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yalestewart

Let Us Buy Extra Standard Encounter Cards, Please

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Man. How many folks would appreciate being able to buy just a pack of the "Standard" encounter cards for like, $3? It's just really annoying to keep swapping them in and out of every scenario. Surely I'm not the only one to feel this way.

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I take apart and reconstruct the scenario deck every time I play, and it goes really quickly. I guess if you're keeping the modules in as well, I could see why you'd want to leave the standard set in with it, but it's not bad if you get in the habit of fishing out the modular and standard card sets when you're done.

I wouldn't mind getting more of the neutral cards, though >.>

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I can’t say this is a problem I’ve had with the game really. Set up and tear down is really quick - I’ve only recently got around to making some dividers and I didn’t have much of a problem with this before that...

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It is actually a pretty easy game to setup which is nice.  Way faster than LOTR LCG or AH:TCG.  I usually can get set up to play in 10 minutes.  That includes arranging hero and villain decks.  Of course once the card pool grows the hero decks will require more thought when constructing. 

I will say if future villains are going to "require" the standard or expert set though they would be well served by reprinting those cards at some point (considering reprints in packs are confirmed).  That way a villain is actually playable out of their deck box, which is sort of the promise.  We know the Wrecking Crew doesn't require the Standard set.  So not all villains will need it.  I kinda hope few will, and they find other days to get your nemesis into play.  The villain decks aren't that big and those Standard set cards are going to start to feel tired if we play with them almost ever time.

Edited by phillos

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To be honest, I'd appreciate an extra set of standard encounter cards.

It would also allow me to choose to include two copies of Shadow of the Past in the encounter deck.

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On 11/26/2019 at 8:59 AM, phillos said:

That way a villain is actually playable out of their deck box, which is sort of the promise.  

So have they insinuated that villains will be entirely playable out of the box or just heroes? I wasn't thinking that about the villains but have not paid real close attention to the Green Goblin and Wrecking Crew announcements.

Edited by ozradio

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12 minutes ago, ozradio said:

So have they insinuated that villains will be entirely playable out of the box or just heroes? I wasn't think that about the villains but have not paid real close attention to the Green Goblin and Wrecking Crew announcements.

The makers of the game are assuming people own (or at least have access to) a core set. The expansions are just that - expansions to the game. You need the game for the tokens, standard villain cards, etc. 
 

What you don’t need are all of the expansions- you can buy Green Goblin, but skip Captain America if you like. You can buy Ms Marvel, but don’t have to get Wrecking Crew, etc. Any expansion + a core set is useable. 
 

Green Goblin contains 2 scenarios and 4 modules. You need to add the standard cards (and potentially expert cards) from the core set to run it.

Wrecking Crew contains 1 scenario which doesn’t use modules or the standard encounter cards. Because of this, you could technically buy just Wrecking Crew and play it against just a hero pack (assuming you have something you can use for tokens and tracking health, etc).

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IMO it's a mistake not to make the villains playable out of the box.  You deliver so close to the dream of pick up two decks off the rack and play then you miss the mark.  You can always just track things without the tokens (i.e dice or coins like most people do with Keyforge their first game).

Also it's a mistake to put the Standard cards in most villain decks since that will get boring quickly.  The standard villain module is very dry.  It works but it's unexciting.

Edited by phillos

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They're exciting enough to dread seeing one turn up... every... single... time. I get even more excited to see them as boost cards! :D

I don't really see anything wrong with playing the villain scenario decks right out of the box. Just shuffle your nemesis in at the start instead of the standards. It will make let you see more of the new content that way too. 

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25 minutes ago, phillos said:

IMO it's a mistake not to make the villains playable out of the box.  You deliver so close to the dream of pick up two decks off the rack and play then you miss the mark.  You can always just track things without the tokens (i.e dice or coins like most people do with Keyforge their first game).

Also it's a mistake to put the Standard cards in most villain decks since that will get boring quickly.  The standard villain module is very dry.  It works but it's unexciting.

Disagree. These are still expansions to the game - it’s not expected or advertised that you don’t need a core set to play the game.

In the case of the standard cards, they are mostly pretty dry effects, agreed, but that’s exactly why they are standard - so that most scenarios can have these core effects (the Villain attacks, the villain schemes, etc) without having to reprint them over and over again.

i would have been annoyed if we got 1 or 2 less modules in Green Goblin simply so they could include another set of standard cards I already own...

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3 minutes ago, HirumaShigure said:

They're exciting enough to dread seeing one turn up... every... single... time. I get even more excited to see them as boost cards! :D

I don't really see anything wrong with playing the villain scenario decks right out of the box. Just shuffle your nemesis in at the start instead of the standards. It will make let you see more of the new content that way too. 

I think it would play quite differently like that - without Advance, going to Alter ego becomes a lot safer...

Edited by FearLord

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47 minutes ago, FearLord said:

Disagree. These are still expansions to the game - it’s not expected or advertised that you don’t need a core set to play the game.

In the case of the standard cards, they are mostly pretty dry effects, agreed, but that’s exactly why they are standard - so that most scenarios can have these core effects (the Villain attacks, the villain schemes, etc) without having to reprint them over and over again.

i would have been annoyed if we got 1 or 2 less modules in Green Goblin simply so they could include another set of standard cards I already own...

Agree to disagree then.  I kinda question the need for a Standard set at all. There is no standard set in Arkham or LOTR.  Just throw the nemesis effect on a card each villain pack (or they could have put that on something like the obligation cards).  It's the only real reason you need to have it.    Then just throw another more thematic modular set into the deck build instead.

I think the value of not "needing" the core set to play is quite high for casual interest.  In fact I kinda wished this game had no core set and was just packs, but they didn't go to that extreme.   They could have had Keyforge level buy in to the game.  Still Champions is miles ahead of the old system that slowly built a giant barrier of entry for new players.

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1 hour ago, phillos said:

Agree to disagree then.  I kinda question the need for a Standard set at all. There is no standard set in Arkham or LOTR.  Just throw the nemesis effect on a card each villain pack (or they could have put that on something like the obligation cards).  It's the only real reason you need to have it.    Then just throw another more thematic modular set into the deck build instead.

I think the value of not "needing" the core set to play is quite high for casual interest.  In fact I kinda wished this game had no core set and was just packs, but they didn't go to that extreme.   They could have had Keyforge level buy in to the game.  Still Champions is miles ahead of the old system that slowly built a giant barrier of entry for new players.

It’s not just the Shadows card that’s important- without Advance for instance the whole dynamic of the game would be changed...

Perhaps they’ll push things further with their next game, but I think it’s a significant departure to make each product playable with just the core set, and ready to play straight from the box. As you say, the barrier for entry is significantly lower - a single core set and whichever products you actually want. Wrecking Crew is also an actual expansion you could play without the core set. It remains to be seen how future scenarios will develop, but there’s certainly scope for other things that don’t require the standard set or even replace it with something else etc - I’m certainly hoping for a scenario that makes more of the nemesis decks for example...

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12 minutes ago, FearLord said:

Wrecking Crew is also an actual expansion you could play without the core set. It remains to be seen how future scenarios will develop, but there’s certainly scope for other things that don’t require the standard set or even replace it with something else etc - I’m certainly hoping for a scenario that makes more of the nemesis decks for example...

It's more than likely that Green Goblin was simply designed along with the core set. Early expansions almost always end up being those "extras" that didn't make the cut in the first box of a new game. The Wrecking Crew then becomes the first "true" expansion designed independently of the core.

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