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Roller of blanks

The Salt Mines

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14 hours ago, wurms said:

My most recent: My jedi knight, range 3 obstructed from a Tie FO. Tie rolls 2 hits. I roll 5 blanks. Next round, range 3 from Tie FO. FO rolls 2 hits, I roll 4 blanks. Dead Jedi Knight.

Finals at a tourney last year: Im up on points with less than 5 minutes to go. Soontir behind a rock range 3. Tie Fighter rolls 1 crit. Soontir blanks, direct hit. Half pts on Soontir. I lose game by 13pts.

More salt?

My droid swarm vs jedi. Final round. I need half points on CLT ObiWan to live. I get 2 hits from range 2. My opponent rolls 5 blanks. I WIN! Oh wait, he rolled FIVE dice. Range 2 is 4 dice. He rolls again and gets 2 evades.

 

i will not allow him roll again, i think there's a rule on this

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Lost a Ketsu to a single modded proton torp, a range 3 from wedge and a R2 from Thane. 3 shots to take down an 11 HP 2 evade ship. Wedge took one shield, Norra's protorp (with just a lock) 4 crits, took the last shield and did THREE direct hits. Thane's shot did 2 damage and he naturally flipped a DR up. Gone. I didn't roll a single evade either, just 1 on the 6 greens I rolled means she lived. First round of a tournament as well.

Next game against a FOcho, 4 X 4 modified dice attacks over 2 turns into a tractored FO (without a token second round) for 1 damage. Joyfully I went on to lose that game in the last round to a range 3 obstructed unmodded shot from an FO into a focused Boba that did 2 damage and took him to half.

I'd lost 2 games the day before in the last round to wild hopeful shots taking a ship to half against the odds after a game of sub-par rolls for me. Muh Dice.

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I am a bit frustrated that I haven't gotten to fly the Red Baron yet.  We had a tornado cancel game night.  Then snow.  The few times we have had game night, we played Flight Group Alpha, and no one wanted a game after that.   It would be really  nice to actually get to play with my new ship.

I think I will use it as a regular Interceptor tomorrow night for Flight Group Alpha.

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Green dice fails are obviously a thing- Vader, R3 and obstructed, full health, full force and focus. Burners out of the unmodded Upsilon arc? Nah, way too early, should be fine, this Ups won't get arc again now.... 4 hits into 5 blanks.... 

Should be fine is often not fine.

But green dice also work the other way- Sunny gets behind an FOTP in an evenly balanced game. All of 2mm out of Autoblaster range. Natties 2 crits. Adds 3rd. FOTP natties them all away... I cry for a week.

And just this wknd. A Skull, R1, focus and Fearless PLUS Genesis Red, R2, focus and lock with a ProTorp. My 25pt Cartel Spacer loses its shield. Still funny.

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18 hours ago, ClassicalMoser said:

That is so extremely unlikely that I would find it extremely difficult to believe if there weren't so many games played. 0.125*0.095*0.095*0.15 = 0.00017.

Chances of that are one in 6000. Congratulations, you won the universal jackpot.

But of course, there have been way more than 6000 rounds of attack dice thrown in second edition. Most well-experienced players have probably seen as many attacks in person. That makes this eventuality almost seem inevitable.

Strange how odds work: The more time you do something, the more likely that extremely-rare event is to actually occur.

EDIT:

This was assuming you didn't have a focus token. If you really did, the odds go down to 0.0000009 or literally one in a million.

Time to take on a death star

809bd96d9591008adaaef7edcb3da9f6.gif

PLR can confirm as he's the one who did it. 

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7 hours ago, alien earth said:

i will not allow him roll again, i think there's a rule on this

I think it may have been a 1st ed. Rule. I remember at a regionals, this happened to someone and T.O. ruled he has to keep the roll if other player doesnt allow you to reroll. Coulda been T.O. was misinformed too.

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10 hours ago, Bort said:

So relating to the thread.... do you guys think its really better to know the odds when playing.

I'm relatively strong math minded. So I can usually quickly determine the odds of something good/bad happening.   

But it feels lately that this is just putting me in a bad mood when I believe things are going "below average".   I mean, the odds of rolling 3 crits are 1/512 yet we all see it happen against us right.   Or that 2 red dice coming from you at range 3 obstructed and both landing. Small odds, and yet, it happens.  I know it might just be my rotten mindset, but still.  Maybe if I didn't overthink the maths behind it all, and just rolled the dice and see where things lead I may be happier with my games.

 

So do you think in this case ignorance could be bliss? 

For me knowing what I should roll is helpful in action taking. But saying that, how many times do we roll what we should roll? Dice are RNG, Rage Number Generators. They roll what they roll and that’s what we have to deal with. 
As stated earlier I have had Fenn die to 2 Torrents at Range 3, but I have also had Fenn natty roll 4 evades versus a range 1 Vader to win a tournament. Dice happen, all we can do is try and math it to our favour. 

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10 hours ago, Archangelspiv said:

For me knowing what I should roll is helpful in action taking. But saying that, how many times do we roll what we should roll? Dice are RNG, Rage Number Generators. They roll what they roll and that’s what we have to deal with. 
As stated earlier I have had Fenn die to 2 Torrents at Range 3, but I have also had Fenn natty roll 4 evades versus a range 1 Vader to win a tournament. Dice happen, all we can do is try and math it to our favour. 

But that's my point.  Dice happen.

There are a lot of other aspects to the game.   Starts with army building.  (So army selection), and then moving correct (Dial selection) and then choosing the correct targets at the right time (and much much more). 

But its this last part I feel I overdo.  There are a lot that can be said for correct target selection, but I feel if I leave Math out of it I may be happier with the outcomes.  Instead of calculating the odds, then rolling dice that are one random sample in a sea of probabilities, and then complaining because I didn't roll average or above. 

Maybe its just a personal opinion.... besides, try as I might I struggle to switch off the math calculating.

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Oh. I read it twice, but Concordia face-off doesn't actually need a face off? It just cares you're being attacked by an enemy at R1 and you're in their R1 firing arc? What the heck?? I can be asse-facing them and trollolol into an evade? And Fenn also same thing, adding a 4th die from the butt? 

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5 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

Oh. I read it twice, but Concordia face-off doesn't actually need a face off? It just cares you're being attacked by an enemy at R1 and you're in their R1 firing arc? What the heck?? I can be asse-facing them and trollolol into an evade? And Fenn also same thing, adding a 4th die from the butt? 

Yes, it's kinda OP

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Posted (edited)

WHY IN THE FO CHING HIEL DOES CONCORDIA FAQ-OFF WORK ON EVERY OPPOSING IN ARC SHOT AT RANGE ONE!!!??'@"!? WHO IN THEIR FLATULENT BRAIN GAS THOUGHT THAT WAS A STAR SPANGLED GREAT IDEA? ALEX! IT'S NOT A FACE OFF, IF YOUR NOT FACING THE OTHER GUY! I THOUGHT YOU WANTED TO GET RID OF AUTOTHRUSTERS FROM FIRST ED NOT CHANGE IT'S RANGES!? BLOODY TARTARUS WHO SIGNED THAT OFF?!

*Ahem* Excuse me there, bit if a throat tickle that was. Anybody got a hanky? Anyway, did I do that right? 

Edit: lol only just read the thread. I read the op and just started typing 😳😅😂 glad to know we're all on the same page!

Edited by ForceSensitive
Read edit

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Just now, ForceSensitive said:

WHY IN THE FO CHING HIEL DOES CONCORDIA FAQ-OFF WORK ON EVERY OPPOSING IN ARC SHOT AT RANGE ONE!!!??'@"!? WHO IN THEIR FLATULENT BRAIN GAS THOUGHT THAT WAS A STAR SPANGLED GREAT IDEA? ALEX! IT'S NOT A FACE OFF, IF YOUR NOT FACING THE OTHER GUY! I THOUGHT YOU WANTED TO GET RID OF AUTOTHRUSTERS FROM FIRST ED NOT CHANGE IT'S RANGES!? BLOODY TARTARUS WHO SIGNED THAT OFF?!

*Ahem* Excuse me there, bit if a throat tickle that was. Anybody got a hanky? Anyway, did I do that right? 

May I introduce you to our lord and saviour RZ-2 and their delightful rear arcs. 

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1 minute ago, Flurpy said:

May I introduce you to our lord and saviour RZ-2 and their delightful rear arcs. 

Honestly that's just worse. Having been one of the early adopters if the z2 I think it's design it's just so... Silly? Personal opinion and edit, You really shouldn't be able to mod dice on your rear arc with those. If the game was focused on arc based combat, let the ship focus on having to setup good front shots, and then have a rear arc "spray and pray" mechanic to make up for it's fragile frame on disengage shots. 

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4 minutes ago, ForceSensitive said:

Honestly that's just worse. Having been one of the early adopters if the z2 I think it's design it's just so... Silly? Personal opinion and edit, You really shouldn't be able to mod dice on your rear arc with those. If the game was focused on arc based combat, let the ship focus on having to setup good front shots, and then have a rear arc "spray and pray" mechanic to make up for it's fragile frame on disengage shots. 

As a new member of the church of 5A I'm just loving flying them, there's much bigger problems currently than the A Wing. 

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On 3/4/2020 at 7:34 AM, GreenDragoon said:

Yes, and the rule is that you have to roll again if too many dice were rolled.

This has bit my tuckus an alarming number of times. I feel if they screw up, roll too many greens or reds, and then reroll, you the opponent should get to choose which one they get stuck with. 

Alternatively, if you roll too many, the opponent just picks one for you to discard until you have the right amount, on too few you just roll additional till you have enough.

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1 minute ago, ForceSensitive said:

This has bit my tuckus an alarming number of times. I feel if they screw up, roll too many greens or reds, and then reroll, you the opponent should get to choose which one they get stuck with. 

Alternatively, if you roll too many, the opponent just picks one for you to discard until you have the right amount, on too few you just roll additional till you have enough.

I don't understand. Here's what happens according to the rules:

1. You roll too many dice, e.g. 5 instead of 4.
2. One of us notices: "Hey, that was too many".
3. You pick up all dice, and put them wherever and now roll the correct amount of 4 dice.

If you want to choose *individual* dice that I'm allowed to reroll then you'll have me very confused. If that matters to you, then I hope you asked me to share dice anyway. In case you didn't: I did and we're probably sharing your dice here.

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Just now, GreenDragoon said:

I don't understand. Here's what happens according to the rules:

1. You roll too many dice, e.g. 5 instead of 4.
2. One of us notices: "Hey, that was too many".
3. You pick up all dice, and put them wherever and now roll the correct amount of 4 dice.

If you want to choose *individual* dice that I'm allowed to reroll then you'll have me very confused. If that matters to you, then I hope you asked me to share dice anyway. In case you didn't: I did and we're probably sharing your dice here.

Too often I've seen it go: rolled five, mostly whiff, then oh wait, reroll four, all hit. That shouldn't be allowed to happen.

An error on the side of cheating your opponent should not be possible, while an error on the side of cheating your self should get the chance to be corrected.

Hence why if you roll too many, which is a possible cheat move, the opponent should get the option to penalize the roll as it could be a cheat even unintentional. But when you don't roll enough, you should keep what you have and add to the roll the difference so you don't get cheated.

Ultimately, you shouldn't have the option of seeing a mistake extra roll and even realizing yourself that it's a mistake get the chance to keep it, since you could keep mum unless your opponent notices and if you roll poor you should still be stuck with the bad roll and not get what in essence could be an ability: "discard a die, reroll all other results", declare with a laugh oh whoops, I rolled too many, guess I get to reroll ALL OF THEM 😳🤨

Sadly, most of the testers for these rules are tournament players and likely realize the rule can be occasionally abused for profit. So they would never point out this sneaky faux target lock exploit. 

AND HOW DO I KNOW IT WORKS!? I'VE DONE IT!! Only in casual when I set out to tell my opponent "hey I'm going to cheat and I want to see if you notice." I'm a strong believer that I think it's important to test out possible cheating so you know what they look like and can recognize them.

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21 minutes ago, Flurpy said:

Oh wait. We're being serious?

The A Wing doesn't crack the Top50 things I would fix in X-Wing, let alone near the top. 

Yes, we are. The z2 is in a really awkward spot right now. On one hand, it's extremely capable. One or the few sips that can successfully run a mono-chassis build. It also counters the theme of the game 'arcs matter' as it is entirely too capable of maintaining arc, and range control, and action economy. On the other hand, it's kinda the only thing holding up the entire faction. Their large is a bust, their X is good but doesn't have the same consistency and is expensive, their shuttle for rid of the only played pilot card, and fireballs are yet unproven even if promising. So currently, yes, there's other bigger issues. But eventually, assuming you fix those, this one will still be here.

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I still don't understand.

20 minutes ago, ForceSensitive said:

Too often I've seen it go: rolled five, mostly whiff, then oh wait, reroll four, all hit. That shouldn't be allowed to happen.

If they rolled too many dice then that is what should happen. This is unambiguous. Rolled too many? Roll again. You can't deny the reroll because they whiffed. And they can't keep the roll if it was good. Too many dice gets a reroll. Period. There is no fake target lock. Too many dice gets an instant reroll. If you try to keep the extra die then that's cheating. If you force your opponent to keep a whiffed roll with too many dice then that, too, is cheating.

Actual cheating. If anyone did that here, he'd be out. The social repercussions are so harsh that nobody can afford to do that. It's also a blatantly stupid attempt. If someone keeps doing that over the course of a large event then they are likely to be found and disqualified, hopefully also barred from future event for some time.

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Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, ForceSensitive said:

Yes, we are. The z2 is in a really awkward spot right now. On one hand, it's extremely capable. One or the few sips that can successfully run a mono-chassis build. It also counters the theme of the game 'arcs matter' as it is entirely too capable of maintaining arc, and range control, and action economy. On the other hand, it's kinda the only thing holding up the entire faction. Their large is a bust, their X is good but doesn't have the same consistency and is expensive, their shuttle for rid of the only played pilot card, and fireballs are yet unproven even if promising. So currently, yes, there's other bigger issues. But eventually, assuming you fix those, this one will still be here.

I mean not to toot my own horn, but I made cut at UK SoS with X-Wings, Transport and Fireball, then went on to get a World Invite with a Fireball, Falcon and an A Wing after in the Worlds Qualifier. I think Reistance is in a spectacular place right now, with various different builds and all ship types making cut left and right at all major events. I'm not sure what data are you looking at. 

Edited by Flurpy

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