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KCDodger

First Order loyalist reporting for duty.

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Kylo Tavson Upsilon - The two upsilons should be Range4 apart, BUT NOT FARTHER. You'll be out of range to help each other if so. Push Kylo around the enemy. 

Kylo QD Upsilon - Strong vs aces. You got tools to blow one up from range, then both Kylo or QD are cleaner-upers if you kill their I6. 

QD - Fanatical + Shield Upgrade - fly this slow and defensively, turning around sucks. 
With Autothrusters - turns into an Ace-y type of ship. 

Kylo - upgrade #1: Adv Optics. #2: Hate. #3: Proton Torpedoes. - Kylo is decent for straight forward damage. 

You need to practice and learn how the course of the game flows into how the Upsilon flies. Its very possible to keep it shooting from 0:00-1hr:00. (After that, bets are off, its probably floating around uselessly) 

Take Biohex for a free coordinate/jam in the late game. 

I think the other Silencers are weak. Others may disagree. 

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The First Order are in a really good place at the moment. 

You've got several potent Aces on good platforms (Kylo and Blackout are excellent in the I5 area, and Quickdraw in the SF), and their generics are well-costed and capable; the F/O has an excellent dial, and the SF is shockingly survivable and provides excellent arc coverage. The Upsilon serves as a brick. A vicious, hard-to-kill supportbrick.

Honestly, even with such a small selection of hulls, you can make most things work. Fat Aces? Kylo/Quickdraw. Three ship? Kylo/Quickdraw/Tavson, or Kylo/Quickdraw/Midnight(or Malarus). I've found Kylo (Hate, Advanced Optics) and three Zeta SFs (Passive Sensors, Ion Missiles) to be shockingly effective, and another player in my group has been having great success with 4 SFs (Quickdraw with all the trimmings, Backdraft with FCS and Ions, 2 Zeta SFs (Passives, Ions). You can fly a TIE/fo swarm if you wish, though the faction lacks a force multiplier akin to Howlrunner.

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Posted (edited)

The SF is currently my favorite FO ship. Generics are good naked, with the gunner, or with passive sensors and Missiles. All 4 pilots are good. QD wants mods (Predator, Fanatical, FCS, Optics, etc.) and the gunner. Backdraft usually is ok running really light (even upgrade-free if you need to). The Omega is mostly there just for the i3, these bois are shielded enough to not benefit from Fanatical much. But the extra initiative is actually really relevant in this meta. 

Silencers, Kylo is the best and does best with no upgrades, but you can put pretty much whatever you want on him if so inclined. Optics, Hate, Sense, Protorps... all solid options if you've got the points. Supernatural seems like overkill but do what you want really. but Blackout is also pretty alright, and does well with Fanatical and Optics. Same upgrades for the Test Pilot. Recoil takes Predator I guess. The other Silencer pilots are pretty meh. 

TIE/FO, I really like Scorch. Fanatical and/or Optics here but ok with/without either. Longshot's cool too. TN-3465 ("Tina") is actually surprisingly good with some spammed SFs to use her ability a bunch (due to the way she isn't removed until they're all done shooting). I like Midnight but she's pretty average. Generics with Optics seem good. Maybe put Crackshot on the Omegas. 

For the Ups, Tavson or the generic really. Key upgrades Phasma and Collision Detector. Thannison's cool too. 

Count to 200 with some mix of the above. I've personally been really enjoying Fanatical/Optics Blackout and three Passive/Cluster/Failsafe Omega SF's. 

As for flying, lots of playstyles work. Tavson seems to like flying along a board edge and turning in - he's kinda the joust-bait element in lists. Silencers are basically chunky Soontirs. Note that all their abilities are basically blank, don't use them much. SFs like to fly closer together than you'd think, setting up "screens" (they're like the "offensive line" of your football team). Rear arc management is interesting. The SFs die about as fast as TIE Bombers, so be wary of being too aggressive. 

Edited by Kieransi

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15 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

I just wish there was more incentive for me to take and use the middling PS ships. That's in general for this game. 

I second this statement; the middling TIE/fo pilots....I find them to be awkward. It wouldn't be so bad if there were several (three or four) at the same initiative so you could do a First Order Inferno Squad, but there you go. It also doesn't help that they don't have any natural synergies (with the exception of Muse, who could do good work when stapled to Scorch or Malarus, I guess).

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1 minute ago, AceDogbert said:

I second this statement; the middling TIE/fo pilots....I find them to be awkward. It wouldn't be so bad if there were several (three or four) at the same initiative so you could do a First Order Inferno Squad, but there you go. It also doesn't help that they don't have any natural synergies (with the exception of Muse, who could do good work when stapled to Scorch or Malarus, I guess).

Yep. I just find I3s and I4s generally get slapped around by I6 and I5 super-aces. 

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31 minutes ago, AceDogbert said:

with the exception of Muse, who could do good work when stapled to Scorch or Malarus, I guess

Honestly, if taking Muse, she works great solo*, . Trying to fly her with Scorch or Malarus doesn't work too well because Scorch gains stress when he shoots, after Muse's ability triggers, and the TIE/fo isn't exactly short of blue moves to remove the stress next turn anyway, whilst Malarus' ability really comes into its own defensively**; yes, she can lock and use her ability to modify focus results offensively, but that's one two-dice attack. Getting her ability on 2-3 defensive rolls as well really gives you your money's worth but if Muse is parked at range 1, they're going to shoot Epsilon Leader instead of the nigh-invulnerable Security Officer.

 

* suggested build - give her Pattern Analyser. She essentially becomes a pocket TIE defender who can pull continuous segnor's loops without losing actions.

** suggested build - give her Elusive. Elusive, Evade and her ability and it's amazing how hard she is to hurt. BUT unlike, say, Biggs, you can't force anyone to shoot at her except by dint of her being the only target available.

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50 minutes ago, AceDogbert said:

I second this statement; the middling TIE/fo pilots....I find them to be awkward. It wouldn't be so bad if there were several (three or four) at the same initiative so you could do a First Order Inferno Squad, but there you go.

Not an unreasonable point of view. It doesn't help that Static has a really poor pilot ability, and Longshot's - isn't bad, but a pilot ability which says "when engaging an enemy at the least effective range for primary weapons, with a ship with a really weak primary weapon, your primary weapon is merely bad rather than awful" is hardly something to write home about.

I'd either stick with generics (because the base TIE/fo or TIE/sf chassis, especially supplemented with advanced optics or - in the former case - pattern anlysers, is really, really good) or else go for the I5 and I6 aces, of which the First Order gets a very impressive selection (Kylo Ren, Blackout, Midnight, Quickdraw, Null and soon Major Vonreg). Elite generics aren't a bad call either because Omega Squadron are only 2 points more than the cheapest version of their respective ships, and Fanatical is a very good value talent, whilst First Order Test Pilots have that lovely Initiative 4 that's actually worth paying for on a highly manoeuvrable chassis, especially paired with Pattern Analysers that aren't quite giving you a white talon roll, but come disturbingly close.

 

 

 

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I've now gone back into First Order's warm, fascistic embrace (boy, that sounds terrible...), after a stint with the Republic. Felt like it needed the love.

I love the /SF, and was curious about the variations of the 5 SF lists that are flying around in the forum, so gave it a spin yesterday, but couldn't really make it work. Definitely will like to get better at flying that many of them, but at the moment, my heart is set on Quickdraw and 2 First Order Pilots. Such a fun list! The Silencer is a solid platform, and the mind games that Quickdraw still manages to play with opponents is still quite gratifying :) Currently 4-2 wit hit and will be probably taking it over to one or two of the Hyperspace events that are coming up later in September.

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Almost any way you build a TIE/sf is good.

  • I've flown 6 naked.  A friend of mine has been flying two naked Zetas with Kylo and QD, and doing well (3rd in a local HST, out of ~30).  I still can't really believe the generics got buffed to be cheaper than the RZ-2 A-Wing.
  • Generics are strong with just Advanced Optics, or maybe add a talent (I think Crack Shot might be better than Fanatical on an Omega Expert SF... faster and more immediate).
  • Passive Sensors Missile builds are decent.  Homing Missiles feel radically unfair against Jedi, but **** those folks.  Ion is cheap and handy.  Cluster probably works, and there will be some things it'll just SHRED.  Concussion I'm not really into, because it's 41 points (no longer 5-per-list), and because at 42 points you can go with Gunner.
  • Gunner is solid.  A bit more guess-work in the arc, but honestly that's no big deal.  Compared to a Passive Sensors Concussion, I'd rather try to find the 1 point more for the Gunner, since that gives me unlimited shots rather than 3 charges, a 4-dice range 1 attack, and more freedom with my action for something like a defensive focus or a barrel roll.  There would be some builds which can't afford SFGunner, and I know some folks like the PS variants.  Optics is also solid on a Gunner SF.
    • That said... five ships at 40 points and four ships at 50 points is often the difference between a gunner and non-gunner build.  While I think the gunner variants are fine, I also think having an extra ship is probably a little better.
  • Blackout is always decent filler.
  • Quickdraw is a great ace-hunter.  I build them lean, but folks go more and it works.
  • All in all, one of my favorites of 2e.  The "two ships in one" design works so well here.

TIE/fo has some bummer pilots *cough*Static*cough*, but is mostly solid for what it is.

  • Generics compare decently to Torrents as basic filler.  Rivas is a nice little 2-point upgrade for free Locks (Kylo loves to lock, and FCS Quickdraw often does as well).
  • Static is always decent filler.
  • Most of the other named pilots have some cute little niche.  Null spends some time as a high-init ship.  Midnight has promise, but I keep being scared by the cost when he gets fully built, but I guess that's Init 6 for you.  Muse is cool.  TN-3465 dies in a blaze of glory, but hopefully the opponent does too.

Upsilons are not really my game.  I know they're good empirically (Tavson in particular), but I just don't really know how to fly them right.

Silencers are cool.  They just move so well.  I also like them lean, but that's just me.  Shirtless Kylo, just Fanatical on most anyone else (Recoil gets Predator or Marksmanship if he's trying to follow-up Kylo).  Optics adds punch, I just usually want to spend the points elsewhere.

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Start with Kylo then build to 200. Here's what I'm currently testing.

Needs a Name (199/200) ====================

TIE/vn Silencer: Kylo Ren (76 + 5) + Sense (5)

TIE/FO Fighter: "Scorch" (34 + 2) + Fanatical (2)

TIE/sf Fighter: Zeta Squadron Survivor (32 + 9) + Passive Sensors (3) + Concussion Missiles (6)

TIE/sf Fighter: Zeta Squadron Survivor (32 + 9) + Passive Sensors (3) + Concussion Missiles (6)

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Scorch is a monster with Fanatical/Advanced Optics. 

Kylo is great in his versatility no matter how you build him. Hate is good, as are Advanced Optics and Pattern Analyzer. 

Tavson is the best Upsilon pilot, and doesn't need any upgrades, aside from Biohexacrypt Codes if you can spare the point. 

Quickdraw and Omega Ace are shells of their former selves, but still pretty good. 

The new Interceptor has me giddy to try it, and we're getting new pilots soon as well. 

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Personally I have more fun with off-meta stuff: I think there's a lot of potential yet to be explored. For example, Hux really isn't bad, and neither is Stridan (I4 coordinate is great against vulture swarms and the like - there's lots of I1-3 beef out there). Stridan/Hux is a quite-decent place to start, and a 4-dice Tractor beam shooting before the rest of your list is actually pretty handy. I'm getting ready to try this:

Major Stridan (64)    
    General Hux (6)    
    Tractor Beam (2)    
    
Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)    
    Special Forces Gunner (10)    
    
Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)    
    Special Forces Gunner (10)    
    
Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)    
    Special Forces Gunner (10)    
    
Total: 198    
 
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0: https://raithos.github.io/?f=First Order&d=v8ZsZ200Z251XWW180WWW13WWY259XW182WWWY259XW182WWWY259XW182WWW&sn=Unnamed Squadron&obs=

Or you could drop Hux or downgrade Stridan to a SBP to put FCS on all the Zetas, which is also a good deal.

Cardinal or Dormitz with a little swarm of TIE/fos aren't that bad either, though they're both quite overpriced right now.

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If your just starting the faction practice with the upsilon.  If your really good with it the whole faction opens up but if it's a struggle or its just not your thing it will dictate how you approach the faction.   The upsilon is really cheap online.  Normally I'm all for buying locally the flgs but this is an exception.

Fanatic and advanced optics is a great combo.  

The first order is in great shape after the last point update.  We have  a lot viable builds.  

 

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I am in the boat that kylo is probably the biggest bait ship in the game. He looks good, performs well, but is very much not worth his points. Meh pilot ability and only 2 force and only ps5. I personally believe you should try to stay away from him. Backdraft naked right now is probably the best 39 points you can spend in the game. QD with a Gunner and FCS is a great ace Hunter and cheap too. After that I think it's flavor to taste for the rest of the ships. Tavson while really good, also is a chunk of your list. FOs came down in price a lot as well.

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22 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

Honestly, if taking Muse, she works great solo*, . Trying to fly her with Scorch or Malarus doesn't work too well because Scorch gains stress when he shoots, after Muse's ability triggers, and the TIE/fo isn't exactly short of blue moves to remove the stress next turn anyway, whilst Malarus' ability really comes into its own defensively**; yes, she can lock and use her ability to modify focus results offensively, but that's one two-dice attack. Getting her ability on 2-3 defensive rolls as well really gives you your money's worth but if Muse is parked at range 1, they're going to shoot Epsilon Leader instead of the nigh-invulnerable Security Officer.

 

* suggested build - give her Pattern Analyser. She essentially becomes a pocket TIE defender who can pull continuous segnor's loops without losing actions.

** suggested build - give her Elusive. Elusive, Evade and her ability and it's amazing how hard she is to hurt. BUT unlike, say, Biggs, you can't force anyone to shoot at her except by dint of her being the only target available.

Mese is good also as support ship.

With squad leader end bioex code it can be a cheap support for many lists

I like muse squad leader with quickdraw (to bouble mod his red dises) and 2 passive sensors sf.

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Posted (edited)

Still my all time favourite FO list:

Kylo Ren (76)
Supernatural Reflexes (24)
Pattern Analyzer (5)
Proton Torpedoes (13)

“Quickdraw” (45)
Crackshot (1)
Pattern Analyzer (5)
Special Forces Gunner (10)
Fire-Control System (2)
Afterburners (6)
Total: 187

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

 

Edited by Ryuneke

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16 hours ago, Hujoe Bigs said:

I am in the boat that kylo is probably the biggest bait ship in the game. He looks good, performs well, but is very much not worth his points. Meh pilot ability and only 2 force and only ps5. I personally believe you should try to stay away from him. Backdraft naked right now is probably the best 39 points you can spend in the game. QD with a Gunner and FCS is a great ace Hunter and cheap too. After that I think it's flavor to taste for the rest of the ships. Tavson while really good, also is a chunk of your list. FOs came down in price a lot as well.

I'm sorry, but you must understand: you don't fly Kylo for his ability. You fly him because he's an i5 3-3-4-2 with two force tokens and a tech slot, and one of the best dials in the game. 

He's incredibly versatile, and can be built to carry ordinance, become an unblockable ace with SNR, or an incredibly durable brawler with Hate. 

Granted, I'm hopeful Rush will give me something different that merits flying (i6), but that's due to list fatigue, not a criticism of Kylo. 

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6 hours ago, Manolox said:

Mese is good also as support ship.

With squad leader end bioex code it can be a cheap support for many lists

I like muse squad leader with quickdraw (to bouble mod his red dises) and 2 passive sensors sf.

Tavson loves Muse. Best synergy in the faction.

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