Jump to content
Aahz 1

Clone Wars Pre-Orders

Recommended Posts

On 5/15/2020 at 12:25 PM, Reavern said:

Separatist Fleet Expansion:

  • 2 x Munificent star frigates (medium-size base)

I would lay 2-1 odds that the munificent will be a small base ship. Yes I know that it’s listed as 800+meters long. But Armada has always played it fast and loose with scaling ships. When watching clone wars the munificent fills the role of something like a corvette more than being a heavy ship of its own. Also, from a game play/business perspective it makes more sense to have it as a small base than a medium base ship. They’re not going to have a faction without small base ships. And people aren’t going to want to buy an obscure legends ship as much as the munificent.  For similar reasons the Trade Federation Battleship will be large and not huge. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, bkcammack said:

I would lay 2-1 odds that the munificent will be a small base ship. Yes I know that it’s listed as 800+meters long. But Armada has always played it fast and loose with scaling ships. When watching clone wars the munificent fills the role of something like a corvette more than being a heavy ship of its own. Also, from a game play/business perspective it makes more sense to have it as a small base than a medium base ship. They’re not going to have a faction without small base ships. And people aren’t going to want to buy an obscure legends ship as much as the munificent.  For similar reasons the Trade Federation Battleship will be large and not huge. 

The Munificent didn’t perform the role of a corvette. Firstly, the ship is referred to as the Munificent-class star frigate. That’s its role.

Second, a corvette is a small, fast, and maneuverable escort ship used to protect convoys and fleets of larger warships. The Munificent wasn’t small, fast, or maneuverable. In terms of its performance, it seemed comparable in speed and maneuverability to the Venator.

In the Battle of Saleucami, at least two Munificent frigates fought alongside Grievous’ flagship, a Recuscant dreadnought, and were engaged by two C70 corvette, an Arquitens light frigate, and a Venator. The C70 corvettes flew circles around the CIS warships, whereas the Munificents barely moved.

That’s why I disagree that Munificents performed the role of a corvette.

Regardless, I acknowledge the possibility that FFG might choose to mount the Munificent on a small ship base, because it’s true that FFG isn’t always faithful to canon ship sizes. For example, the MC30 frigate is supposed to be ~580 metres long and have a crew of 820, and it’s on a small ship base; whereas the Quasar Fire light carrier is 340 metres long and a crew of 250, and its on a medium ship base. (Although I think it’s mainly due to the Quasar Fire being significantly wider than the MC30.)

I suppose FFG could put the Munificent on a small ship base and make the plastic ship model slightly longer than the MC30, but the MC30 mini already extends beyond the front and back edge of its small base, which means the Munificent would extend even further; not just the front and back either; the Munificent is supposed to be 426 metres wide, which is more than half its length. That means its “wings” will extend out from the sides of the small ship base too, which might make the model unstable and prone to tipping over or falling off its support fin. That could cause its long, narrow wings to break off — and remember, FFG doesn’t have its amazing Replacement Parts Program anymore, so we wouldn’t be able to get replacements.

So I think the Munificent should be mounted on a medium ship base.

Also, the Munificent is not an “obscure Legends” ship. The Munificent was seen in the Battle of Coruscant at the beginning of RotS and it was the ubiquitous CIS warship in TCW. RotS and TCW are both canon and always have been, thereby making the Munificent canon. When most Star Wars fans think of a Separatist warship, they think of the Munificent — not the Lucrehulk (because that was primarily the Trade Federation’s ship).

Edited by Reavern
Addition: Munificent is canon

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Reavern said:

Also, the Munificent is not an “obscure Legends” ship.

That’s exactly the opposite of what I was saying. The case for making Munificent a small ship is that there aren’t many canon CIS ships smaller than the Munificent. They’re going to want recognizable ships. 
 

And there’s no reason they need to make the Munificent model longer than the MC-30. You could make it smaller and I bet 75% of people wouldn’t even know the relative size was wrong. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, bkcammack said:

And there’s no reason they need to make the Munificent model longer than the MC-30. You could make it smaller and I bet 75% of people wouldn’t even know the relative size was wrong. 

Given the consumer base they're selecting for, I'd bet it's a lot higher than that.

It got a lot of screen time, and many of the people who care enough to buy it are going to have a decent idea of the relative sizing.

If the MC30 and Gladiator appeared anywhere meaningful outside of EAW, I think their sizing would have drawn more scrutiny as well, though they seem to be scaled with the large bases rather than their fellow smalls.  At 800 meters, putting the Munificent on a small base wouldn't really scale it with anything.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, Reavern said:

The Munificent didn’t perform the role of a corvette. Firstly, the ship is referred to as the Munificent-class star frigate. That’s its role.

Second, a corvette is a small, fast, and maneuverable escort ship used to protect convoys and fleets of larger warships. The Munificent wasn’t small, fast, or maneuverable. In terms of its performance, it seemed comparable in speed and maneuverability to the Venator.

In the Battle of Saleucami, at least two Munificent frigates fought alongside Grievous’ flagship, a Recuscant dreadnought, and were engaged by two C70 corvette, an Arquitens light frigate, and a Venator. The C70 corvettes flew circles around the CIS warships, whereas the Munificents barely moved.

That’s why I disagree that Munificents performed the role of a corvette.

Regardless, I acknowledge the possibility that FFG might choose to mount the Munificent on a small ship base, because it’s true that FFG isn’t always faithful to canon ship sizes. For example, the MC30 frigate is supposed to be ~580 metres long and have a crew of 820, and it’s on a small ship base; whereas the Quasar Fire light carrier is 340 metres long and a crew of 250, and its on a medium ship base. (Although I think it’s mainly due to the Quasar Fire being significantly wider than the MC30.)

I suppose FFG could put the Munificent on a small ship base and make the plastic ship model slightly longer than the MC30, but the MC30 mini already extends beyond the front and back edge of its small base, which means the Munificent would extend even further; not just the front and back either; the Munificent is supposed to be 426 metres wide, which is more than half its length. That means its “wings” will extend out from the sides of the small ship base too, which might make the model unstable and prone to tipping over or falling off its support fin. That could cause its long, narrow wings to break off — and remember, FFG doesn’t have its amazing Replacement Parts Program anymore, so we wouldn’t be able to get replacements.

So I think the Munificent should be mounted on a medium ship base.

Also, the Munificent is not an “obscure Legends” ship. The Munificent was seen in the Battle of Coruscant at the beginning of RotS and it was the ubiquitous CIS warship in TCW. RotS and TCW are both canon and always have been, thereby making the Munificent canon. When most Star Wars fans think of a Separatist warship, they think of the Munificent — not the Lucrehulk (because that was primarily the Trade Federation’s ship).

The canon quasar is bigger than the EU quasar.  Unfortunately they have not given us a length, to my knowledge.  But base on a shot of it adjacent to a ISD it is around 500 meters if I am remembering correctly.   Secondly, the MC30 is very skinny.  Its tough because of armadas sliding scale but I thing they have approximated most ships well enough.  (Glares at the assault frigate which is almost the same gerth as the MC80 home one...) 

 

This all reminded me I need to update my Slide scale graph with the SH and OSD. I'll repost in the original sliding scale thread I posted years ago for all who care. Stay tuned.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Crabbok posted this video today about the Clone Wars Fleet Expansions and Squadron Packs:

I was surprised that he thinks the Venator will be in the Republic Fleet Expansion. Yes, it is the iconic Republic warship from the Clone Wars so it makes sense to release it first... but FFG released the Victory Star Destroyer in the Armada Core set and Wave 1. The ISD wasn't released until Wave 2, months later.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Reavern said:

Crabbok posted this video today about the Clone Wars Fleet Expansions and Squadron Packs:

I was surprised that he thinks the Venator will be in the Republic Fleet Expansion. Yes, it is the iconic Republic warship from the Clone Wars so it makes sense to release it first... but FFG released the Victory Star Destroyer in the Armada Core set and Wave 1. The ISD wasn't released until Wave 2, months later.

That release order May have been influenced by their decision to ease into the game. Going for 180, then 300, then 400 points fleet totals. It may have been a balance consideration given the limited pool of upgrade at the time

 

Releasing the 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, shark1j said:

I want Yuuzhan Vong after....

And I want Mara Jade, Dark Lady Lumiya, the Eclipse, MC90s, Nssis-class Clawcraft, and Centerpoint Station.

But we're far more likely to get High Republic pablum in a few years. I can't wait. 🙄

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wouldn't mind if they made some kind of escort version of the landing ship. Would make sense. Size of the Banking clan Frigate I'd have to imagine medium, but wouldn't complain if they made it a small. Heck cheaper the better for fleet building especially a ship that's deployed 4 to 6 commonly and is a pretty vicious light cruiser style screen or spear head for the Seps Capships. It should keep something like gladiator shields and health. Tough front shields but watching a platoon of AT TE's killing their engines while passing over an asteroid rear shields have to be especially weak.

Is anyone else hoping when the Venator comes out there there will be a mod or super weapon slot for that ventral beam weapon we saw at The Battle of Corscant? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 minutes ago, Spectre8174 said:

Is anyone else hoping when the Venator comes out there there will be a mod or super weapon slot for that ventral beam weapon we saw at The Battle of Corscant? 

That wasn't a superweapon. It was a Self-Propelled Heavy Artillery Turbolaser (SPHA-T) vehicle that was deployed in the Venator's ventral hangar bay. It was a trick that Anakin had devised.

The SPHA-T would be an interesting idea for an Upgrade Card, presumably an Offensive Retrofit. Although it should probably be Venator-only -- or Republic and Large ship only, which is basically the same as Venator-only.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
22 minutes ago, Reavern said:

That wasn't a superweapon. It was a Self-Propelled Heavy Artillery Turbolaser (SPHA-T) vehicle that was deployed in the Venator's ventral hangar bay. It was a trick that Anakin had devised.

The SPHA-T would be an interesting idea for an Upgrade Card, presumably an Offensive Retrofit. Although it should probably be Venator-only -- or Republic and Large ship only, which is basically the same as Venator-only.

Know it wasn't one exactly, but the slot kinda fits and it does act like one much like its hard to say the Star Hawks tractor is a super weapon. I just hope they do consider it. would vary the role of the Venator a little bit and give it some brawling power rather than just spitting fighters and long range turbo fire even if its an expensive upgrade like I think it would be.

Edited by Spectre8174

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Given the artwork we’ve seen so far I think it will be the Acclamator & two consulars (1 med & 2 small base) v either 2 munificents or a munificent/recusant combo (both med base).

Venators in wave 2.

And obligatory plug for select cross-faction ships to keep things interesting for the Rev/imp players. But I know this ain’t gonna happen 😔

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Spectre8174 said:

Wouldn't mind if they made some kind of escort version of the landing ship. Would make sense. Size of the Banking clan Frigate I'd have to imagine medium, but wouldn't complain if they made it a small. Heck cheaper the better for fleet building especially a ship that's deployed 4 to 6 commonly and is a pretty vicious light cruiser style screen or spear head for the Seps Capships. It should keep something like gladiator shields and health. Tough front shields but watching a platoon of AT TE's killing their engines while passing over an asteroid rear shields have to be especially weak

If a variant of the munificent clocks in around 60 points, you can comfortably bring 4 and could force up to 6. That’s low end of medium ship Points range. 
 

Im more hoping for the Providence to honor both the 1088 and 2177 meter designs. Give me a 90 and a 120+ point variant.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Church14 said:

If a variant of the munificent clocks in around 60 points, you can comfortably bring 4 and could force up to 6. That’s low end of medium ship Points range. 
 

Im more hoping for the Providence to honor both the 1088 and 2177 meter designs. Give me a 90 and a 120+ point variant.

I could see them possibly doing two separate expansions for each Providence variant, the same way they did with the ISD and Chimaera.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, ISD Avenger said:

Given the artwork we’ve seen so far I think it will be the Acclamator & two consulars (1 med & 2 small base) v either 2 munificents or a munificent/recusant combo (both med base).

Love the Munificent, very luke-warm on the Recusant. So I'm hoping it's the former. 😂

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Battlefleet 01 Studios said:

I could see them possibly doing two separate expansions for each Providence variant, the same way they did with the ISD and Chimaera.

That's a long-term possibility for the Providence (and Recusant), but I doubt we'll see a Providence dreadnought before Wave 5.

I think @Church14's idea is more plausible because there needs to be two versions of the Providence anyway, so why not make one the smaller destroyer/carrier and the second the dreadnought? Players can just use their imaginations that the 140+ point Providence is twice the size.

I'm not discouraging the Providence dreadnought, I'd just prefer if FFG focused on the Lucrehulk and Subjugator (Malevolence) ships first. And a Republic "huge" ship would be great too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, ISD Avenger said:

Does the Republic have a huge ship? In canon anyways?

The Mandator series of star dreadnoughts has been semi-reCanonized by the Mandator IV in TLJ, so an argument could be made to have the Mandator I and II added to the game. The catch is even in Legends there was no official image of the Mandator, only the Bellator which was a divergent design.

732?cb=20120425234106

If FFG designed the Mandator it would more likely be closer to the Canon Mandator IV without the orbital autocannons.

latest?cb=20181015041722

Not likely at all to happen but it would be a nice Prequel to Sequel Trilogy connection.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
38 minutes ago, ISD Avenger said:

Does the Republic have a huge ship? In canon anyways?

According to wookipedia, the only large capital ships were Venators, Acclamators, and VSDs. Apparently GSDs were designed by Walex Blissex for the Republic but weren't produced in time. I couldn't find a mention of any larger ship.

Here is a list that apparently includes all the ships that appear in the clone wars (it's long though, as it mentions specific ships, not their classes). I haven't fully checked it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, GhostofNobodyInParticular said:

According to wookipedia, the only large capital ships were Venators, Acclamators, and VSDs. Apparently GSDs were designed by Walex Blissex for the Republic but weren't produced in time. I couldn't find a mention of any larger ship.

Here is a list that apparently includes all the ships that appear in the clone wars (it's long though, as it mentions specific ships, not their classes). I haven't fully checked it.

There was also the KDY Praetor-class battlecruiser, which is mentioned here on Wookieepedia.

latest?cb=20120425001005

It's a Legends ship, same as the Mandator.

BTW, I hate the design of the Praetor because of that ridiculous giant cylinder. It's such a hacky, nonsensical design choice.

I'm not saying that I like the Praetor or that is should be a Republic huge ship in Armada. I'm just pointing out that it exists, in Legends.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 minutes ago, Reavern said:

There was also the KDY Praetor-class battlecruiser, which is mentioned here on Wookieepedia.

latest?cb=20120425001005

It's a Legends ship, same as the Mandator.

BTW, I hate the design of the Praetor because of that ridiculous giant cylinder. It's such a hacky, nonsensical design choice.

I'm not saying that I like the Praetor or that is should be a Republic huge ship in Armada. I'm just pointing out that it exists, in Legends.

Yes, but ISD Avenger's question specified canon.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32 minutes ago, Reavern said:

There was also the KDY Praetor-class battlecruiser, which is mentioned here on Wookieepedia.

latest?cb=20120425001005

It's a Legends ship, same as the Mandator.

BTW, I hate the design of the Praetor because of that ridiculous giant cylinder. It's such a hacky, nonsensical design choice.

I'm not saying that I like the Praetor or that is should be a Republic huge ship in Armada. I'm just pointing out that it exists, in Legends.

The Praetor I and II are Canon in name but with no official images or stats. Presumably like other Legends to Canon ships the Praetor II will look the same, but the Praetor I never had an official image like the Mandators I to III.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Piratical Moustache said:

The Praetor I and II are Canon in name but with no official images or stats. Presumably like other Legends to Canon ships the Praetor II will look the same, but the Praetor I never had an official image like the Mandators I to III.

Hopefully, FFG does make a Republic huge ship, and regardless whether it's a Mandator or Praetor or another Clone Wars era dreadnought I haven't even heard of, I sincerely hope FFG does the same thing they did with the Starhawk (and Onager), and create something spectacular, original, but with an obvious design legacy.

Imagine if FFG and Disney/Lucasfilm designed a Republic dreadnought that paid homage to the Sith Empire's Harrower-class dreadnought. I'm picturing a hybrid of a Venator and Harrower in my mind.

latest?cb=20120425024504

I can imagine the lore they could write for that ship. Similar to the Clone Wars era's dagger-shaped warships were inspired by Mandalorian and Sith designs from the Old Republic era, the Republic dreadnought's design was another subtle indicator about the rise of the Sith. Perhaps the lore could say the design was chosen and approved by Chancellor Palpatine himself. It would be a lot of fun!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...