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rsdockery

Dream Eaters player cards

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Just as a small counterpoint - but not to invalidate any arguments here - Mandy last weekend (40 card deck) assembled the Pendant twice in a game of Labyrinths. The first time was around turn 5, the second time around turn 12 or so. So it's definitely doable. It depends, of course, on the rest of the deck and lots of other intangibles (like if you're playing 4 player and decide 'i'm getting the pendant, forget about you guys'). 

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In practice, Segment of Onyx/Pendant of the Queen has proven to be so effective that it almost seemed overpowered. I've seen it successfully assembled, used up and reassembled multiple times per scenario over the course of two full campaigns, by a 40-card Mandy deck. Mandy going in for a big Mr Rook draw every turn can pick out any two cards she likes, and once it's later on in a scenario you can quickly assemble it again as it's shuffled back into a far leaner deck - which is good, because I think the card shines more in the latter parts of a scenario. The resource cost is moderate even if you aren't going for Dr Milan; if you are, it's inconsequential.

Picking up clues for no action from any location is extremely potent, particularly for scenarios where moving around can be prohibitive, but is also great for supporting your allies while you investigate your own location (for instance: You are on an 8-clue location, your friend is on a 4-clue location. You spend your turn picking up most of the clues on your current location, but your friend, not being a seeker, can only get 1 clue per action (Mystic with Sixth Sense or using a single charge of Rite of Seeking (4); someone with a flashlight at a 2-shroud location; etc.). You pick up the last clue with Pendant and your ally is free to spend the next turn doing other things. 5 base intellect is certainly not enough to be able to investigate any location with ease (at least not on difficulties above Easy) - there's plenty of 5-shroud locations in the game and unless you're going into Higher Education, an asset-heavy board state or a huge numbers Minh build, it's not possible to trivialise the test without a significant amount of effort.

Evading any enemy (not just non-elites) at any location is so potent as to be absurd - lock down a tough Retaliate enemy for your Guardian halfway across the map; keep the boss unable to hurt you for three straight rounds while the team dogpiles it; keep a Hunter enemy from catching up; save yourself from the ghoul who just jumped on you without provoking an attack of opportunity or even using an action, letting you use Pathfinder to move away and keep investigating. This is the real power of the

Being able to teleport anywhere is fantastic - certainly the least frequently used of the three options, but trivialises the final part of several scenarios and generally lets you solve problems, whether in the form of teleporting to an ally to commit to a clutch test, teleporting away from a Massive enemy to let your heavy-hitters do their work, or teleporting to an enemy if you happen to have a combat solution.

It's a free trigger without a "during your turn" restriction which amps up the power even further - draw Grasping Hands and the damage might kill you? Teleport to your friendly Guardian with True Grit or Agency Backup in the player window. Or teleport to a friend with a card to commit in the window before committing cards. Do the same in the window between Hunter Enemies Move and Enemies Attack to get to your friend with Dodge or some soak or Heroic Rescue - or exhaust the enemy in that window to prevent the attack altogether if it would be beneficial to have it at your location. Pick up an enemy and teleport to your Guardian before their turn begins so they can make the most of Scene of the Crime - or teleport yourself to your friend with an enemy before your own turn begins for the same reason as Joe Diamond once you see that Scene of the Crime is on top of your Hunch Deck.

There are countless amazing applications for this card - it has three strong options, all for no action, all with unlimited range, covering the three core areas of movement, clue-gathering and enemy management. Dismissing it with an unfavourable comparison to Working A Hunch is frankly absurd.

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My last post was specifically addressed to the arguments made by Donel,  and they brought up working a hunch,  which is why I mentioned it.   Donel was also talking specifically about the clue-gathering function of the Pendant,  so my thoughts were limited to that as well.   The teleportation or evasion abilities weren't part of the discussion.

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5 minutes ago, rsdockery said:

...And now they've just previewed Lucid Dreaming, a level 3 card that lets Mandy instantly reassemble the whole amulet once she gets the first segment.

And trigger Astounding Revelation to pay for the other two pieces!

But that's just the tip of the Lucid Dreaming iceberg...

(also it's level 2)

Edited by Allonym

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The new card spoiled today, might help find the third one more easily, or any myriad card. But I agree, to really get the biggest bang for your buck with that card, you have to hold onto cards in your hand and wait. That could become problematic in Dream-Eaters, where weaknesses and even encounter cards will sometimes have to take up space in your hand. I test played a 40 card deck Mandy a week or so ago and didn’t get near the bottom. Those cards were there, but the only one I saw, was the one I drew after a mulligan. She did fine with her 5 intellect and deduction though. 

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3 hours ago, rsdockery said:

...And now they've just previewed Lucid Dreaming, a level 3 card that lets Mandy instantly reassemble the whole amulet once she gets the first segment.

And once she's disposed of her weakness, as with all "search your deck" cards.

But it works without that caveat for anyone at her location.

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So in a more thorough analysis of Lucid Dreaming, I see it having four broad areas of application.

First is Mandy. It's an inexpensive "search your entire deck" card so it can be a guaranteed way to defuse her weakness at a safe moment to make big pulls with Mr Rook etc. safe and let you start using No Stone Unturned (5). With Myriad cards (notably Segment of Onyx and Easy Mark), she can target the first card and get both other copies out of her deck. Her ability won't do anything for non-Myriad cards since there necessarily must be at most one copy of the searched-for card in her deck, but she has a lot of search abilities and can only use her ability once a round. A guaranteed trigger of her signature event (or another research event) makes up for the inefficiency of the card.

Second is Tony. He benefits strongly from having both copies of his Long Colts in hand at once so he can play the second for free, and Lucid Dreaming is worth it on that basis alone; it also reduces his dependence on Prepared for the Worst and therefore makes it more viable to have a secondary class other than Guardian. With Seeker, for instance, he could take Segment of Onyx and a couple of research events and have a use for Lucid Dreaming even once he has his Long Colts in play. It also helps with Easy Mark - obviously it makes it a lot less efficient (you're essentially paying an action, a card and a resource to get the second Easy Mark, reducing the gain from 2 resources, 1 card, 1 action saved to just +1 resource and deck thinning, but the better way to look at it is that Easy Mark lets you get some value from Lucid Dreaming once you no longer need it for the Long Colt, reducing the chances of it being a dead draw.

Third is anyone who relies heavily on a limited-use asset. The main investigators I'm thinking of are Guardians (getting your second Flamethrower in hand to replace the first once it runs out of ammo) and Mystics (pull out your second Rite of Seeking/Shrivelling (5) ready for when your first runs out of charges, or Seal of the Seventh Sign when the first is almost gone). This also applies for soak assets, and therefore is obviously great for Tommy Muldoon as the article states. In these cases you can again slot in a few Myriad cards or Research events to help add value to Lucid Dreaming alongside its role as another means of (de facto) reloading/recharging/healing an asset.

The fourth is essentially just added flexibility - use it to target whatever useful card you happen to have in your hand or play area. Get a second Ward of Protection or a second Deduction (2) or whatever. I don't see this being that useful for most investigators because it's so inefficient - just take the Draw action, and a well-built deck will mainly contain useful cards. It's not like it can get out a solution you need right now, after all, since you necessarily already need to have a copy of the card ready. I see this being useful for "Ashcan" Pete and Wendy Adams, as the lack of icons on Lucid Dreaming doesn't really bother them - if they don't have a good target for them, they can just discard it to their abilities, and both investigators often tend towards toolbox-style decks. It's also going to be great for Sefina Rousseau - she can get out extra copies of The Painted World, or spend one action to draw a useful event under her card and a second action to search her second copy. Sadly, she can't target cards currently under her investigator card (as these have been confirmed to be out of play), but it still works well with her playstyle. The action inefficiency isn't such a problem as she's a rogue so can get a lot of actions.

6 minutes ago, CSerpent said:

And once she's disposed of her weakness, as with all "search your deck" cards.

But it works without that caveat for anyone at her location.

The fact that it will definitely hit her weakness is in many ways a good thing - I'd far rather use Lucid Dreaming to hit my weakness than waste No Stone Unturned (5) or a Mr Rook pull and a use of her investigator ability.

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31 minutes ago, Allonym said:

The fact that it will definitely hit her weakness is in many ways a good thing - I'd far rather use Lucid Dreaming to hit my weakness than waste No Stone Unturned (5) or a Mr Rook pull and a use of her investigator ability.

It's not good if you're using it to get all three of a Myriad.

Don't forget Research Librarian as her weakness trigger.  Much cheaper (XP-wise) and still gives you a meat shield.

Edited by CSerpent

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16 minutes ago, CSerpent said:

It's not good if you're using it to get all three of a Myriad.

Don't forget Research Librarian as her weakness trigger.  Much cheaper (XP-wise) and still gives you a meat shield.

Running both for more chances of getting a full search early on is good (particularly if running a 40 or 50 card deck - very easy for cards to be buried deep down), and taking up your ally slot is a problem if you aren't going academic army. Lucid Dreaming is also slightly cheaper. Moreover, if you aren't running any tomes (which is very plausible), Research Librarian is a waste once you have dealt with your weakness. Even if you use your first copy of Lucid Dreaming to clear your weakness, the second copy is then useful to assemble the Segments of Onyx or whatever.

Regardless, I don't disagree that Research Librarian can also perform the task. They have their pros and cons.

Edited by Allonym

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