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arkangl2

Aliens for Dust

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Grand Inquisitor Fulminarex said:

If you want regular troops, it is pretty simple: They are Armor 1, and their weapons are similar. For Axis you have the STG 43 Assault Rifle, which I would drop the armor 1 attack option and reduce its combat die to 1/1 across the board, and perhaps make them Agile. I would also increase the unit size by 3 - 5 figures.

Allied would follow the same as the Axis.

It is with tanks where the problem arises. I think Tanks are going to be bigger and faster and better armored for the most part. I keep seeing the Panther 2 with a dual cannon and dual nebelwerfers, but slow and requiring a larger turn radius, which would involve a possible template. Allied tanks would be similar.

Except we should see some elite troops (the "Dust" special ops units are brigade size or so) which might be interesting, but troops could be simulated fairly easily. 

Tanks are a problem because IMO, other than in tight, cluttered environments, the walker would be at a disadvantage. 

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Algesan said:

Grand Inquisitor Fulminarex said:

 

If you want regular troops, it is pretty simple: They are Armor 1, and their weapons are similar. For Axis you have the STG 43 Assault Rifle, which I would drop the armor 1 attack option and reduce its combat die to 1/1 across the board, and perhaps make them Agile. I would also increase the unit size by 3 - 5 figures.

Allied would follow the same as the Axis.

It is with tanks where the problem arises. I think Tanks are going to be bigger and faster and better armored for the most part. I keep seeing the Panther 2 with a dual cannon and dual nebelwerfers, but slow and requiring a larger turn radius, which would involve a possible template. Allied tanks would be similar.

 

 

Except we should see some elite troops (the "Dust" special ops units are brigade size or so) which might be interesting, but troops could be simulated fairly easily. 

Tanks are a problem because IMO, other than in tight, cluttered environments, the walker would be at a disadvantage. 

Not really. Tanks have multiple crew running them. Usually at least a NCOIC/OIC, a gunner or two and a driver. You simply make a special rule for Tanks as follows.

Tank: Models with the Tank Trait are dependent upon a crew of well trained men. As these men become injured, lose morale or die the effeciancy of the tank suffers. When a tank is reduced to half its + it only has one action per round instead of two.

Lumbering: Tanks are large vehicles not known for grace or agility. To change facing for shooting or to move in another direction, the tank must spend one move action.

As for basic troops. YES PLEASE. Sure a large portion of the game is about elite units from ASOCOM and the Blutkreuz. But it owuld be nice to see how elit elite these blokes are by letting them tear into some mundane troopers.

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Tanks will also be more stable, with better aiming points and able to carry a variety of ammunition.   They'd also be more reliable and probably faster.

Multiple crew wouldn't just be a disadvantage, it would be an advantage.  No longer would you depend on one person to both direct the movement, aim the weapons, reload the weapons, etc.  Instead you have a commander who directs individuals to do the jobs they are devoted to.  So you get a driver driving while the loader loads and the gunner aims and shoots.  Higher rate of fire and maybe even more dice...

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Don't know about a tank being slow to turn:

 And more crew would not be a disadvantage if one got killed, sure it won't be as efficient, but knock one crew out of a one-man mech and it don't work anymore at all.

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Major Mishap said:

Don't know about a tank being slow to turn:

 And more crew would not be a disadvantage if one got killed, sure it won't be as efficient, but knock one crew out of a one-man mech and it don't work anymore at all.

Heh, it depends on maintenance and that one is many generations past the antiques from WW2. 

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Major Mishap said:

Don't know about a tank being slow to turn:

 And more crew would not be a disadvantage if one got killed, sure it won't be as efficient, but knock one crew out of a one-man mech and it don't work anymore at all.

That is what I assume happens when the mech hits 0 health, the crew member is dead or otherwise incapacitated. I think tanks would have at least health 6 or health 4 and damage resilience to reflect multiple crew members.

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Major Mishap said:

Don't know about a tank being slow to turn:

 And more crew would not be a disadvantage if one got killed, sure it won't be as efficient, but knock one crew out of a one-man mech and it don't work anymore at all.

OK, so it can turn in place fairly well. But what about when its moving, moving around streets, rubble, buildings, alleys. dumpsters, trees and so forth?

Cool vid by the way.

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Algesan said:

Tanks will also be more stable, with better aiming points and able to carry a variety of ammunition.   They'd also be more reliable and probably faster.

Multiple crew wouldn't just be a disadvantage, it would be an advantage.  No longer would you depend on one person to both direct the movement, aim the weapons, reload the weapons, etc.  Instead you have a commander who directs individuals to do the jobs they are devoted to.  So you get a driver driving while the loader loads and the gunner aims and shoots.  Higher rate of fire and maybe even more dice...

Well, the theory that less people in a tank makes a better tank is crap. The French tanks in WW2 based on theory should have been better, but the Germans had "Armor Efficiency" with 4 or 5 men in a tank, and they had double the fire capacity of a French Tank. So fewer people in a tank does not mean a better tank.

The walkers are good because they are basically a giant infantry combat suit. The advantage to the tank in Dust would be better armor, room for advanced systems, probably double the guns with autoloaders, and faster than a walker. They will have fewer crew than the say a 1945 King Tiger, probably 3 crew, but they will be bigger, faster, and far more powerful than the tiger.

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Peacekeeper_b said:

Major Mishap said:

 

Don't know about a tank being slow to turn:

 And more crew would not be a disadvantage if one got killed, sure it won't be as efficient, but knock one crew out of a one-man mech and it don't work anymore at all.

 

 

OK, so it can turn in place fairly well. But what about when its moving, moving around streets, rubble, buildings, alleys. dumpsters, trees and so forth?

....A lot better than a walker will, a walker could trip over obstacles a tank will crush them or drive through it.  The only problem a tank has is being able to rotate its turret without snagging the gun barrel, but a walker might have the same problem.  Google some more vids of tanks in action, I even found some of the power-sliding :)

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Major Mishap said:

Peacekeeper_b said:

 

Major Mishap said:

 

Don't know about a tank being slow to turn:

 And more crew would not be a disadvantage if one got killed, sure it won't be as efficient, but knock one crew out of a one-man mech and it don't work anymore at all.

 

 

OK, so it can turn in place fairly well. But what about when its moving, moving around streets, rubble, buildings, alleys. dumpsters, trees and so forth?

 

 

....A lot better than a walker will, a walker could trip over obstacles a tank will crush them or drive through it.  The only problem a tank has is being able to rotate its turret without snagging the gun barrel, but a walker might have the same problem.  Google some more vids of tanks in action, I even found some of the power-sliding :)

I used to vidoe and document tanks in action when I was stationed in Germany. Ive seen them do plenty of things. Mostly Ive seen them get bogged down by large obstacles, tight terrain and yes, even mud.

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Thread hijacked!

I'm not denying that this game is much cheaper to keep up with than GW stuff. Although a good thing, it's still $. Being able to afford to buy them is no my issue.

As for playing just one race, So far I like the Axis. However I let my friend use them more when we play. What happens if I end up liking the Aliens more when they are out? :P I'm just worried about these early/vanilla units becoming obsolete, much like gear in an MMO. Of course people can always stop collecting and just play w/ what you have, but just knowing all kinds of new stuff is coming out makes it hard. :(

I do love the game, I own 2 base sets and plan to buy everything currently available for both sides, except the re-released base units. I've also begun painting it all.

I just hope they can keep all the units useful.

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Back to the crew debate:

Looking at the models after my last reply, I noticed that although the Axis Mediums obviously are rigged for one crew, the Allied Mediums have to have at least two crew, if not three.  Which actually messes with their scale some, but there has to at least be a driver up front since they just lifted the Sherman turret and part of the body.

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