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The_Brown_Bomber

How good is marksmanship?

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Marksmanship (3)
Action: When attacking this round, you may change one of your focus_icon.png results to a critical_icon.png result and all your other focus_icon.png results to hit_icon.png results.

 

would be interested in how you have used this skill and how highly you rate it. it seems better on rebel pilots due to their increased attacking power but the tie interceptor has 3 attack dice too so will Marksmanship see more play with wave2 ships like the interceptor?

i have seen Marksmanship used in a 6-ship Imperial build placed on 4 Black Squadron Pilots with devestating effect. Add Howlrunners reroll ability and you have some heavy firepower on a par with x-wing rookie pilots.

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 Marksmanship can be very good, often making the difference between damaging a ship and destroying it but plain Focus is more versatile as if you don't roll any 'eyes' when shooting you might still be able to use Focus when defending.  Marksmanship is probably at its best when paired with a toredo.

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It is the worst upgrade in the game.

I've explained it on AFM but the main problem with it is that crits suck so all the other upgrades are better and/or cost less. Crits are worth only about 1.2348 damage and they are usually only good on at most 1/3 of a ship's HP. Crit on a shield? Too bad, it is just a hit. Crit on a ship's last point of Hull? Congratulations, you could have done the same thing with a normal hit anyway. All of that is without even taking into account when crits have no additional effect or are negated by abilities and upgrades.

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Icedragon said:

what is "crits" mean?

To add to the above comment, "crit" is short for "critical hit."

The other thing that makes Marksmanship generally better on Rebels is that you don't have to whittle the shields away before it's useful. Since shields nullify critical hits, it's wiser to use a simiple Focus action, I think.

But once it's down to hull, Marksmanship can make a huge difference. Sure, Shadow Jak, they're only worth 1.23 damage (if all you want is the Direct Hit or other damage-inflicting cards), but don't forget about other goodies like "Blinded Pilot" which prevents the affected ship from rolling any dice on its next attack, which can make a huge difference defensively.

The operative word with the above statement is "can." It has the potential to be awesome. For me, it's just a little too risky for 3 points. As has been pointed out above, I like the versatility of the Focus action, which can be used for knowledge and defense in addition to attack.

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It seems like its best use is combined with cluster missiles since, unlike focus, it would apply to both of the attacks.  Of course, it would be pretty hard to justify spending the points (and upgrade slot) on Marksmanship for a single-use weapon like cluster missiles.

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dbmeboy said:

 

It seems like its best use is combined with cluster missiles since, unlike focus, it would apply to both of the attacks.  Of course, it would be pretty hard to justify spending the points (and upgrade slot) on Marksmanship for a single-use weapon like cluster missiles.

 

 

 

you can further extend that to the big ships with gunner/luke on them

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dbmeboy said:

It seems like its best use is combined with cluster missiles since, unlike focus, it would apply to both of the attacks.  Of course, it would be pretty hard to justify spending the points (and upgrade slot) on Marksmanship for a single-use weapon like cluster missiles.

It's not too bad if you were using it on Vader in that application.  When you move into range of the Cluster Missile, you can Target Lock and Marksmanship for Vader's two Actions, then let the missiles go for maximum effect.

Once the missiles are gone, you still have Marksmanship, so if you can keep Vader at Range 1 of his targets, you can  always have one Action devoted to Marksmanship, and still use the other one to Barrel Roll out of an arc, or, if you've got no escape, either drop a Target Lock to go all-in on the damage dealing potential, or drop an evade to play it safe if you're not certain that you can close out the kill.

It's corner-case, but if you're using someone like Howlrunner to Swarm Tactics and escort some Academy Pilots, Vader works quite well as a Lone Wolf flanker type.

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Sabre Squadron Pilot (21) + Marksmanship (3) = 24

Sabre Squadron Pilot (21) + Marksmanship (3) = 24

Howlrunner (18) + Marksmanship (3) = (21)

Darth Vader (29) + Squad Leader (2) = (31)

 

Fly as a tight formation + 3 attack die + free reroll with Sabre Squadron. Vader supports with free action (free evade or barrel roll while they go offensive or barrel roll).

 

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ShadowJak said:

It is the worst upgrade in the game.

I've explained it on AFM but the main problem with it is that crits suck so all the other upgrades are better and/or cost less. Crits are worth only about 1.2348 damage and they are usually only good on at most 1/3 of a ship's HP. Crit on a shield? Too bad, it is just a hit. Crit on a ship's last point of Hull? Congratulations, you could have done the same thing with a normal hit anyway. All of that is without even taking into account when crits have no additional effect or are negated by abilities and upgrades.

 

1/3 of a ship's HP should have been 2/3

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My problem with Marksmanship is that though it can be debated as t whether it is better ot worse than Focus, Focus is free for every ship and Marksmanship  cost 3 points.  That is one of the most expensince upgrades you can take.  There are not Elite Pilot Upgrades that cost more.

There are arguments to be made for its usefulness with cluster missiles, gunner/Luke Skywalker crew upgrade, or with Maarek.  But in each case you have to spend even more points to make the upgrade worth while.  I would also point out that I find both Cluster Missiles and Maarek to be over priced for what you get.  And if you take Luke Skywalker crew upgrade you already get to change one of your focus icons into a hit on the second shot.  So that limits the need for Marksmanship.

Though I don't like it, I will not contend with those who say that it is good, and say that it is worthless.  But I will say that just about any other use of three points is probably better.   R2D2, Swarm Tactics and Vetran Instincts, Steath, not to mention changing one of your ships to one that costs three points better.

Quick examples Maarek + Marksmanship costs one more point than Darth Vader.  I would prefer Darth Vader any time.

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 well.. i dont know or use all the math behind all the percentages. BUT.. i love to load out Mauler and maybe 1 or 2 academy pilots with it..

 

 its just tactical flexablity and target over load. and i like how it can turn a miss into a crit.

 

i use it alot… and it has only ever failed me when i forget it.

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Sgt. G said:

 

 well.. i dont know or use all the math behind all the percentages. BUT.. i love to load out Mauler and maybe 1 or 2 academy pilots with it..

 

 its just tactical flexablity and target over load. and i like how it can turn a miss into a crit.

 

i use it alot… and it has only ever failed me when i forget it.

 

Academy Pilots can't have marksmanship.

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What is funny is i run hot and then cold on Marksmanship. for 3 pts i agree it is way over costed. for your pts there are simply way better (and cheaper!) upgrades available.

Id like to see the card errated to allow +1 attack die at range two. even with this change tho, im not sure people would play it.

in general is say many people think its really only good on ships that have missiles to enhance the alpha strike tactic. so it seems that its over costed and is only good when u support it with other upgrades???

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 ok,

 

 all egg nog aside.

of the elite upgrades, i like it the best. I know im not in the majority here. But i dont use swarm tactics ( the card ) or squad leader. As i normaly use alot of low pilot TIEs. They are just kinda fluff to the way i play. Where as marksmenship can really add the damage when the time comes.

 

 Marksmenship on Mauler at range 1 with Howlrunner behind him. 4 dice with a reroll and a focus to crit upgrade…scares the sith outa luke or wedge every time. i use this to almost garentee that a ships' sheild are gone at least, by the time the academy pilots start shooting. THis also makes quick work of Y wings.

It may be pricy. But being able to take it on a named pilot and still stay under 20 points..not bad.

 

DS-137-1

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Sgt. G said:

 

 

 ok,

 

 all egg nog aside.

of the elite upgrades, i like it the best. I know im not in the majority here. But i dont use swarm tactics ( the card ) or squad leader. As i normaly use alot of low pilot TIEs. They are just kinda fluff to the way i play. Where as marksmenship can really add the damage when the time comes.

 

 Marksmenship on Mauler at range 1 with Howlrunner behind him. 4 dice with a reroll and a focus to crit upgrade…scares the sith outa luke or wedge every time. i use this to almost garentee that a ships' sheild are gone at least, by the time the academy pilots start shooting. THis also makes quick work of Y wings.

It may be pricy. But being able to take it on a named pilot and still stay under 20 points..not bad.

 

DS-137-1

Using Marksmanship on shields is a waste. You might as well have focused.

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The_Brown_Bomber said:

Id like to see the card errated to allow +1 attack die at range two. even with this change tho, im not sure people would play it.

 

No, I think it would be a lot more played if you could add an attack die. Then it might change from being too expensive to a great value.

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so marksmanship is quite situational. if they have 2 shields you might as well focus but if they have 1 or 2 shields, using marksmanship gives them a crit instead of a hit (if u just focus and dont marksmanship)

so then the question remains, is it worth 3 points to deliver more crits to an enemy ship that doesnt have shields. marksmanship doesnt give more damage unless u inflict the 2 hull dmg crit. there r some annoying disabling crits like the one that reduced ur pilot skill or your defense dice but is it worth 3 pts and an action to invrease the chance of this happening?

imo an extra attack die at range2 would seem to balance things out allowing you to deliver more damage, something marsmanship rarely does on its own at present.

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I only use it on Merek Stele. You still have the same issues for him that you'd have using it on another pilot, but at least with him if you do get one through to a ship you have a better chance of getting a useful effect from the crit. In my limited use that has so far meant killing a Y-Wing's Ion Cannon and finishing off a TIE's last Hull Point with the card that deals an extra point of hull damage.

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