# Counters of Different Sizes, Why?

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The rulebook doesn't explain why there are counters of different sizes. Do they represent something? The size differences is not eye-friendly you really can't tell if there are 2 or 3 or even more different sizes. Even putting them together I need to focus to see if they are different sizes or not. Why there are different sizes? Do bigger ones represent 5 counters?

Also, I was thinking about "Gaining" something. When you "Gain" life it means your life buffer is increased permanently. How do you keep track of that? I am guessing maybe the bigger size cones go for the permanent-gain to indicate that your character has +1 life permanently and when you lose life counters you keep that counter on top of the character sheet to remind you that your character no longer has , say, 4 life but now he has 5 life and can heal up to 5 lives when possible and not to the original 4 life. (if I am making any sense).

So, why do we have different size counters and how do you keep track of the "gained" size of life (sense unlike strength and craft life decreases and can be healed while strength when taken it is taken and cannot be healed).

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The larger cones represent 5 of an attribute, so if you have one large and two small, you are at seven of whatever.

Rules - Page 15, under Limited Resources:

If a character is able to trade five 1–point counters for the corresponding one 5–point counter, he must do so.

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yewsef said:

Also, I was thinking about "Gaining" something. When you "Gain" life it means your life buffer is increased permanently. How do you keep track of that? I am guessing maybe the bigger size cones go for the permanent-gain to indicate that your character has +1 life permanently and when you lose life counters you keep that counter on top of the character sheet to remind you that your character no longer has , say, 4 life but now he has 5 life and can heal up to 5 lives when possible and not to the original 4 life. (if I am making any sense).

If you gain a life, then you may take a life counter, even if your life value is at max.

The same goes for strength, craft and fate.

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Velhart said:

yewsef said:

Also, I was thinking about "Gaining" something. When you "Gain" life it means your life buffer is increased permanently. How do you keep track of that? I am guessing maybe the bigger size cones go for the permanent-gain to indicate that your character has +1 life permanently and when you lose life counters you keep that counter on top of the character sheet to remind you that your character no longer has , say, 4 life but now he has 5 life and can heal up to 5 lives when possible and not to the original 4 life. (if I am making any sense).

If you gain a life, then you may take a life counter, even if your life value is at max.

The same goes for strength, craft and fate.

Let's say my life starts as 4 life.

I "gain" life and I am now 5 life.

Then because of encounters I lose 2 lives so I am down to 3 lives.

Then I get the option to fully heal. I go back to my character sheet, it says 4 life so I heal 1 life. However, I should heal 2 lives because I "gained" life and my life total is now 5 instead of 4 but because there's no method of recording this I forgot that my life changed from 4 to 5.

Unless, when you gain life.. you really are not "leveling up" your life but merely you gain some excess buffer that might be taken out and then your life will always cap at your character's starting life number. (if that makes sense).

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yewsef said:

Let's say my life starts as 4 life.

I "gain" life and I am now 5 life.

Then because of encounters I lose 2 lives so I am down to 3 lives.

Then I get the option to fully heal. I go back to my character sheet, it says 4 life so I heal 1 life. However, I should heal 2 lives because I "gained" life and my life total is now 5 instead of 4 but because there's no method of recording this I forgot that my life changed from 4 to 5.

Unless, when you gain life.. you really are not "leveling up" your life but merely you gain some excess buffer that might be taken out and then your life will always cap at your character's starting life number. (if that makes sense).

Gain a life is not permanent.

In your explanation, he starts with 4 life, and he gains a life, but he lose 2 lives due to encounters. after that, he heals his life to his life value ( that's 4)

that's it

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Velhart said:

yewsef said:

Let's say my life starts as 4 life.

I "gain" life and I am now 5 life.

Then because of encounters I lose 2 lives so I am down to 3 lives.

Then I get the option to fully heal. I go back to my character sheet, it says 4 life so I heal 1 life. However, I should heal 2 lives because I "gained" life and my life total is now 5 instead of 4 but because there's no method of recording this I forgot that my life changed from 4 to 5.

Unless, when you gain life.. you really are not "leveling up" your life but merely you gain some excess buffer that might be taken out and then your life will always cap at your character's starting life number. (if that makes sense).

Gain a life is not permanent.

In your explanation, he starts with 4 life, and he gains a life, but he lose 2 lives due to encounters. after that, he heals his life to his life value ( that's 4)

that's it

Thanks this clarifies everything.

Gee I am complicating the game too much everything seems straight forward. I just see the FGG logo on the box and I just say... no there's a trick, things shouldn't be that easy.

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Are the counters in the FFG version clear? I have the BI version, and all the tokens are the same size. It's quite hard to distinguish a 1 from a 4, especially if they're next to a character sheet of the player across the table.

I'm considering making all the BI tokens count as "1", regardless of the number they show, just so it's easier to see.

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Thels said:

Are the counters in the FFG version clear? I have the BI version, and all the tokens are the same size. It's quite hard to distinguish a 1 from a 4, especially if they're next to a character sheet of the player across the table.

I'm considering making all the BI tokens count as "1", regardless of the number they show, just so it's easier to see.

They are cones of 2 different sizes (value 1 and 5 respectively). Never had a problem with FFG counters.

With the BI version, I recommend that you paint the numbers on the counters with white or other bright colour (I painted them gold). This will make your life easier.

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The_Warlock said:

They are cones of 2 different sizes (value 1 and 5 respectively). Never had a problem with FFG counters

I've read about them in the Revised PDF (That actually tells a thing or 2 more than the brief Revision sheet tells you). I just wondered how they work out.

They also seem to indicate that you only use counters for your Strength and Craft in surplus of your base Strength and Craft, which gives me mixed ideas. If the FFG cones are more obvious than the BI counters, then you're wasting that advantage by not clearly showing the total Strength and Craft. This is a non-issue for experienced players that know the character stats by head, but might be inconvenient for newer players.

The_Warlock said:

With the BI version, I recommend that you paint the numbers on the counters with white or other bright colour (I painted them gold). This will make your life easier.

I'm too afraid of making a total mess of things when I try to do those things myself. I still gotta put myself to printing those Overlays from Talisman Island and glueing them to my board, as constantly looking up the rules for them (or more specifically, reminding new players which areas have been adjusted) is annoying.

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Thels said:

They also seem to indicate that you only use counters for your Strength and Craft in surplus of your base Strength and Craft, which gives me mixed ideas. If the FFG cones are more obvious than the BI counters, then you're wasting that advantage by not clearly showing the total Strength and Craft. This is a non-issue for experienced players that know the character stats by head, but might be inconvenient for newer players.

Perhaps Rules say so, but we've always tracked our total Strength or Craft, except the bonuses from Objects and Followers, just as we do with Lives. There are enough cones in the box for this.

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