What are some good Ward choices?

[Bayushi Tsubaki 446]

Wards are thematically really cool but seem mechanically awkward.

Let's say I prepare a Jade Strike ward - do I decide how and when it triggers, based on the invocation limitations? Does it need to be interacted with or can it be set to activate, say, as soon as an otherworldly creature enters the invocation's range (Range 3)?

Would Jade Strike even be a good invocation to ward? Why or why not?
What would your list of solid choices be, and why?

[Avatar111 553]

3 hours ago, Bayushi Tsubaki said:

Wards are thematically really cool but seem mechanically awkward.

Let's say I prepare a Jade Strike ward - do I decide how and when it triggers, based on the invocation limitations? Does it need to be interacted with or can it be set to activate, say, as soon as an otherworldly creature enters the invocation's range (Range 3)?

Would Jade Strike even be a good invocation to ward? Why or why not?
What would your list of solid choices be, and why?

Your group needs to interpret and define how far you want to bring wards. According to the book I think it is mostly just an example with rules that are guidelines. The GM and the players can define how they want wards to work in an extended fashion. If all your group is on the same page I am certain you can come to an agreement that makes it fun for everybody, and more importantly, fun for the story.

 

Edit: personally, since I (gm) manage time, scenes, and downtimes very strictly, we allow everything to work (since it takes a downtime to create). But, your mileage may vary. I suggest you let the GM decide and hopefully they decide with a fair and fun judgement.

Edited March 16 by Avatar111

[DSalazar 471]

Grasp of the Air Dragon or Wrath of Kaze-no-Kami, specially if you put the ward up on a tower.

Vapor of Nightmares can work almost like a Phantasmal Killer (or Phantasmal Strifer, in this case).

Eartquake could be a good one as well. The problem that I see it though, is that a warden won’t necessarily activate a conflict scene, so there isn’t necessarily a stance that the character is using at the moment. So, either the GM assumes that the character is in Air Stance (because I’m assuming the character is being sneaky to break into the room) or the GM will say that something went wrong, he must roll to resist, the player chooses the ring and then the GM will tell the skill, the TN and the effect.

[ShibaRen 2]

13 hours ago, Diogo Salazar said:

Grasp of the Air Dragon or Wrath of Kaze-no-Kami, specially if you put the ward up on a tower.

Vapor of Nightmares can work almost like a Phantasmal Killer (or Phantasmal Strifer, in this case).

Eartquake could be a good one as well. The problem that I see it though, is that a warden won’t necessarily activate a conflict scene, so there isn’t necessarily a stance that the character is using at the moment. So, either the GM assumes that the character is in Air Stance (because I’m assuming the character is being sneaky to break into the room) or the GM will say that something went wrong, he must roll to resist, the player chooses the ring and then the GM will tell the skill, the TN and the effect.

In regard to what stance they are in, I think that would be determined by the ring they are using when it triggered. The air makes sense when sneaking, but what if they are kicking the door in, so to speak?

Grasp of the Air Dragon, Vapor of Nightmares, and what is it called, Tempest of Air? That just pushes people back? If you could spend opportunity (GM permission) that it adds a thunder clap or something as well?

[Harzerkatze 262]

18 hours ago, Bayushi Tsubaki said:

Wards are thematically really cool but seem mechanically awkward.

Let's say I prepare a Jade Strike ward - do I decide how and when it triggers, based on the invocation limitations? Does it need to be interacted with or can it be set to activate, say, as soon as an otherworldly creature enters the invocation's range (Range 3)?

Would Jade Strike even be a good invocation to ward? Why or why not?
What would your list of solid choices be, and why?

My (GM) interpretation is that wards only work for invocationms whose target is a location, since it says "When the ward’s condition is fulfilled, the invocation activates at its current location." So Jade Strike is out, as it targets a character, as does Earthquake or Grasp of the Air Dragon.

Invocations that work include e.g. Blessed Wind, False Realm of the Fox Spirit, Rise, Earth/Air/Fire/Water or Token of Memory.

I have an NPC carrying a Token of Memory ward that will create a solid image of himself, used to fake his own death by creating it and then pushing it off a cliff his was seen climbing on.

[DSalazar 471]

3 hours ago, Harzerkatze said:

My (GM) interpretation is that wards only work for invocationms whose target is a location, since it says "When the ward’s condition is fulfilled, the invocation activates at its current location." So Jade Strike is out, as it targets a character, as does Earthquake or Grasp of the Air Dragon.

Invocations that work include e.g. Blessed Wind, False Realm of the Fox Spirit, Rise, Earth/Air/Fire/Water or Token of Memory.

I have an NPC carrying a Token of Memory ward that will create a solid image of himself, used to fake his own death by creating it and then pushing it off a cliff his was seen climbing on.

That looks more like a Token of Memory Meishodo than a ward, though.

3 hours ago, ShibaRen said:

In regard to what stance they are in, I think that would be determined by the ring they are using when it triggered. The air makes sense when sneaking, but what if they are kicking the door in, so to speak?

Grasp of the Air Dragon, Vapor of Nightmares, and what is it called, Tempest of Air? That just pushes people back? If you could spend opportunity (GM permission) that it adds a thunder clap or something as well?

In regards to the stance, yes, like you said, you can assume that the Ring used to enter the place is the one that is used to resist the ward (if necessary). But what if the ward is put on a place that the players were literally just passing by?

That's the kind of outlier the rules in the book are not ready to answer.

Edited March 16 by Diogo Salazar

[Tonbo Karasu 2,606]

Note that 'Ward' is a slightly awkward 'translation', if I understand correctly.  It isn't what I immediately thought of when I first came across them - some sort of symbol inscribed upon the ground, or a wall, creating a barrier that is hard to cross, like this:

No, wards in L5R are pieces of (sometimes yellow) paper, with a short prayer to a kami written on it (sometimes in red).  They are the sort of thing seen in Manga amd anime, often activated by being placed onto a target, where they stick, like either of these:

 

 

They can be used by placing them on the inside of a door, to activate if, for example, someone else opens it.  Alternatively, carrying it around or giving it to a non-shugenja companion so that they can whip it out and stick it onto the oni's forehead, thus encasing it in jade (for example), is equally valid.

 

 

[DSalazar 471]

Yeah

I know these as sutra scrolls.

[Tonbo Karasu 2,606]

53 minutes ago, Diogo Salazar said:

In regards to the stance, yes, like you said, you can assume that the Ring used to enter the place is the one that is used to resist the ward (if necessary). But what if the ward is put on a place that the players were literally just passing by?

That's the kind of outlier the rules in the book are not ready to answer.

I'd ask the players to roll initiative, then get them to resist the effect with whatever ring the chose to do initiative in.  Their response, lacking any other input, would give you an idea of how they generically react to suprising situations, and thus how they would immediately react to a ward activating.

[UnitOmega 2,818]

Ofuda. I dunno if Yogo "warding" was a thing in prior editions they felt the need to keep the language for or what, but yeah, it's paper talismans or spell tags (for any crowd who played Pokemon in their youth - I dunno. There's a lot of anime/japanese pop culture pushback in some circles of L5R which I as a lifelong weeb find weird, because that's arguably a better thematic and cultural touchstone for L5R than some editions of L5R have been, anyway, different subject). 

I've said before I don't go for a very strict interpretation because the rules don't have a very strict mechanical wording (and in fact, the Yogo mastery technique lets you seal up any Invocation or Maho). Most characters only get one slot at a time, and if you're a Wardmaster that's kind of your thing, so the GM shouldn't bully your school by restricting you unnecessarily, they should just say "I don't like Wards, don't play a Yogo", just like I say "I don't like the Kolat, never play a Kolat". You can totally put Jade Strike in a talisman and then stick that on an oni (well, probably after making an Unarmed roll to slap him with it). Can you stick Jade Strike on a door and have it blast the first supernatural creature which wanders into range? That would probably require some discussion with the player on what exact triggers are "programmed" into the ward, but that is thematically appropriate for what these little paper tags are supposed to do. A kami is still empowering it, so it's not "dumb" and is still magical. A strict interpretation might mean they have to touch it, but then you can just throw them at people. They do it all the time on TV. Otherwise, an earth kami probably knows if something evil is within the ward's range?

For resistance rolls outside of structured time, that'll take some GM massaging. If they rolled something which triggered it (like Air/Skulduggery to sneak, or Fitness/Fire to sprint) that ring probably works, but otherwise you might just assume the character rolls with whatever they think their optimal roll is. For NPCs, you might just have them roll their "best" ring and hope. Against players you probably shouldn't abuse "Explosive runes" on too much (as you, the GM, are armed with infinite shugenja who can prepare wards offscreen), and I generally give them the "benefit of the doubt" as far as bad stuff is, so giving them an opportunity to pick their ring if a sudden effect bursts in a narrative scene may work. Even if it's a lower TN, they aren't guaranteed to have a good number of ring dice, especially at low EXP totals, so they may or may not meta the resistance roll. 

[Magnus Grendel 11,673]

15 hours ago, Harzerkatze said:

My (GM) interpretation is that wards only work for invocationms whose target is a location, since it says "When the ward’s condition is fulfilled, the invocation activates at its current location." So Jade Strike is out, as it targets a character, as does Earthquake or Grasp of the Air Dragon.

That's my view as well.

12 hours ago, UnitOmega said:

Against players you probably shouldn't abuse "Explosive runes" on too much (as you, the GM, are armed with infinite shugenja who can prepare wards offscreen)

Agreed - or at least give them a credible chance to see or avoid it.

Also....I need to look up the kanji for "I prepared explosive runes this morning".

[DSalazar 471]

According to Google translate:

今朝爆発的なルーン文字を準備しました
That's some really tiny calligraphy or a really long scroll 😂

[Magnus Grendel 11,673]

If it's worth doing, it's worth doing properly.

And a Yogo can potentially set quite a minefield of them.... 

[Bayushi Tsubaki 446]

Ya know, at first I was really just wondering about what spells would work well as "set and forget" spells.

I didn't realize until now just how lacking the rules are around Wards in totality! Considering it's the primary focus of a core-book school, that's really embarrassing. 😅