A dumb Sloane question

[JKShulenburg 73]

I was reading Sloane and I got a really dumb idea in my head. 

 

Sloane text states "it may spend 1 die with an  icon " in my mind, this reads just like solar Corona which is discard 1 die with an accuracy icon from the attack pool. Would Sloane not be interpreted as discard a die from your attack pool with an accuracy icon anywhere on it instead of spend a rolled accuracy? As in reduce your attack by 1 dice? Am I dumb for thinking this since it's wildly different from how it's played? 

[JKShulenburg 73]

I mean, spend implies that it's after the roll, but the fact that it's a die with an accuracy icon and not the accuracy icon, or not an accuracy effect like a crit effect is weird to me................... I'm onto a conspiracy theory here

[Karneck 1,990]

I have no idea what your question is.

[JKShulenburg 73]

4 minutes ago, Karneck said:

I have no idea what your question is.

Im sleep deprived and ranting about conspiracy theories. 

 

But with how Sloane is written, does it not imply that you spend a die with an accuracy icon on it similar to the one discarded by solar Corona and not spend the rolled accuracy. Essentially, you spend the dice for the ability before you roll instead of after

 

Tell me I'm crazy

[Formynder4 810]

Read the text of solar Corona. Now read the modify dice section of the rules. 

[Bertie Wooster 1,857]

"While a friendly squadron without Rogue is attacking, it may spend 1 die with an [accuracy] icon to choose and spend 1 of the defender's defense tokens. While attacking a ship, it may also reroll 1 die with a [crit] icon."

" A token spent by this card’s effect cannot be spent again by the defender during that attack. The defender can spend another token of the same type during that attack."

Spend the die with an accuracy icon. Remove it from the attack pool. Your squadron spends your opponent's defense token, and now he/she/they cannot use that defense token during this attack. Make sense?

Edited December 18, 2019 by Bertie Wooster

[JKShulenburg 73]

2 minutes ago, Formynder4 said:

Read the text of solar Corona. Now read the modify dice section of the rules. 

Yeah, the difference is between spend and discard... But the text for spend is "When a die or die icon is spent, remove that die from the attack pool" Sloanes text implies it removed the die, not the icon. Which is where my incoherent rambling about timing is coming from

[JKShulenburg 73]

2 minutes ago, Bertie Wooster said:

"While a friendly squadron without Rogue is attacking, it may spend 1 die with an [accuracy] icon to choose and spend 1 of the defender's defense tokens. While attacking a ship, it may also reroll 1 die with a [crit] icon."

" A token spent by this card’s effect cannot be spent again by the defender during that attack. The defender can spend another token of the same type during that attack."

Spend the die with an accuracy icon. Remove it from the attack pool. Your squadron spends your opponent's defense token, and now he/she/they cannot use that defense token during this attack. Make sense?

So it is before the roll? I've always heard you had to roll the accuracy and spend the icon. You make it sound like I'm right and you spend the dice pre roll

[Bertie Wooster 1,857]

Just now, JKShulenburg said:

Yeah, the difference is between spend and discard... But the text for spend is "When a die or die icon is spent, remove that die from the attack pool" Sloanes text implies it removed the die, not the icon. Which is where my incoherent rambling about timing is coming from

OK I see what you mean.

Yes, you're crazy. =D

[Bertie Wooster 1,857]

Just now, JKShulenburg said:

So it is before the roll? I've always heard you had to roll the accuracy and spend the icon. You make it sound like I'm right and you spend the dice pre roll

Oh no.

[JKShulenburg 73]

2 minutes ago, Bertie Wooster said:

Oh no.

This is my pepe silva moment. I'm like Charlie connecting the dots. Lol

[Bertie Wooster 1,857]

35 minutes ago, JKShulenburg said:

I was reading Sloane and I got a really dumb idea in my head. 

 

Sloane text states "it may spend 1 die with an  icon " in my mind, this reads just like solar Corona which is discard 1 die with an accuracy icon from the attack pool. Would Sloane not be interpreted as discard a die from your attack pool with an accuracy icon anywhere on it instead of spend a rolled accuracy? As in reduce your attack by 1 dice? Am I dumb for thinking this since it's wildly different from how it's played? 

When you play Solar Corona, do you remove 1 red or blue die before you roll the dice?

[JKShulenburg 73]

6 minutes ago, Bertie Wooster said:

When you play Solar Corona, do you remove 1 red or blue die before you roll the dice?

That's how I've always interpreted it. You remove the die from the attack pool. Again, my Sloane conspiracy is based on timing. Does it trigger during gather dice as I interpret Corona or modify dice? 

[Grumbleduke 810]

16 minutes ago, JKShulenburg said:

That's how I've always interpreted it. You remove the die from the attack pool. Again, my Sloane conspiracy is based on timing.

Then you interpreted it incorrectly. With Solar Corona you roll your initial attack pool, and *if* there is at least one die with an accuracy there you discard one die with an accuracy. Then you go on to do other things (add in dice other than battery armament ones, reroll, spend accuracies to lock down Defense Tokens etc.)

[Bertie Wooster 1,857]

20 minutes ago, JKShulenburg said:

That's how I've always interpreted it. You remove the die from the attack pool. Again, my Sloane conspiracy is based on timing. Does it trigger during gather dice as I interpret Corona or modify dice? 

 Interpret "1 die with an accuracy icon" as "1 die with an accuracy icon facing upward." Which you don't know until you roll.

[JKShulenburg 73]

57 minutes ago, Bertie Wooster said:

 Interpret "1 die with an accuracy icon" as "1 die with an accuracy icon facing upward." Which you don't know until you roll.

Corona specifically says "from your attack pool" is that not the initial pool of dice you roll? 

[Formynder4 810]

Your attack pool is what you have after you roll your dice. With Solar Corona, you roll your initial pool, and if you have any least one acc result, you must discard one acc result. 

Sloane let's you Spend (not discard) an accuracy for her effect. 

There's a rather major difference. 

[Lemmiwinks86 934]

1 hour ago, JKShulenburg said:

Corona specifically says "from your attack pool" is that not the initial pool of dice you roll? 

From the RRG:

Attack Pool
"During an attack, the attack pool is comprised of all dice being used for that attack. This includes the dice gathered prior to rolling as well as the dice after they are rolled."

[The Jabbawookie 5,612]

1 hour ago, Lemmiwinks86 said:

From the RRG:

Attack Pool
"During an attack, the attack pool is comprised of all dice being used for that attack. This includes the dice gathered prior to rolling as well as the dice after they are rolled."

Yes, and the step to resolve attack effects is after rolling dice.

Spending accuracies in the standard fashion is an attack effect, and Sloane offers a new way to spend accuracies.

I believe this means you resolve her in the same window, after rolling dice.

That’s definitely true if she’s considered an attack effect, which I would consider common sense.

Anything else breaks the game; Flechette Torpedoes trigger 100% of the time, for starters.

Edited December 18, 2019 by The Jabbawookie

[Drasnighta 26,832]

also: dice modification effects.

 

"SPEND"  is one of them

 

if no other timing is stated, then it has one - during a certain point in the attack, the resolve attack effects step - which is after initial roll.

[Drasnighta 26,832]

Furthermore: The rules themselves make clear that, when referring to icons, a die with an icon and the icon are synonymous, and refer to a rolled die with the icon showing, rather than just the potential.

[JKShulenburg 73]

I should reiterate that the day I was posting about this I was working on about an hour of sleep. So please disregard as incoherent rambling

[Drasnighta 26,832]

1 hour ago, JKShulenburg said:

I should reiterate that the day I was posting about this I was working on about an hour of sleep. So please disregard as incoherent rambling

Questions are important to ask. And important to answer.

 

Now you not only have an answer, you have the mechanism and reasons behind the answer, which helps going forward 🙂