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Galak Fyyar

For the right price…

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   40$ for 1 X-Wing and 2 TIE Fighters??? I think only hardcore players and Star Wars fans (like me) can bay this game regardless of cost. But as mass product for everyone… Also, if we compare this game with WotC product (starter set) - for the same price we have 2 Huge capital ships and 8 others random figs (which may also contain “big” ships, like Stardestroyer, not only fighters)…
   My primary concern that the game is not stillborn and continues for some time longer, than WotC’s product, but if the next “update” for “X-Wing” series is also contain only 3 ships for another 40$ (want to mention - WotC’s booster cost 22$ and contain 7 random ships), I’m not sure about game’s long life…
    FFG has enough time to rethink “the right price politics” for the game, because in my local area only I “preorder” this game.

P.S. Another interesting fact: if anybody familiar with “Star Wars Pocketmodel TCG”, you may remember about their demo sample pack, it contains… 1 X-Wing and 2 TIE Fighters!!!..., but we have them for free.
 

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I agree the price point is going to be a major turnoff for many.  But, there are going to be plenty of places online (or ask at your LGS) that will have the sets discounted.  One other thing about comparing this to WotC, the quality (sculpt, paint, not bent) of the figures in the FFG game seem much better.  So, it is more like getting 3 R/VR pieces in the box and nothing of the C/UC quality.  Not that all the WotC pieces were poor over the years. but some were definitely worth the price.  There shouldn't be any outrageous secondary market increases for pieces either since they are not blind packaged.

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 I agree, it's important to remember that this is going to be a different type of game than Starship Battles... and certainly way different than those Pocketmodels. 

On the one hand, I'm pleased that the ships will be of higher quality, but on the other, I'm sort of not - since you could be kinda rough n' tumble with your SB, but probably not with these. When the individual ships start releasing at $12.95 each (at least), broken laser cannons are going to be a major annoyance.

But the gameplay involved here is just so much more engaging than SB, I'm willing to jump in in good faith. And if it eventually proves so expensive that I can't keep it up, c'est la vie. 

[EDIT: Yeesh, this Wings of War starter was $69.95, and it only comes with four planes! sorpresa.gif]

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I sometimes feel that FFG is a "hardcore gamer" company. The cost of their games and the complexity of their game do not allow for the "fly by night" gamer.  The price on the new SW minis just confirms this thought. The down side to the mind-set is it keeps their product of alot of households. If SW was to be better priced there would be nothing stopping it from being EVERWHERE.  

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I think it has much more to do with justifying the added  cost of licensing the IP of other companies. Its pricey and FFG doesn't sell in the kind of volume that alot of companies like Wizkid does, so that licensing fee isn't distributed across as many purchases. Next is the fact that it doesn't appear that FFG intends this to be a collectable game, so while players may want to scale up the action with additional sets, FFG's pricing approaches this from the perspective of selling "X" starter sets and <X expansion set add-ons... with a collectable game the inverse is true... and this makes all the difference in the price.

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I. J. Thompson said:

 Holy moly... looking at the more recent Wings of War planes, they're selling for $15.95 each...

Eeeccchh... NOT good news, IJT, since as I'd mentioned elsewhere Things Lucas pretty much always cost noticeably more than comparable unlicensed products. I had guessed $12.95 SW ships compared to a $12.95 plane. Now you're telling us planes are $15.95??!

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 Yep, can't forget to give King George his piece o' the pie.

I sure could go for some hard facts on the pricing/distribution model of this game... the speculation is starting to freak me out!

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How about this logic...

A case of SWM could be found for at least $120 (30% discount of MSRP) for most consumers when new.  For that you would get the 12 boosters, with 4 VRs and 8 Rares.  Of those 4-5 were ones not worth $5 each on the secondary market.  The Boba Fett you didn't pull was going for $50 or more.  Sure you got a bunch of other C/UCs, but those are mostly filler.  To get a complete set, you could easily expect to shell out $250-300 for the 40 piece sets if you bought by the case and got some trades.  For that same $300 you can get 20 ships at $15 each assuming you don't find them discounted price.  20 ships that are the exact ones you wanted to buy as well with no crappy VR pulls. :)

Or for the price of one WotC booster with yet another Rare you have 4 of already, you can buy a TIE fighter that you want.  Maybe they will sell the TIEs in packs of two if the game balance is meant to be two for every X-wing (?)  We can hope.

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You're oversimplifying, Squid. First, for the price of a case, you'd get 96 minis. A lot were ones you'd want multiples of; stormtroopers, sandpeople, rebel scum, whatever. You'd get all the Rares. You'd also get four (half of the) VRs, most of which you'd be happy for. SWM gave us THOUSANDS of figures, and they were nice. They were also affordable.

I hope the LordGodKing doesn't overestimate the love of Star Wars in this globally feeble economy and just figure, "hey - they'll pay what I tell them to, because it's Star Wars." This isn't 2001. Times have changed a bit.

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 This makes me wonder how far into production (of future sets/singles) they already are. Like, if they release the starter and only make 1/5 of their projected sales because of the harsh economy and such, they're presumably going to want to sell the subsequent ships that they've already made, and maybe rethink the pricing a bit? Or am I reaching on that one?

Still, Squid89, you make good points in terms of plain dollars spent. I was never a set-completer, though - I would always just buy one case of SWM, and hope I'd get the VRs I wanted. So I was in for about $100. I think I'll probably just stick to my plan of buying one of each ship type, unless I find some super deals.

Still, I love that in this game, that one ship you buy is customizable with different pilots and loadouts (is that the word?). So you may not be able to afford that B-wing that you always wanted until next payday or whatever, but you can still take your X-wing and soup it up with Luke Skywalker, R2-D2*, and proton torpedoes and play to win. You don't 'need' that shiny new ship to win the tournament, say (not that I ever played in tournaments, but I may have to start, just to justify the expense!).

 

* Not yet confirmed! lengua.gif

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IG-58 said:

You're oversimplifying, Squid. First, for the price of a case, you'd get 96 minis. A lot were ones you'd want multiples of; stormtroopers, sandpeople, rebel scum, whatever. You'd get all the Rares. You'd also get four (half of the) VRs, most of which you'd be happy for. SWM gave us THOUSANDS of figures, and they were nice. They were also affordable.

I know - I agree.  I was just trying to reach for something to help justify future expenses.  Part of comparing these ships to R/VRs only is more about the sculpt/paint quality.  In SWM, the C/UC were mostly good for the cost and quantity, but this game seems to go more for the higher end quality pieces.  SWM needed more pieces and activations for strategy, this game seems to be about only a couple pieces needed.

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Just for grins, trying to feel things out, I went onto Noble Knight to look for Wings of War ships. MOST were at $11.95, a buck cheaper that the MSRP of $12.95. A handful were $10.00, and a few were as high as $65.00, suggesting that there may indeed be small-release "chase pieces"  we can look forward to.

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As an aside...

I played "Settlers of Catan" for the first time tonight, with DogSolitude. Man, it was fun! I... ah, got beat both times. But it was fun, and quick, and easy, and it was made of cardboard and wood.

Juuust sayin'.

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Price is a huge concern for even hard core gamers like myself in this day and age. When u come down to it I need to budget and cut out games that i love LESS then ones that I just cant live without. So if just doing a brief comparison to WOW mini's, guessing the X-wing will be similar or worse price wise. then

I have to say I may not make it beyond the core set and one or possibly two boosters. Knowing that id have to cut X-wing entirely and focus on the one im really excited about the Star Wars LCG. Im also an old Star wars Mini's fan and want to see a Land Based Mini Star Wars game from FFG. So ill probably hold out until they have that.

So that pretty much means the odds of me being able to afford and therefore really get into X-wing are very low to none.

I think many ppl are in the same boat as me and thus unless they lower the cost or give us more bang for our buck its just not equitable.

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Here's my 2 cents, I would pay a little bit more for the game since I would know what I am buying. There is nothing more frustrating than throwing down 13 bucks for a pack of minis and poof, all you get are doubles, including the VR, and the VR being one of the $5 and below type. Not good to resell and crap for trade bait. But I would save up for the $40 and be happy with the fact that I know what I am getting. Sure, getting only 3 ships is kinda expensive, but has anyone seen the quality of the ships? Maybe they are worth the 40 bucks.

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Just from the initial photos, it LOOKS like the ships will be along the line of the delightful F-Toys, but somewhat smaller; because of this, they will inevitably have a little less resolution (thicker cannon barrels and so on) than the larger model, but they still look to be pretty good.

I'm also thinking - just my guess, now - that the medium will be a resin. Seems like a great many small collectibles are produced in resin rather than metal or plastic these days.

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 The difference between resin and metal is obvious, but the difference between resin and plastic isn't so much, to a layman such as myself. Can you describe, or point us to some info?

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I. J. Thompson said:

 The difference between resin and metal is obvious, but the difference between resin and plastic isn't so much, to a layman such as myself. Can you describe, or point us to some info?

Resin is... well, resin, and plastic comes in three forms, so far as hobbies go: polyethylene, which is the squishy soft plastic that is incredibly durable but does NOT take paint well and goes all bendy; polystyrene, which is the hard plastic that model kits have been tradionally made from; and ABS, a newer hard plastic that has improved properties.

Polyethylene & resin need to be glued with superglue or epoxy. These glues do not affect the material, but just bond them together as best as can be. Both these mediums need to be washed with a mild detergent, or rubbing alcohol, prior to any attempts at gluing or painting as they carry mold residue that will repel both glue & paint.

Polystyrene & ABS are much easier to work with, and are assembled with model glue. This glue actually sorta melts or disintegrates the plastic itself, allowing the two parts to actually merge a bit, and when dry forms a solid bond. This also means, "less is more" with model glue. The biggest mistake novice modellers make is going buck-wild with the cement. For assembly, washing is not necessary but if you have big, smooth surfaces I'd still wash 'em first to allow the (later applied) paint to adhere better.

A final note: Resin can actually be used by amateurs in the home. Plastic... eeeh, not so much. SO, you can get this awesome variety of what are called "garage kits" made at home by very talented folks who produce kits of unusual subjects the Big Dogs won't touch. These are obviously labor-intensive and the molds don't last too long and, combined with the cost of materials & small production runs, are far more expensive than equivalent styrene kits from Revell, Pegasus or whatever. Nonetheless, some of 'em are reeeeally worth it. I recently surrendered seventy bucks for an 11" long kit of the Star Wars Dreadnought (THAT'S a big hunka resin!), and just (after three years of trying) finally won a 12" model of the Discovery from 2001 for the base price of $40 (free shipping). Boo-yah!!

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I hope they don´t miss support the european market like WOTC. -.- WOTC missed a lot of money this way ... only the hardcore fans knows the SW Miniatures game. They missed a big pool of consumers because they didn´t support us in any way. No promotion, no support, nothing. sad.gif


I really need an new miniature game ... I hope of a version like D.W. just with a SW Theme with an intelligent game play....
happy.gif

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TK4334 said:

 

I hope they don´t miss support the european market like WOTC. -.- WOTC missed a lot of money this way ... only the hardcore fans knows the SW Miniatures game. They missed a big pool of consumers because they didn´t support us in any way. No promotion, no support, nothing. sad.gif

 

Yeah, WotC are IDIOTS for completely ignoring the European market. THey allowed their fiercest competition to completely take over the market in Germany.

 

But it will pretty much depend on the local publisher. I'm quite sure here in Germany it will be the Heidelberger Spieleverlag, so support should be excellent. Which country are you from?

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jhaelen said:

Yeah, WotC are IDIOTS for completely ignoring the European market.

WotC NO idiots – if you don’t know, they bury all Star Wars games for a reason – to destroy any “resistance” to Magic the Gathering. “Decipher”, previous SW card game creators sell more cards, than WotC’s MtG. To kill this concurrent, WotC (part of “Hasbro”) ask Lucas (George has percent in “Hasbro”) to gain license to them and he did it. Firstly they shut down SW TCG without any words of explanation, then SW Miniatures and RPG. They NEWER properly support any Star Wars game – if you compare prizes for SW TCG World Championship and Magic the Gathering World Championship (for SW – TV panel and Playstation 2, for SW Miniatures – full set of miniatures [cost-250-350 $] and for MtG - 250.000$ only for the first place, 1.000.000$ total) you understand it – why support any other game, created UNDER license, if they have their OWN game – MtG. And as we see, WotC support MtG on ALL levels – prizes, money e.t.c...

 

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But that doesn't make any sense. The markets are completely different. I have ZERO interest in MtG, but gave them plenty of money for lil' men (and for gaming books). Now, I don't give Wizards of the Coast money for anything. Where's the logic in that?

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 Truly. WotC would have loved to make barrels of money off of Star Wars. But the licensing/manufacturing costs shrunk their margins to such a degree that the whole line went down the tank. The same thing happened to D&D Miniatures (in the manufacturing department, anyway).

I love a good conspiracy theory, but this... is not.

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jhaelen said:

TK4334 said:

 

I hope they don´t miss support the european market like WOTC. -.- WOTC missed a lot of money this way ... only the hardcore fans knows the SW Miniatures game. They missed a big pool of consumers because they didn´t support us in any way. No promotion, no support, nothing. sad.gif

 

Yeah, WotC are IDIOTS for completely ignoring the European market. THey allowed their fiercest competition to completely take over the market in Germany.

 

But it will pretty much depend on the local publisher. I'm quite sure here in Germany it will be the Heidelberger Spieleverlag, so support should be excellent. Which country are you from?




WOTC is history for me now ... I really liked the Game but it is death now .. :/

I´m from Germany too, so there seems to be hope for us ;D

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