Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
Hygrom

Got an explored-marker and do ... nothing?

Recommended Posts

When an investigator returns from another world and gets an explored-marker.


The rules say:

"While he remains in the gate’s location, he is no longer drawn through the gate, but may instead try to close or seal the gate"

Does "may" mean that he must not either close or seal the gate?

Can he simply do nothing at all und just sit there and wait for the perfect time to close/seal the gate? Perhaps waiting for another investigator in the same world or things like that?

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

if you don't want to close/seal (the king in yellow tome, for instance) right now but later, you can do that. just remember that the free pass on monsters on the gate is only during the same round as returning. so any monsters, new (monster surge) or old, have to be slaughtered or evaded.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yep, monsters on the location can be a problem, but imagine nmo monsters on or near the location. The investigator is sitting there in a really safe position. He has not the risk of encounters or monsters (except surges). The only risk is the time running out turn by turn, while he does nothing, wasting actions.

But "sitting there on a location, doing nothing?" a "pro-investigator"-rule in Arkham Horror? Come on, you are even forced to buy something in the shops, somehow this investigator-friendly rule makes me nervous ^^

I assume that this is just your opinion and I would like to hear additional statements to have an overview of the common opinion.

In my opinion the "may" relays to "he may close or seal the gate", not to "he may close or seal the gate or do nothing". Otherwise a "must" would have been a better choice than "may", in this case.

 

 

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hygrom, Taurmindo is right. In fact, you can squat on the gate and stay there waiting for your friends to toss you an ES or a King in Yellow, or simply waiting for another couple of guys sitting on the remaining gates and then close all of them at once for a closing victory. Sometimes it's the only way to beat the game (quite often in Atlach games). I'm with you when you say it's rather odd to see a rule in favour of the investigators, but I tend not to consider this as a rule, but as a strategy. You risk *a lot* while sitting on gates. Especially high frequency ones. Not to mention that all the time you pass on a gate, it's time you waste for doing other stuff.

The forced shopping was due to the fact game designers wanted not to have people farming for Elder Signs (something you can easily do anyway, by simply sending there Ashcan Pete with only 1$); and thematically it's expained with the idea you go shopping searching for something helpful in your fight against the AO; being time a major issued, you grab the first less useless thing you find

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Okay, thank you for the answers. It makes sense at all, I was just wondering, because having the possibility to do just... nothing, did not fit in my experience with AH.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Julia said:

The forced shopping was due to the fact game designers wanted not to have people farming for Elder Signs (something you can easily do anyway, by simply sending there Ashcan Pete with only 1$)

 

....wait, what? How can Pete get a 5$ ES if he has only 1$?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tox said:

....wait, what? How can Pete get a 5$ ES if he has only 1$?

::laughter:: send him to the Curiosity Shoppe with 1$ (or 0$). Even if he isn't able to buy anything, he's allowed to draw and discard. Do this until he draws an Elder Sign. Since he cannot afford it, it's put on the bottom of the deck. Then give Pete 5$. Since he's allowed to draw even from the bottom of the deck, int he following turn he can re-draw the ES. This time he has the money, and buys it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have Pete continue to shop, discarding things he can't buy. He makes sure that any Elder Signs get discarded to the very bottom, then has someone give him $4 so he can use his ability to buy it by drawing from the bottom.

Seems like a really convoluted tactic for me, so I haven't tried it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tibs said:

Have Pete continue to shop, discarding things he can't buy. He makes sure that any Elder Signs get discarded to the very bottom, then has someone give him $4 so he can use his ability to buy it by drawing from the bottom.

Seems like a really convoluted tactic for me, so I haven't tried it.

There is nothing in the rules to stop this, but it just doesn't "feel" like Arkham.

Darling, C'thulu is waking up again. Would you mind popping down to the shops and seeing if there is an elder sign in stock? If there isn't, can you just stay there until one arrives? Thanks dear.

I remember my early days of playing arkham (just the base game), a basic tactic was "lets get to the shop for an elder sign!". Drawing an elder sign with starting posessions was the holy grail.

As I got better at the game, elder signs became more of a safety net. Something to hang on to "just in case". Then eventually the game became easy as elder signs were never to be used.

Now I've added innsmouth I'm back to wanting elder signs again! Only this time there is much less chance of finding one due to the small box expansions I own increasing the size of the Unique deck.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hygrom said:

 

In my opinion the "may" relays to "he may close or seal the gate", not to "he may close or seal the gate or do nothing". Otherwise a "must" would have been a better choice than "may", in this case.

 

If you want a thematic reason to justify being able to choose not to close a gate then here is my attempt: You need this option in case one of your colleagues is still in the gate and this is the only way out.

I can think of many films where the hero has delayed saving the day to save the life of a collegaue (OK, it's usually because it's a beautiful woman) but it does happen.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Julia said:

Tox said:

 

....wait, what? How can Pete get a 5$ ES if he has only 1$?

 

 

::laughter:: send him to the Curiosity Shoppe with 1$ (or 0$). Even if he isn't able to buy anything, he's allowed to draw and discard. Do this until he draws an Elder Sign. Since he cannot afford it, it's put on the bottom of the deck. Then give Pete 5$. Since he's allowed to draw even from the bottom of the deck, int he following turn he can re-draw the ES. This time he has the money, and buys it.

No, you need at least 1 dollar to shop. You can't shop with zero dollars.  I'm 99% sure that this is the case.  Anyone want to confirm it with a quote?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tibs said:

Have Pete continue to shop, discarding things he can't buy. He makes sure that any Elder Signs get discarded to the very bottom, then has someone give him $4 so he can use his ability to buy it by drawing from the bottom.

Seems like a really convoluted tactic for me, so I haven't tried it.

I think it'd be very easy to pull off...  It's just it'd unbalance the game.  I don't think it's very convoluted...  It's almost the equivalent of Pete gaining 5-6 bucks per turn.  ...  Except he can do it from turn one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Avi_dreader said:

Julia said:

 

Tox said:

 

....wait, what? How can Pete get a 5$ ES if he has only 1$?

 

 

::laughter:: send him to the Curiosity Shoppe with 1$ (or 0$). Even if he isn't able to buy anything, he's allowed to draw and discard. Do this until he draws an Elder Sign. Since he cannot afford it, it's put on the bottom of the deck. Then give Pete 5$. Since he's allowed to draw even from the bottom of the deck, int he following turn he can re-draw the ES. This time he has the money, and buys it.

 

 

No, you need at least 1 dollar to shop. You can't shop with zero dollars.  I'm 99% sure that this is the case.  Anyone want to confirm it with a quote?

 

Pretty sure you can pick those 3 items even with 0$. It isnt mentioned anywhere. Maybe Tibs have some trick up his sleeve about it but it is stated nowhere you cant pick those 3 items into your hands if you dont have money. It just like trying to shop some good items but finaly you do not buy any of em. Like youre not FORCED to buy any of these.Anyway, Pete starts with 1$ and even if you couldnt pick em with 0$, it super easy to bypass by pooling him lol.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Saikoro said:

Avi_dreader said:

 

Julia said:

 

Tox said:

 

....wait, what? How can Pete get a 5$ ES if he has only 1$?

 

 

::laughter:: send him to the Curiosity Shoppe with 1$ (or 0$). Even if he isn't able to buy anything, he's allowed to draw and discard. Do this until he draws an Elder Sign. Since he cannot afford it, it's put on the bottom of the deck. Then give Pete 5$. Since he's allowed to draw even from the bottom of the deck, int he following turn he can re-draw the ES. This time he has the money, and buys it.

 

 

No, you need at least 1 dollar to shop. You can't shop with zero dollars.  I'm 99% sure that this is the case.  Anyone want to confirm it with a quote?

 

 

 

Pretty sure you can pick those 3 items even with 0$. It isnt mentioned anywhere. Maybe Tibs have some trick up his sleeve about it but it is stated nowhere you cant pick those 3 items into your hands if you dont have money. It just like trying to shop some good items but finaly you do not buy any of em. Like youre not FORCED to buy any of these.Anyway, Pete starts with 1$ and even if you couldnt pick em with 0$, it super easy to bypass by pooling him lol.

I'm 99% sure that you have to have at least $1, too. I don't have a quote, but I remember reading it in a rules clarification or an FAQ..

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Good to know (and thank you guys), even if this doesn't matter at all, at least to me, since it's not something I'll ever do. I know, exploiting this kind of things is part of the strategy, but hey, it's not the way I live Arkham. Thx for clarifying anyway! I missed this entry in the rules / FAQ ::taking notes::

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Saikoro said:

Avi_dreader said:

 

Julia said:

 

Tox said:

 

....wait, what? How can Pete get a 5$ ES if he has only 1$?

 

 

::laughter:: send him to the Curiosity Shoppe with 1$ (or 0$). Even if he isn't able to buy anything, he's allowed to draw and discard. Do this until he draws an Elder Sign. Since he cannot afford it, it's put on the bottom of the deck. Then give Pete 5$. Since he's allowed to draw even from the bottom of the deck, int he following turn he can re-draw the ES. This time he has the money, and buys it.

 

 

No, you need at least 1 dollar to shop. You can't shop with zero dollars.  I'm 99% sure that this is the case.  Anyone want to confirm it with a quote?

 

 

 

Pretty sure you can pick those 3 items even with 0$. It isnt mentioned anywhere. Maybe Tibs have some trick up his sleeve about it but it is stated nowhere you cant pick those 3 items into your hands if you dont have money. It just like trying to shop some good items but finaly you do not buy any of em. Like youre not FORCED to buy any of these.Anyway, Pete starts with 1$ and even if you couldnt pick em with 0$, it super easy to bypass by pooling him lol.

That's the fun thing about Arkham Horror ;'D it has non-euclidean rules lurking in the walls.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I too I'm pretty sure you can't shop without money. I read it *somewhere*. With so many rulebooks and official FAQs and unofficial explanation it's hard to keep track of everything :P I'm also going to check if there are Uniques that cost 1$. If not, you shouldn't be allowed to shop with just 1$!

 

Anyway, I haven't drawn an Elder Sign for the past 10 or more games, and I do occasionally shop at the Shoppe. They're just too rare these days... (;.;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Found something in the Innsmouth FAQ:

Q: Can an investigator use a location’s special ability even if he
can’t meet its requirements?


A: No. In order to choose to execute a location’s special ability
(instead of having an encounter in that location), an investigator
must be able to meet its printed requirements. For example, a
character without sufficient trophies can’t avoid an encounter
at the Police Station by choosing to execute that location’s
special ability, and then failing to do so for lack of meeting its
requirements.

I also found:

Q: Why wouldn’t investigators camp out at the Curiositie Shoppe
and buy the four elder signs?


A: An investigator shopping at the Curiositie Shoppe or General
Store must purchase one of the three items drawn if he has
enough money to do so. This tends to deplete investigators’
funds before they can “browse” the entire Unique Item deck for
all of its elder signs.

 

So there it is. You,in fact, need that 1$ in order to be able ''activate'' the special ability of the shop. Also, when you visit the shop, you MUST buy an item if able so it prevent ''Unique Farming''. So in order to ''abuse'' Aschan Pete skill you need to have at least 1$,then you put the elder signe at the bottom.Then you pool him the money for it +1$ so he can do it over and over.If hes checking the uniques with more than 1$ and he can afford one of them, he MUST buy it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah, that's the point. Keep him at $1 until he finds one.

It's too unpredictable to be a viable strategy, and it holds one (possibly two) of your characters at bay. It's not a tactic I'd consider pursuing, and it wouldn't be all that fun.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Tibs said:

 

Yeah, that's the point. Keep him at $1 until he finds one.

It's too unpredictable to be a viable strategy, and it holds one (possibly two) of your characters at bay. It's not a tactic I'd consider pursuing, and it wouldn't be all that fun.

 

 

I disagree.  The likelihoods of being able to pick up a King in Yellow or some Elder Signs are good.  And what else are you going to use your three movement character for?

It's just...  It's boring.  So I wouldn't do it.  Except maaaaybe in solitaire in a three investigator game.  It'd make the game too easy if played in a 4 investigator game I think.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Taurmindo said:

i'd rather recommend daisy with alchemical process and just buy the crap out of the shop instead of passing all items by..

Well...  Yeah, that's another way of going about things.  It's good for Elder Sign acquisition in particular.  But even Daisy can't turn a King in Yellow to near infinite clues, or an Eltdown Shards into a draining of the doom track (unless you buy up the entire unique item deck except for those cards ;'D which I did for one of the league games).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Avi_dreader said:

Taurmindo said:

 

i'd rather recommend daisy with alchemical process and just buy the crap out of the shop instead of passing all items by..

 

 

Well...  Yeah, that's another way of going about things.  It's good for Elder Sign acquisition in particular.  But even Daisy can't turn a King in Yellow to near infinite clues, or an Eltdown Shards into a draining of the doom track (unless you buy up the entire unique item deck except for those cards ;'D which I did for one of the league games).

true. but speaking of infinitive clues, the way to do it (without making it both boring hanging out at the store, and not really exploiting the game) is to use Illuminated Manuscript with either Harvey, Carolyn or anyone with the healing stone. or the terrible old man. or Ammi Pierce.. or someone at the hospital.

really, it's quite easy with the illuminated manuscript.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...