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drail14me

Why only two bases in the Huge Ship Conversion Kit?

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4 minutes ago, drail14me said:

Got my Huge Ship Conversion Kit today. Was disappointed to find only two huge ship bases in the kit when the kit is supposed to convert all five ships. 
 

Why only two bases? Are they going to be available separate? 

The conversion kit is designed for a single player in mind.

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11 minutes ago, Kehl_Aecea said:

The conversion kit is designed for a single player in mind.

I understand that. But how much more would it have cost FFG to put five bases in? 

I was planning a Epic Huge ship game at my local store this weekend and bringing four of my five ships to use. Can’t do that now. 
 

I bought five ships. I should be able to use five ships. At least offer the bases separately. I shouldn’t have to buy a second or third conversion kit to use my  five ships. 

Edited by drail14me

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It makes perfect sense. You have five ships, but you can't use all 5 at the same time on the same list.

This also goes back to the faction conversion kit arguments where people with HUGE collections couldn't convert their entire collection at the same time... it was a no-win scenario. Like you, I also have all 5 ships, but expecting 5 bases? That was expecting far too much... also we knew about the two base thing for a while now.

Also, from a company viewpoint, they don't want you to share. 

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3 minutes ago, Kehl_Aecea said:

Also, from a company viewpoint, they don't want you to share. 

Yeah, that’s the key and I think it’s BS. 
 

I bought five ships. If I want to play a casual 3 vs 3 game with three factions and put all five of my ships on the table for an afternoon of Star Wars fun then I have to buy three conversion kits! The kit converts five ships, it should have five bases. 

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Look, @drail14me, the kit is designed to support one fleet on the table in most game encounters. Your rival is expected to have brought their own components.

Your stated intention is outside the standard play even on epic scale. Not the largest, not unheard of, but certainly more ships than average. As such, the "average" sized huge ship kit is not sufficient for you.

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Just now, LagJanson said:

Look, @drail14me, the kit is designed to support one fleet on the table in most game encounters. Your rival is expected to have brought their own components.

Your stated intention is outside the standard play even on epic scale. Not the largest, not unheard of, but certainly more ships than average. As such, the "average" sized huge ship kit is not sufficient for you.

There is no standard play. Page 2 of the included rule book says they are used for casual games. If I want to run a CROC with my Rebels then that’s fine. 
 

I understand the argument about conversion kits not being matched to convert these huge collections. I agree with that. 
 

This is not the case. FFG released five Epic ships. The kit converts these five ships. It should have the parts to fully convert all five. 

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6 minutes ago, drail14me said:

There is no standard play. Page 2 of the included rule book says they are used for casual games. If I want to run a CROC with my Rebels then that’s fine. 

That’s not what I meant and I’m pretty darned sure I was obvious about it. I meant that in "most" games with huge ships people don’t use more than two per side.

 

8 minutes ago, drail14me said:

This is not the case. FFG released five Epic ships. The kit converts these five ships. It should have the parts to fully convert all five.

And... yep. I’m done here. I can see the sleigh ride is off and sliding into a pit and I’ll have no part of this ride.

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6 minutes ago, drail14me said:

There is no standard play. Page 2 of the included rule book says they are used for casual games. If I want to run a CROC with my Rebels then that’s fine. 
 

I understand the argument about conversion kits not being matched to convert these huge collections. I agree with that. 
 

This is not the case. FFG released five Epic ships. The kit converts these five ships. It should have the parts to fully convert all five. 

It does include everything to convert all the ships. It is also not designed to use all 5 at once. It never stated it would. So it included everything to convert your 5 epic ships. They included enough bases for you to either run 2 ships from your chosen faction (the max expected for most matches) or 1 for you and 1 for an opponent to use. I see nothing wrong here.

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1 minute ago, LagJanson said:

And... yep. I’m done here. I can see the sleigh ride is off and sliding into a pit and I’ll have no part of this ride.

It’s money that FFG is leaving on the table if they don’t sell huge bases separately. But if it comes to that, I have every confidence that the fine folks at Etsy, or perhaps just some randos with a 3-D printer, will solve this problem in short order.

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4 minutes ago, LagJanson said:

That’s not what I meant and I’m pretty darned sure I was obvious about it. I meant that in "most" games with huge ships people don’t use more than two per side.

 

And... yep. I’m done here. I can see the sleigh ride is off and sliding into a pit and I’ll have no part of this ride.

You’re right. Most games don’t use more than two and yeah, I’m probably sounding petty. 
 

I understand the arguments from the small ship conversion kits. Some of that was frustrating too. And yeah, FFG couldn’t taylor kits for everyone’s varied collections. 
 

but here, we’re talking five $100 ships vs throwing in three 20 cent pieces of plastic and three $1 cardboard dials. But yeah, people have varied collections of huge ships as well. 
 

Maybe they should have done individual ship conversion kits. One kit for each ship.

 

It just sucks. I live in a small town with a small play group. The other guy I play with is on a limited budget. We’re trying to build a community. I’ve got all five huge ships. He has none. I was gonna use mine but to do so means another $30 for two bases and two Resource Trackers. Everything else in the kit will go in the trash. Seems wasteful. 

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51 minutes ago, drail14me said:

I was planning a Epic Huge ship game at my local store this weekend and bringing four of my five ships to use. Can’t do that now. 

A single conversion kit suffices to get you and a buddy into an Epic game. That’s the design intent. Why would they give you more than you can use in a game? 
 

Extra pieces = extra weight = extra cost or lower margin. Good margins are what give us the game in the first place. This was an easy call from the FFG perspective. 

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4 minutes ago, drail14me said:

It just sucks. I live in a small town with a small play group. The other guy I play with is on a limited budget. We’re trying to build a community. I’ve got all five huge ships. He has none. I was gonna use mine but to do so means another $30 for two bases and two Resource Trackers. Everything else in the kit will go in the trash. Seems wasteful. 

Totally fair and understandable. Before I moved from my last town, there would be nights that I showed up to the local store at 6 and left at 9:30 without playing a single game because no one brought X-Wing stuff. It sucks, we definitely hear you!

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22 minutes ago, drail14me said:

You’re right. Most games don’t use more than two and yeah, I’m probably sounding petty. 
 

I understand the arguments from the small ship conversion kits. Some of that was frustrating too. And yeah, FFG couldn’t taylor kits for everyone’s varied collections. 
 

but here, we’re talking five $100 ships vs throwing in three 20 cent pieces of plastic and three $1 cardboard dials. But yeah, people have varied collections of huge ships as well. 
 

Maybe they should have done individual ship conversion kits. One kit for each ship.

 

It just sucks. I live in a small town with a small play group. The other guy I play with is on a limited budget. We’re trying to build a community. I’ve got all five huge ships. He has none. I was gonna use mine but to do so means another $30 for two bases and two Resource Trackers. Everything else in the kit will go in the trash. Seems wasteful. 

I am by no means am epic guy, but couldn't you both build fleets of regular sized ships around one huge ship each and have a bunch of fun? Just do like aces high and make those huge ships super beefy with tons of guns and upgrades, which would be the draw for epic for me anyway. Sounds like fun to me and I'm not even super engaged in the format

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1 hour ago, drail14me said:

Yeah, that’s the key and I think it’s BS. 
 

I bought five ships. If I want to play a casual 3 vs 3 game with three factions and put all five of my ships on the table for an afternoon of Star Wars fun then I have to buy three conversion kits! The kit converts five ships, it should have five bases. 

I have noticed that, although this subreddit has 42069 readers, I am not receiving 42069 upvotes on my posts. I'm not sure if this is being done intentionally or if these "friends" are forgetting to click 'upvote'. Either way, I've had enough. I have compiled a spreadsheet of individuals who have "forgotten" to upvote my most recent posts. After 2 consecutive strikes, your name is automatically highlighted (shown in red) and I am immediately notified. 3 consecutive strikes and you can expect an in-person "consultation". Think about your actions.

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34 minutes ago, drail14me said:

You’re right. Most games don’t use more than two and yeah, I’m probably sounding petty. 
 

I understand the arguments from the small ship conversion kits. Some of that was frustrating too. And yeah, FFG couldn’t taylor kits for everyone’s varied collections. 
 

but here, we’re talking five $100 ships vs throwing in three 20 cent pieces of plastic and three $1 cardboard dials. But yeah, people have varied collections of huge ships as well. 
 

Maybe they should have done individual ship conversion kits. One kit for each ship.

 

It just sucks. I live in a small town with a small play group. The other guy I play with is on a limited budget. We’re trying to build a community. I’ve got all five huge ships. He has none. I was gonna use mine but to do so means another $30 for two bases and two Resource Trackers. Everything else in the kit will go in the trash. Seems wasteful. 

If they had done individual ship conversion kits, each kit would have cost $15-20, MSRP, I can pretty much guarantee that. How? Take a look at these forthcoming products:
https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/x-wing-second-edition/products/hotshots-and-aces-reinforcements-pack/ $19.95
https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/products/x-wing-second-edition/products/fully-loaded-devices-pack/ $14.95
Oh, and a huge ship conversion kit is a lot closer in contents to the hotshots and aces set, than the device pack, so it most likely would have been $19.95 for each one. Now you've made it go from $30 to get two ship bases, and all the cards necessary for any of the five ships, into $40 for two ship bases, and only the cards for two ships. That's not a better deal. They can drop the total price because they don't have to worry that, say, the C-ROC conversion kits are going to sit on the shelf, while a bunch of Raider conversion kits get sold. If you can't sell through the entire product line, you need a higher profit margin per unit to account.

Contrary to what seems like a widely-held belief, the cost of the plastic or cardboard is not the majority of the cost of the product. Among other things, they have to pay their employees, which is usually the biggest expense for companies like FFG. Then they have to balance how much will end up going unsold vs what will sell. That factors into how much profit margin per unit they need to make, because a unit that doesn't sell is a loss, not a profit.

I doubt that the majority of their customers even have five ships from 1.0. Plenty, like me, only have two. I'm willing to bet that even more have zero. (Remember, the majority of the people who buy these ships never even know these forums exist, so you can't use the people here as a representative sample, in the least - we're the most hardcore customers, by and large). This is going to be a much lower volume product than the regular conversion kits. And I see plenty of those sitting on shelves in stores as it is. Putting in a couple extra bases may only increase the per-unit cost by a handful of cents, but it will directly lead to even fewer units selling. Which would mean they would have had to increase the price to account for that. Which would end up meaning even fewer sales. Which would mean the product wasn't viable at all.

So, yes, they are trying to get people like you who want to field five ships at the same time to purchase extra copies. Their other choices would be to either lose money on the product (not an option), or not release the product at all.

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I don't see the big deal with "only" getting 2 huge bases in this. Realistically, how many Huge ships is any one player going to be fielding? One, maybe two? Yeah, probably only one so you can afford to have some upgrades and a Wing or two of fighters. Which suggests to me that 2 huge ship bases should be plenty for supplying both sides of a 1v1 battle. And it's not like you don't already have more ship plates then you do bases (or ships) to begin with. I can also foresee Huge bases in various colors being sold separately at some point.

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