from a related google search and I cannot believe noone else has mentioned it in three years: Holy Thread Necromancy!

 

Page 240, EotE Core Rules "Stellar Phenomena or Terrain"

"When a ship passes near or through one of these treacherous obstacles, the pilot might need to make an appropriate piloting check, even if he is attempting a starship maneuver that typically wouldn't require one."

 

Difficulty is built like an opposed test where your current speed is the opponents characteristic and half your signature is the skill.

So ... go from open space to the crowded approach lanes of a core world spaceport, the terrifying dangers of an asteroid belt, the unknown properties of a nebula, and all of a sudden your Pilot has to beat 1 purple, 2 red to do Evasive Maneuvers, Stay on Target or just plain moving anywhere at Speed 3 in their Signature 4 Freighter. So you have to have a pretty hot shot pilot to pull it off at any speed above snails pace and even they will appreciate a Copilot using their "Copilot" Actions to downgrade those piloting checks.

 

It is recommend to keep it at one check and not a check for each maneuver, gameflow and all. Same as for ground combat. 

Now if you fail that check you are naturally in trouble or can't chase your target anymore into the obstacle.

 

Hm, I seem to be missing that recommendation, could you point me to where in the rules I find it. Or is it "just" forum consensus that I am unaware of?

And considering that System Strain is really hard to remove, there will generally only be one Pilot Only Maneuver per Round per Ship anyway. And most encounters are unlikely to have more than three or four acting vehicle/vehicle groups. So not too much of a hassle if it gives your pilot something to feel awesome about. In this situation I'd say a small hit to gameflow is worth it for the extra fun for the pilot player.

 

Clearing system strain is a single damage control action, something which can performed by crew or astromechs just fine. It is trivial to remove and even in single seaters not that problematic if your mechanic skill is decent enough. You clear after all one strain per success. Though my own character just converts system-strain to strain and uses some of his advantages to clear that strain. Hotshots can go quite wild even without my beloved astromech.

The recommendation to skip rolling pilot checks on everything should be still avaible in the FAQ topic iirc. It would be rather impractical in context if you would spend your only action on maneuvering each round, right?

Edited October 19, 2016 by SEApocalypse

[SEApocalypse 4,443]

double

Edited October 18, 2016 by SEApocalypse

[chrisdk 112]

 

 

 

Just because I just stumbled across the thread from a related google search and I cannot believe noone else has mentioned it in three years: Holy Thread Necromancy!

 

Page 240, EotE Core Rules "Stellar Phenomena or Terrain"

"When a ship passes near or through one of these treacherous obstacles, the pilot might need to make an appropriate piloting check, even if he is attempting a starship maneuver that typically wouldn't require one."

 

Difficulty is built like an opposed test where your current speed is the opponents characteristic and half your signature is the skill.

So ... go from open space to the crowded approach lanes of a core world spaceport, the terrifying dangers of an asteroid belt, the unknown properties of a nebula, and all of a sudden your Pilot has to beat 1 purple, 2 red to do Evasive Maneuvers, Stay on Target or just plain moving anywhere at Speed 3 in their Signature 4 Freighter. So you have to have a pretty hot shot pilot to pull it off at any speed above snails pace and even they will appreciate a Copilot using their "Copilot" Actions to downgrade those piloting checks.

 

It is recommend to keep it at one check and not a check for each maneuver, gameflow and all. Same as for ground combat. 

Now if you fail that check you are naturally in trouble or can't chase your target anymore into the obstacle.

 

Hm, I seem to be missing that recommendation, could you point me to where in the rules I find it. Or is it "just" forum consensus that I am unaware of?

And considering that System Strain is really hard to remove, there will generally only be one Pilot Only Maneuver per Round per Ship anyway. And most encounters are unlikely to have more than three or four acting vehicle/vehicle groups. So not too much of a hassle if it gives your pilot something to feel awesome about. In this situation I'd say a small hit to gameflow is worth it for the extra fun for the pilot player.

 

Clearing system strain is a single damage control action, something which can performed by crew or astromechs just fine. It is trivial to remove and even in single seaters not that problematic if your mechanic skill is decent enough. You clear after all one strain per success. Though my own character just converts system-strain to strain and uses some of his advantages to clear that strain. Hotshots can go quite wield even without my beloved astromech.

The recommendation to skip rolling pilot checks on everything should be still avaible in the FAQ topic iirc. It would be rather impractical in context if you would spend your only action on maneuvering each round, right?

 

Clearing strain:

Yeah ... Reading up on it again I realised that it is a LOT easier than I remembered. All I had in my had was the "1 per day" bit outside of combat.

Only Action on Maneuvering? I am not sure what you mean.

[chrisdk 112]

 

 

 

 

Just because I just stumbled across the thread from a related google search and I cannot believe noone else has mentioned it in three years: Holy Thread Necromancy!

 

Page 240, EotE Core Rules "Stellar Phenomena or Terrain"

"When a ship passes near or through one of these treacherous obstacles, the pilot might need to make an appropriate piloting check, even if he is attempting a starship maneuver that typically wouldn't require one."

 

Difficulty is built like an opposed test where your current speed is the opponents characteristic and half your signature is the skill.

So ... go from open space to the crowded approach lanes of a core world spaceport, the terrifying dangers of an asteroid belt, the unknown properties of a nebula, and all of a sudden your Pilot has to beat 1 purple, 2 red to do Evasive Maneuvers, Stay on Target or just plain moving anywhere at Speed 3 in their Signature 4 Freighter. So you have to have a pretty hot shot pilot to pull it off at any speed above snails pace and even they will appreciate a Copilot using their "Copilot" Actions to downgrade those piloting checks.

 

It is recommend to keep it at one check and not a check for each maneuver, gameflow and all. Same as for ground combat. 

Now if you fail that check you are naturally in trouble or can't chase your target anymore into the obstacle.

 

Hm, I seem to be missing that recommendation, could you point me to where in the rules I find it. Or is it "just" forum consensus that I am unaware of?

And considering that System Strain is really hard to remove, there will generally only be one Pilot Only Maneuver per Round per Ship anyway. And most encounters are unlikely to have more than three or four acting vehicle/vehicle groups. So not too much of a hassle if it gives your pilot something to feel awesome about. In this situation I'd say a small hit to gameflow is worth it for the extra fun for the pilot player.

 

Clearing system strain is a single damage control action, something which can performed by crew or astromechs just fine. It is trivial to remove and even in single seaters not that problematic if your mechanic skill is decent enough. You clear after all one strain per success. Though my own character just converts system-strain to strain and uses some of his advantages to clear that strain. Hotshots can go quite wield even without my beloved astromech.

The recommendation to skip rolling pilot checks on everything should be still avaible in the FAQ topic iirc. It would be rather impractical in context if you would spend your only action on maneuvering each round, right?

 

Clearing strain:

Yeah ... Reading up on it again I realised that it is a LOT easier than I remembered. All I had in my had was the "1 per day" bit outside of combat.

Only Action on Maneuvering? I am not sure what you mean.

 

Nevermind ... I found the FAQ Entry and that led me to "If it's a skillcheck it's an action" ... that is ...

probably not something I am a fan of.