[Melee] Varys and challenge redirection

[Bolzano2 0]

Can Varys bypass restrictions such as "Across the Summer Sea" and "Mutual Cause"?

MUTUAL CAUSE Text:
When revealed,if you have more than one opponent,choose an opponent. You and that opponent cannot declare challenges against one another this round.

 

ACROSS THE SUMMER SEA Text:
only. If you have more than 1 opponent, challenges cannot be initiated by you or against you.

VARYS Text:
Ally only. Stealth. . If you have more than one opponent Varys gains: 'Response: After an opponent declares a challenge, put Varys into Shadows to redirect the challenge against an eligible opponent of your choice, ignoring any Title restrictions.'

 

Since it says challenges cannot be initiated but Varys text says "redirect" (not initiate).

In my opinion, Varys cannot bypass those restrictions because of the following:

Regent of the Crown Title text : "That player must choose a legal target. If there are no other legal targets, the attack goes
through against the original target. Players can never choose to attack themselves."

Military Title text : "If, for any reason, you are not a legal target for the declared attack, you cannot use this ability to redirect the challenge."

What exactly does legal target for the attack means? Is it a target for initiating a challenge or redirecting it? From the Crown Regent text, we can assume that if I am supporting a player, I cannot attack/redirect my challenge against him. Otherwise, it would not be possible that there are "no legal targets".

Second, if I am Lord Commander of Kingsguard, how could I be not a valid target for the attack since nobody supports me? Seems that this wording was designed for the plot "Mutual ennemies" :

Text:
When revealed,if you have more than one opponent,choose an opponent. You and that opponent cannot declare challenges against one another this round.

This card prevents challenge declaration. But Military redirect the challenge. And we can assume Mutual Ennemies prevents Lord Commander redirection.

And so the meaning of "challenge redirection" is, I guess, a kind of replacement effect because it modifies the framework event "1. Active Player declares challenge type and opponent". Also, this replacement cannot initiate if it would lead to an illegal challenge initiation by modifying the target. Which prevents Varys from bypassing plots challenge restrictions.

[ktom 598]

Bolzano said:

Can Varys bypass restrictions such as "Across the Summer Sea" and "Mutual Cause"?

No. The only restictions Varys can ignore are the title restrictions. All other limitations on who can attack whom must still be considered when choosing a new "eligible opponent" as defender of that challenge.

Bolzano said:

What exactly does legal target for the attack means?

Could the attacker have declared their challenge against that player?

Bolzano said:

Second, if I am Lord Commander of Kingsguard, how could I be not a valid target for the attack since nobody supports me? Seems that this wording was designed for the plot "Mutual ennemies" :

In the Core Set, yes. Other effects could be created (imagine a King Robert's Host, only for military challenges).  

Bolzano said:

And so the meaning of "challenge redirection" is, I guess, a kind of replacement effect because it modifies the framework event "1. Active Player declares challenge type and opponent". Also, this replacement cannot initiate if it would lead to an illegal challenge initiation by modifying the target. Which prevents Varys from bypassing plots challenge restrictions.

Redirection is not a replacement effect. For one thing, "1. Active player declares challenge type and opponent" has already happened and resolved in all redirect scenarios (Crown Regent, Lord Commander, Varys, "Support" mechanic-sort of). You cannot "replace" an effect that has already resolved. Rather the "redirect" effects are simply not allowed to create an otherwise illegal attacker-to-defender situation, unless the redirect effect specifically says that it can.