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First Huge Ship Game Thoughts... or why you should try 2.0 Huge Ships and Wings!

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Got some new ships delivered, thanks to an early birthday present from my dad. With that in mind while people were here replacing my old broken furnace this morning, I got into a 500 point Epic game with my friend. We're still planning on doing Atmospheric Entry tomorrow, but he had today off and wanted to play. And I had to be up early today anyway, so why not. And to start with... Let me say that trying to fly a, Y-Wing, VCX-100 and it's escape pod in a 500 point Epic Battle as the first time you field the ships is... probably not wise.

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Played a 500-500 game using the Epic Scenario with Warheads trying to blow up priority targets.  Every part of the experience was a massive improvement over 1.0 epic.  Rebel side had a CR-90 a wing of 4 X-wings and a wing of 3 B-wings.  Imperials had Vader, Duchess, Grand Inquisitor with 5 named TIE's in a wing and loaded up RAC.  CR-90 covered more ground on a 3-bank than was expected and stomped two TIEs on 2nd round of engagement and Rebels snowballed from there.

Takeaways:

  • Huge ships are much more effective for their points than 1st edition.  
  • Wings are amazing as a quality-of-life feature and a powerful force in game.
  • The huge ship tracker tool should have come with hull tracking as well.  Dug out a D20 for the CR90.  Counting all those damage cards gets silly.
  • Play Epic and play huge ships!  They are fun.

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2 hours ago, gamblertuba said:

The huge ship tracker tool should have come with hull tracking as well.  Dug out a D20 for the CR90.  Counting all those damage cards gets silly.

I've started tracking damage to the CR-90 via stacks of 5 damage cards. Or at least I will once my replacement gets here. Finally did that Atmosphere Entry match, set at 500 points by mutual agreement. Me and my (now former) friend did that cause I'd just gotten in the 1st edit Imperial Raider and a Huge Ship conversion kit. And we wanted to do a battle with a capital ship on both sides of the field. Takeaways from that match...

1. While running over the enemy ships (small to large only) can be a valid and effective stratagy, it's really easy to forget just how much ground a 3 bank performed by a huge ship will cover.

2. Running over four of your own ships, one of which is Large, is a really bad thing to do. It's even worse if you then roll all crits when checking for damage to the huge ship.

3.  Losing all your Raider's shields because you ran over Darth Vader, a Obsidian Squadron pilot, Duchess, and a devistator is a really bad thing. Especially if you're facing a CR-90 with boosted scanners, targeting battery, and a turbolaser battery, both of which are pointing right at your raider. It's even worse if your opponent then rolls all crits with the targeting battery and follows up with another crit (and nearly max damage) with the turbolaser battery, thus knocking out your hardpoints and taking over half your raider's hull out in one barrage.

4. It's really hard to resist pounding someone into the ground when they smash your CR-90 then run over the broken pieces multiple times in response to you shooting down the raider in round 2. Especially if said person then returns and wants to continue the game like they didn't just destroy a $100 miniature. Forcing someone to immediately order you a replacement CR-90 after they destroyed the one you had however feels very good.

5. I never want to see his face again.

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3 hours ago, Faerie1979 said:

I've started tracking damage to the CR-90 via stacks of 5 damage cards. Or at least I will once my replacement gets here. Finally did that Atmosphere Entry match, set at 500 points by mutual agreement. Me and my (now former) friend did that cause I'd just gotten in the 1st edit Imperial Raider and a Huge Ship conversion kit. And we wanted to do a battle with a capital ship on both sides of the field. Takeaways from that match...

1. While running over the enemy ships (small to large only) can be a valid and effective stratagy, it's really easy to forget just how much ground a 3 bank performed by a huge ship will cover.

2. Running over four of your own ships, one of which is Large, is a really bad thing to do. It's even worse if you then roll all crits when checking for damage to the huge ship.

3.  Losing all your Raider's shields because you ran over Darth Vader, a Obsidian Squadron pilot, Duchess, and a devistator is a really bad thing. Especially if you're facing a CR-90 with boosted scanners, targeting battery, and a turbolaser battery, both of which are pointing right at your raider. It's even worse if your opponent then rolls all crits with the targeting battery and follows up with another crit (and nearly max damage) with the turbolaser battery, thus knocking out your hardpoints and taking over half your raider's hull out in one barrage.

4. It's really hard to resist pounding someone into the ground when they smash your CR-90 then run over the broken pieces multiple times in response to you shooting down the raider in round 2. Especially if said person then returns and wants to continue the game like they didn't just destroy a $100 miniature. Forcing someone to immediately order you a replacement CR-90 after they destroyed the one you had however feels very good.

5. I never want to see his face again.

Um, did your (former) friend really destroy your CR90 model? I need to know how much of this story is real or imbellished!

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He really destroyed it. Grabbed the model, went outside, thew it into the parking lot hard enough to break apart, then drove over it multiple times before parking. He then came back in, expecting the match to continue now that he had (in his own words) "evened the playing field". Rather then continuing the match, I opened up the FFG store, put a new CR-90 in the cart, filled in the shipping address, and instructed him to fill in the billing information because he was replacing my model. I think he realized just how furious I was when I told him to fill in the billing information. I then verified he hadn't changed the shipping info and submitted the order. He was "kind" enough to spring for the fastest shipping method.

I noticed while cleaning up the ruins of the model that his car now has a couple flat tires.

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1 hour ago, Faerie1979 said:

He really destroyed it. Grabbed the model, went outside, thew it into the parking lot hard enough to break apart, then drove over it multiple times before parking. He then came back in, expecting the match to continue now that he had (in his own words) "evened the playing field". Rather then continuing the match, I opened up the FFG store, put a new CR-90 in the cart, filled in the shipping address, and instructed him to fill in the billing information because he was replacing my model. I think he realized just how furious I was when I told him to fill in the billing information. I then verified he hadn't changed the shipping info and submitted the order. He was "kind" enough to spring for the fastest shipping method.

I noticed while cleaning up the ruins of the model that his car now has a couple flat tires.

 

Where do you find these people? Wow. 

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1 hour ago, Faerie1979 said:

He really destroyed it. Grabbed the model, went outside, thew it into the parking lot hard enough to break apart, then drove over it multiple times before parking. He then came back in, expecting the match to continue now that he had (in his own words) "evened the playing field". Rather then continuing the match, I opened up the FFG store, put a new CR-90 in the cart, filled in the shipping address, and instructed him to fill in the billing information because he was replacing my model. I think he realized just how furious I was when I told him to fill in the billing information. I then verified he hadn't changed the shipping info and submitted the order. He was "kind" enough to spring for the fastest shipping method.

I noticed while cleaning up the ruins of the model that his car now has a couple flat tires.

I think your neighbor may be a legitimate sociopath. How can anyone think it's okay to destroy someone else's personal property, to the extent that they throw said property into a parking lot, then run over it with their car? And then, after all that, returns to the game as though nothing happened?

I'd be angry enough if someone did that to a $5 unpainted Imperial Assault mini, let alone a $100 CR-90.

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You have no idea how close I was to grabbing one of the plethora of daggers, swords, or other melee weapons I have when he did that. ****, I had a bo staff right next to me and started reaching for it when I saw him throw the model into the ground. Thankfully I was able to reign in my fury to the point I didn't do something I'd regret.

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1 hour ago, Faerie1979 said:

You have no idea how close I was to grabbing one of the plethora of daggers, swords, or other melee weapons I have when he did that. ****, I had a bo staff right next to me and started reaching for it when I saw him throw the model into the ground. Thankfully I was able to reign in my fury to the point I didn't do something I'd regret.

So what you're saying is that you've got extra cardboard lying around.   How about the base?  Did he get the base?  If not, sell that on EBay for cash moneys!

edit: was this the guy that was refusing to use YASB?   I knew he was weird!  :)

Edited by XPav

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5 hours ago, Crimsonwarlock said:

What was you CR-90 made out of? Box cutters?

He never said that it was the CR-90 model that messed up the tyres. 

Edited by rhetor

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2 hours ago, rhetor said:

He never said that it was the CR-90 model that messed up the tyres. 

True, I don't know for a fact why the tires are flat. But it warms the cockles of my heart to see such poetic justice.

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1 hour ago, Jo Jo said:

Was this guy drinking or on drugs maybe? 

I *think* it was a matter of him getting increasingly frustrated over the last few matches where the CR-90 had been used combining with him having an extremely unlucky opening for this match. When he'd used the CR-90 and I didn't have a capital ship he would use the corvette more as a blunt object then as a long range artillery bombardment specialist. Meaning he would race forward to try ramming my ships at speed 5 while taking one (maybe two) pot shots with a range 2+ hardpoint weapon while relying on Point Defense Battery to try keeping my ships off him. Or in other words, he tried using the CR-90 as a knife fighter and battering ram.  Which in turn made for long and drawn out matches where his capital ship was mostly impotent. Meanwhile I would use the CR-90 as an artillery platform. I like to load it up with long range weapons and try to keep my distance from the enemy ships so those long range weapons can be used effectively. A tactic which can prove quite deadly if you can maintain your distance. :)

I'd seen his frustration, which is why the the Epic scenario got delayed until we could both be fielding a Huge ship. Part of his problem is that the Empire doesn't have many  Large base ships that are rereleased for 2.0 just yet, and he doesn't like fielding the one the faction currently does have. He's also gotten less practice then me with Huge ships. These two issues combined to mean he just doesn't have as much spacial awareness for how far Large and Huge ships are likely to actually move. So he inadvertently ran over his own fleet. And due to some extremely bad luck, that one mistake was punished extremely hard. Much harder then I had honestly expected it to be. I can understand why he snapped, but it still doesn't excuse it.

That said, I find Huge ships to be a great deal of fun to field. They're powerful, but not overwhelmingly so. And they can definately shake things up since tactics which work great in a 200 point match normally don't work quite as well once a Huge ship shows up. And sure a single good hit with certain hardpoint weapons or the CR-90's primary can spell instant doom for many small ships. But that's true for proton torps, the VCX-100, and any number of other things too.

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1 hour ago, Faerie1979 said:

 I can understand why he snapped, but it still doesn't excuse it.

 

 

I can't, not to that level. You guys were playing a casual game in the comfort of your apartment. This wasn't a cut game in a regional championship (even then it would be way across the line). To completely snap and start breaking a model that isn't his, is just beyond crazy. That dude needs some serious help and its not just his X-wing flying. 

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One thing I really appreciate is how each of the Huge Ships feels very different in terms of how you want to build them, and how to play. The Gozanti, GR-75 and C-ROC all feel very different in how they help your squad. The CR-90 seems like it wants to be a long-range artillary battery (especially when Saw exists as a crew option) which uses its broadsides, while the Raider wants to charge straight in and unload Ordnance.

The biggest weakness in Epic is that only three factions are really fleshed out. Seperatist, Republic, Resistance and First Order are all seriously hindered by the lack of titles and dedicated crew. The FO Raider in particular needs an option to generate or save Calculate tokens in order to help it benefit from Bombardment Specialists.

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26 minutes ago, PhantomFO said:

One thing I really appreciate is how each of the Huge Ships feels very different in terms of how you want to build them, and how to play. The Gozanti, GR-75 and C-ROC all feel very different in how they help your squad. The CR-90 seems like it wants to be a long-range artillary battery (especially when Saw exists as a crew option) which uses its broadsides, while the Raider wants to charge straight in and unload Ordnance.

The biggest weakness in Epic is that only three factions are really fleshed out. Seperatist, Republic, Resistance and First Order are all seriously hindered by the lack of titles and dedicated crew. The FO Raider in particular needs an option to generate or save Calculate tokens in order to help it benefit from Bombardment Specialists.

I agree. I am loving the way the ships perform. 

I'd love to see a card pack for the other factions. There is a ton of ground to cover for the other factions. 

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Sorry about your CR-90, atleast the guy agreed to immediately replace it. I can't imagine my fury if somebody did that to one of my huge ships and didn't even offer that.

464681742_x-wingepicc-rocs.thumb.jpg.7bfac4a9e100382183d3f0be2aef2a43.jpg


Finally got to field my Huge Ships after being unable to get a game with them in 1.0. That was a blast. I thought I was well in the lead after smoking Obi-wan early on and crushing most of his Torrent wing with a 5-speed C-ROC ram, and then his CR90 finally got to unleash its Turbolasers. Had a YV-666 at almost full health get destroyed in a single turn from primary + Turbolaser fire. The above image is the aftermath of those events. Then it tore one of my C-ROCs to pieces, then put my 2nd C-ROC in bad shape before I took it down, winning me the game. If he had Bombardment Specialists to keep the Turbolaser fire going when I got in close, I think I would've lost my last C-ROC and had a shot at cleaning up what I had left.

Some thoughts:
-Turbolasers are REALLY scary. Especially against low agility ships. Luckily they lost a lot of their threat once I got within their minimum range, but if he had Bombardment Specialists...
-Fairly obvious, but it's hard to hit Jedi with Point Defense Lasers, even when they're at Range 1, but I did manage to do so even without Drea's rerolls (need to keep her closer next time). PDL's are maybe too costly for CR90s and Raiders considering how much energy they guzzle, but ~70 pts for the smaller huge ships to unleash tons of attacks before going up in flames I think is worth it. Especially with Drea or Howlrunner adding rerolls on each. Blood Crow with Kallus and Howlrunner as an escort is something I want to witness just once.
-Despite getting annihilated by Turbolasers, I think YV-666s are quite a bit better here. My 4 YV-666s covered a lot of ground for blocking or getting shots and have native Reinforce to blunt incoming fire. As long as the huge ship isn't dialed in to go fast, purposefully getting them run over can help reposition them to get back into the fight too.
-Tibanna Reserves seem quite useful for Turbolasers. The C-ROC was able to constantly stay on the offensive with energy to spare for Gunnery Specialist rerolls as needed. I saw someone posting that Optimized Power Core was purely superior, but I'm not so sure since it's more expensive, only gives 1 more energy and limits your dial to get that 1 energy. I think being able to dial white and red maneuvers and still fire Turbolasers when low on energy is worth it even with the price of an action.
-Jam is a good action. I wouldn't be surprised to see Jamming Beam used on the table, or even start actually costing points!

Edited by Enigami

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