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Two Weapon Weilder (Melee vs. Ranged)

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RAW:

a chain axe is a 1h weapon

a naval shield is a 1h weapon

an omnissian axe is a 1h weapon

any pistol is a 1h weapon

any one of these can be mounted by a machinator array amplified gun mechadendrite and I can affix up to  gun mechadendrites with a TB of 6

 

why a shield if I can use this fancy utility mechadendrite?

because it is a SHIELD in game terms... cover and 8 additional AP can be life <> death

of course as soon as I worked out weight for a door sized piece of ship hull to carry around for 16-64 AP I'll use my utility mecha to defend and have some real cover

next a shield can be used as a snowboard/sandboard in case of emergency if your gm allows for it

a naval shield can be used to seal of hull breaches

a naval shield on a 2m arm can be used to give cover to an ally

...

 

back to topic I'm currently waiting to play an arbitrator with a chimera-pistolw-sword and an extra gripped Vanaheim to dualwield both... melee and ranged

anyone who has an idea if I can use an extra gripped weapon with melee attachment in melee with 1h? (in general and in case of the vanaheim)

 

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Sirion said:

who has an idea if I can use an extra gripped weapon with melee attachment in melee with 1h? (in general and in case of the vanaheim)

 

 

If I recall all melee attachments are treated as spears. Spears, if I recall, are two handed. You don't hold a rifle by the grip when you are using a bayonet. So, I would say no, you can't one hand a Vanaheim in melee. Also. I don't believe Extra Grip changes a weapon from basic to pistol. Extra Grip only allows one handed firing at reduced range. If this is correct, then no one handed Vanaheim melee shooting either.

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so... all melee attachments work like spears... spear is a melee weapon and voila it can be used in melee no matter if it is a pistol or basic weapon... yet to mention melee attachments are only available for basic weapons which would make them useless if it wouldn't work on them...

I know that I can't melee shoot the vanaheim because it is and will ever be a basic weapon

 

now I have a basic weapon that works like a spear... since it is still a basic weapon I can add an extra grip now the extra grip says I can use it one handed without a penalty... > spear that can be used penaltyless with one hand...

question is: is this vaild? (my gm said yes to an extra gripped melee attached las carbine, but what does RAW say?)
if not what about knife bayonetts?

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 now I have a basic weapon that works like a spear... since it is still a basic weapon I can add an extra grip now the extra grip says I can use it one handed without a penalty... > spear that can be used penaltyless with one hand...

question is: is this vaild? (my gm said yes to an extra gripped melee attached las carbine, but what does RAW say?)

It isn't. The extra grip modifies the original weapon, but the spear has nothing to do with this. You don't get +10 for a laser pointer when using the bayonet either, do you?

 

if not what about knife bayonetts?

The presented bayonets are knife bayonets (what other kind would there be?). But when putting a knife onto a long stick, what you get is essentially a spear.

 

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Cifer said:

 

if not what about knife bayonetts?

The presented bayonets are knife bayonets (what other kind would there be?). But when putting a knife onto a long stick, what you get is essentially a spear.

 

 

There is one published exception that I can find to the "basic weapon with melee attachment equals spear" standard.  That would be the Mark II Scourge Boltgun; Inquisitor's Handbook, page 171.  Counts as a monoaxe in melee.  Though, as stated, this is an exception.

-=Brother Praetus=-

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a "red-dot laser sight" only gives +10 to BS for single shots, so no my melee attacks don't get them, the same goes for overcharged charge packs, etc

"A weapon with a melee attachment counts as a spear in close combat."

so my long las is still a long las it just counts as a spear in melee... it is my long las that I can one wield one handed without a penalty and it is my long las with which I melee attack it just counts as a spear...

next thing... if I tape a knife to a spear I get something like a lance or a spear.... ok but nobody says this has to be a 2h weapon.... there are enough examples of 1h spears and if I recall the rules correctly I can even use these greatweapons one handed if I take a -20 penalty into account

 

these are the reasons I'm asking... It's not that I umltimatively want it to work it's just that I think RAW state it works and I haven't got a good look here page xy, it doesn't work

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 so my long las is still a long las it just counts as a spear in melee... it is my long las that I can one wield one handed without a penalty and it is my long las with which I melee attack it just counts as a spear...

No, you can use it as a spear - and a spear is used two-handed.
(By the way, knocking a long-las around in melee combat this way screams "I don't want that accurate trait anyway!" to me, but I guess that's subjective)

 

next thing... if I tape a knife to a spear I get something like a lance or a spear.... ok but nobody says this has to be a 2h weapon.... 

The rules for the spear say it is.

 

 

 

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 it actually was not a long las I just done it to carbines and normal lasguns by now long las was a mistake (never owned one) but at least the long las would be long enough to be used as an actual spear ;) ...

 

so for this to work I'lnd need to get this mark II scourge boltgun or sit down with my gm how best to make an axe melee attachment

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Considering I still have a character kicking around who's a sister militant with said Scourge Boltgun, I'm intererested in this one/two-handed weapon argument. the standard melee attachment counts the weapon itself as a spear, and thus is used 2-handed in melee. the Scourge Boltgun counts as a Mono-Axe in melee. Mono-axes are one-handed.

So which do I use? It's kind of a moot point considering she's neither ambidextrous nor dual-wielding-proficient, and has a chainsword  for melee anyway, but while logic would dictate a 2-handed weapon (it's still a 10kg boltgun with a bigass axe blade), RAW it would apppear to be 1-handed.

I suppose the fundamental point of this argument is: Do I consider the weapon to take fully the traits of the "melee attachment", or does it still class itself as the original basic weapon but with a "counts-as" traits?

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There's nothing in the rules about basic weapons being two handed. Oh sure, for shooting it gets you a -20 penalty to your BS skill when used in one hand but that's rather unimportant for melee...

A 10 kg gun is still lighter than a standard chain axe, which is one handed.

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so I could use my melee attached las gun as a 1h weapon if using it as an improvised weapon? (club... with a mono edge) 2 damage less ind I insead of R since it doesn't loose it's mono upgrade it still has pen2

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Sirion said:

 

so I could use my melee attached las gun as a 1h weapon if using it as an improvised weapon? (club... with a mono edge) 2 damage less ind I insead of R since it doesn't loose it's mono upgrade it still has pen2

 

 

 

No because it counts as a spear. Spears are two handed weapons by the rules. Counts as mono axe scourge bolt gun is another weapon specially designed for melee combat, melee attached las gun is a weapon designed only for ranged combat with a pointy bit and duct tape.

If I'm the GM you'll have to either get the scourge or have another weapon that works like an axe custom made for more money and taking more time than a standard of the shelf las carbine.

 

Or rather, since on a second read throug it seems you were suggesting that you beat people over the head with the weapon. Sure, one handed improvised weapon works. But that's less damage than a club and I wouldn't let you mono the weapon if it's not designed for melee but just an heavy object youll beat people with.

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