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Wazat

Call for Suggestions: Looking for something off-meta but effective

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One of our local yearly tournaments, Intermountain Cup, is coming up on Sept 21st and I am not prepared.  I don't really know what fleet I want to fly, and the stuff I usually fly is silly off-meta jank that often doesn't do well against the top meta.  I'm tempted to fly something like that anyway and just try to enjoy the tournament despite losing a lot, but it was painful during CaC to keep getting stomped by Rebel Beef, for example.

So here's the thing: I'm not too keen to just grab a top-meta list and fly it.  I have to see the top meta fleets a lot, particularly during a tournament, and I want to do something different.  Past tournaments were vultures and rebel beef against each other and little else, so it's better to mix it up.  I have a lot of fun bringing something the meta players have never seen before and giving them a real run for their money, maybe even beating them with the weird cluster-cuss they didn't expect to put up any kind of fight.

So I'd like to ask for advice: What are you flying that's weird and off-meta, but effective enough to at least tango?

 

As for my current experiments:

I'm going to start testing these lists that use four-gunboat, and three-gunboat with a pocket ace.  Lots of health and firepower, but awkward movement.  I'm not sure if that'll make for a frustrating tournament, or if it'll be the chisel that breaks some of the meta fleets that were designed to fight different stuff.  I'll have to spend more table time with it -- I am at least getting better at flying gunboats!

Nu Squadron Pilot (32)    
    Passive Sensors (3)    
    Adv. Proton Torpedoes (6)    
    Os-1 Arsenal Loadout (0)    
    Proton Torpedoes (13)    
    
Ship total: 54  Half Points: 27  Threshold: 4    
    
Nu Squadron Pilot (32)    
    Passive Sensors (3)    
    Adv. Proton Torpedoes (6)    
    Os-1 Arsenal Loadout (0)    
    Plasma Torpedoes (9)    
    
Ship total: 50  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 4    
    
Nu Squadron Pilot (32)    
    Passive Sensors (3)    
    Adv. Proton Torpedoes (6)    
    Concussion Missiles (6)    
    Xg-1 Assault Configuration (0)    
    Autoblasters (2)    
    
Ship total: 49  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 4    
    
Nu Squadron Pilot (32)    
    Passive Sensors (3)    
    Adv. Proton Torpedoes (6)    
    Diamond-Boron Missiles (6)    
    Os-1 Arsenal Loadout (0)    
    
Ship total: 47  Half Points: 24  Threshold: 4    
    
    
Total: 200    
    
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0: https://raithos.github.io/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v8ZsZ200Z164X240W134WWW139W136WY164X240W134WWW139W234WY164X240W134W99WW144W232Y164X240W134W238WW139WW&sn=New%20Squadron&obs=

The pocket ace can be Maarek, Soontir, Duchess, etc... Empire has a surprising wealth of them.

Nu Squadron Pilot (32)    
    Passive Sensors (3)    
    Proton Torpedoes (13)    
    Xg-1 Assault Configuration (0)    
    Autoblasters (2)    
    
Ship total: 50  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 4    
    
Nu Squadron Pilot (32)    
    Passive Sensors (3)    
    Proton Torpedoes (13)    
    Xg-1 Assault Configuration (0)    
    Autoblasters (2)    
    
Ship total: 50  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 4    
    
Nu Squadron Pilot (32)    
    Passive Sensors (3)    
    Proton Torpedoes (13)    
    Xg-1 Assault Configuration (0)    
    Autoblasters (2)    
    
Ship total: 50  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 4    
    
Maarek Stele (46)    
    Ruthless (1)    
    Fire-Control System (2)    
    
Ship total: 49  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 3    
    
    
Total: 199    
    
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0: https://raithos.github.io/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v8ZsZ200Z164X240W136WWW144W232Y164X240W136WWW144W232Y164X240W136WWW144W232Y174X128W113WW&sn=Alpha%20PS%20Ace%20(Maarek)&obs=

 

If all else fails, there's always Wullffwarro War Crimes, my default/fallback fun fleet.  Not crazy effective against those top-meta players, but it's fantastic when it works.  Up to seven fully-modified attack dice tends to scare the **** out of the opposing team, even if it's occasionally an impotent threat in practice. :D  I don't think it's great against vulture swarms though... honestly, they may be the bane of most fleets I'd want to fly.  Last tournament I watched was just rebel beef vs rebel beef, and a few vultures; not much variety.  So I need to have plans for what I'll face.

Wullffwarro (56)    
    Trick Shot (4)    
    Saw Gerrera (9)    
    Hull Upgrade (3)    
    
Ship total: 72  Half Points: 36  Threshold: 5    
    
Jan Ors (43)    
    Elusive (3)    
    Moldy Crow (18)    
    
Ship total: 64  Half Points: 32  Threshold: 3    
    
"Dutch" Vander (40)    
    Selfless (3)    
    Dorsal Turret (3)    
    Proton Torpedoes (13)    
    R4 Astromech (2)    
    Hull Upgrade (3)    
    
Ship total: 64  Half Points: 32  Threshold: 5    
    
    
Total: 200    
    
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0: https://raithos.github.io/?f=Rebel%20Alliance&d=v8ZsZ200Z58X133W58WW164Y46X119WWWWW156Y27X130W137W136W5W164WW&sn=Wullffwarro%20War%20Crimes%202&obs=

 

 

Share your effective off-meta fleets!  In addition to welcoming ideas and suggestions, I love to see what novel fleets people are fielding.

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Posted (edited)

Hahaha my thread too competitive for your tastes? 

I built this for obiwan. I’m quite interested in seeing how it works. Definitely jank . But I would be willing to fly against tip top meta with it. 

Sense + 4 ships gives you tons of chances to block Init6 aces. Ahsoka's ability gives you lots of chances of creating a great block. 
Both Ahsoka and Obiwan are squirrelly enough to dodge and get good shots. Wolf AND 7thFG boost your firepower up to medium high. 
Torrent is a decent blocker, filler and distraction for your other ships to go to work. 
Obiwan has R2 and is your endgame ace. If you clean up their ace and put Obiwan into the end game with Sense?? Wow. 

Early game firepower: Ok, blocking potential: excellent
mid-game mobility: Excellent
late-game superiority: Ok

“Wolffe” (50)
Expert Handling (4)
Seventh Fleet Gunner (9)

Ahsoka Tano (47)
Predictive Shot (1)
Calibrated Laser Targeting (2)

Obi-Wan Kenobi (47)
Sense (5)
R2 Astromech (6)
Calibrated Laser Targeting (4)

Gold Squadron Trooper (25)
Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

Edited by Blail Blerg

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17 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

Hahaha my thread too competitive for your tastes? 

Nah, I just hate to hijack someone else's thread.  I've been trying extra hard lately to avoid that.

18 minutes ago, Blail Blerg said:

I built this for obiwan. I’m quite interested in seeing how it works. Definitely jank . But I would be willing to fly against tip top meta with it. 

Sense + 4 ships gives you tons of chances to block Init6 aces. Ahsoka's ability gives you lots of chances of creating a great block. 
Both Ahsoka and Obiwan are squirrelly enough to dodge and get good shots. Wolf AND 7thFG boost your firepower up to medium high. 
Torrent is a decent blocker, filler and distraction for your other ships to go to work. 
Obiwan has R2 and is your endgame ace. If you clean up their ace and put Obiwan into the end game with Sense?? Wow. 

Early game firepower: Ok, blocking potential: excellent
mid-game mobility: Excellent
late-game superiority: Ok

“Wolffe” (50)
Expert Handling (4)
Seventh Fleet Gunner (9)

Ahsoka Tano (47)
Predictive Shot (1)
Calibrated Laser Targeting (2)

Obi-Wan Kenobi (47)
Sense (5)
R2 Astromech (6)
Calibrated Laser Targeting (4)

Gold Squadron Trooper (25)
Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

Looks cool.  How often have you flown it?  How did it feel about aces and swarms, etc?

Thanks!

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I'm especially looking forward to Snap Shot Torani shenanigans.  :D

Juke + Snap Shot A-Wings might be potent; I look forward to seeing how it works out.  And Snap Shot gives you a range 2 forward weapon for your regular shot too (e.g. while your RZ-2 turret is backward), so there's a touch of extra utility there.

When is Snap Shot releasing?

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4 minutes ago, FourDogsInaHorseSuit said:

They're finally re-releasing Snapshot.
Combine it with Juke on some A Wings.
Then profit.

Snap Shot probably won't be available in time for that combo, and cost wise Snap+Juke will probably push even RZ-1s into the 4 ship list price range.

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Posted (edited)

Corran (76) Fcs , r4, stealth device

Arvel (37) intimidation

Sabine (42)

Evaan (40) ICT

197 points.

 

Arvel and sabine are very fun to fly. Avels great for blocking, and sabines free boost makes her a great flanker.

Joust with corran and Evaan. Corran will have 5 or 6 green dice. Corran is also a very fun double tapping ship with an amazing dial,  statline and action bar. (Poopy linked actions tho)

Edited by TBot

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Don’t know if this is off-meta enough or not, but it’s fun and not likely so see a mirror match. Although someone played something similar in CA on GSP. 

Ax-Wing

(55) Wedge Antilles [T-65 X-wing]
(0) Servomotor S-foils
(2) Predator
Points: 57

(62) Luke Skywalker [T-65 X-wing]
(0) Servomotor S-foils
(5) Sense
Points: 67

(36) Jake Farrell [RZ-1 A-wing]
(1) Crack Shot
Points: 37

(34) Arvel Crynyd [RZ-1 A-wing]
(3) Intimidation
(2) Predator
Points: 39

Total points: 200

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To save data for those with limits and wondering what build @JBFancourt is referring to:

Constable Zuvio (35)
L3-37 (4)
Proximity Mines (6)
Cloaking Device (5)
Afterburners (6)

Guri (64)
Outmaneuver (6)
Advanced Sensors (10)
Afterburners (6)
Virago (10)
Shield Upgrade (8)

Captain Seevor (30)
Predator (2)
Stealth Device (8)
Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

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2 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:

To save data for those with limits and wondering what build @JBFancourt is referring to:

Constable Zuvio (35)
L3-37 (4)
Proximity Mines (6)
Cloaking Device (5)
Afterburners (6)

Guri (64)
Outmaneuver (6)
Advanced Sensors (10)
Afterburners (6)
Virago (10)
Shield Upgrade (8)

Captain Seevor (30)
Predator (2)
Stealth Device (8)
Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

I really like Hugo's list, very much my style of taking on a tournament.  I was rooting for him.  :D  I'm surprised he didn't decloak to tractor Obi-Wan toward the bomb and asteroid to deal the final damage.  He forgot the ionize action restriction.  Great game, just barely messed up at the end.

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Blue Squadron Pilot (41)
Passive Sensors (3)
Proton Torpedoes (13)

Blue Squadron Pilot (41)
Passive Sensors (3)
Proton Torpedoes (13)

Garven Dreis (47)
Servomotor S-Foils (0)

Jake Farrell (36)
Predator (2)
Crack Shot (1)
Total: 200

Two full modded torps into any ship that lands in front of the bwings. Im 2-0 so far with it vs a V19 missile swarm, and a Vader, Dutches, Vermeil list.

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3 hours ago, Wazat said:

Nah, I just hate to hijack someone else's thread.  I've been trying extra hard lately to avoid that.

Looks cool.  How often have you flown it?  How did it feel about aces and swarms, etc?

Thanks!

Its meant for hijacking. Go hijack it! Use it for what you need it, let others use it. I'm all about sharing knowledge here. 

0 times. Just made it recently. 

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4 hours ago, Wazat said:

I really like Hugo's list, very much my style of taking on a tournament.  I was rooting for him.  :D  I'm surprised he didn't decloak to tractor Obi-Wan toward the bomb and asteroid to deal the final damage.  He forgot the ionize action restriction.  Great game, just barely messed up at the end.

Yeah, I was too, and ditto on my thoughts. I was happy seeing him do so well against a meta monster. 

I’m not even a scum player, and watching this game made me itch to play it! 😜

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I played a scum list recently just intending to get some stuff on the board that I rarely/never used before.

Ketsu  w/ shadowcaster

Talonbane

Zuckuss

Jakku gunrunner

It was way more effective than I expected.  Talonbane and Zuckuss are annoying if ignored but Ketsu and the gunrunner are dangerous in their own right with so many potential tractor effects.  I had an especially good time setting up traps to tractor ships into Talonbane's range 1 shots, and even when Zuckuss had trouble lining up shots he made some clutch jam actions.

It might not be what OP is looking for but anyone looking for something different should give it a try

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Posted (edited)

I played the four gunboats list today.  First game was pretty casual and I did well, but the 2nd game was against Luke and double-tap Ion Y-Wings, and I got thrashed.  I straight-up did not have a good time with that one.  So much so that I think maybe I need to fly something else.  I don't want to spend a whole tournament feeling that useless.  😕  Which means I need to move closer toward proven fleets. (unless it's actually a solid fleet and I just need practice... but putting practice into a bad fleet isn't a great path so I need to figure out if it's worth pursuing at all)

I feel like trying one of the Republic lists next.  I liked my old list that had Tucker with Prockets, two ARC-170s, and Obi-Wan.  It flew pretty well at the time, and a lot of that has dropped in price since.  But the other republic lists may work better, like @Blail Blerg's Wollffe list.  Thoughts?

 

Here's my old list updated for new points.  Tucker is a fun "they see it coming, they know better, but they don't see it coming" addition, and the rest feel like a solid team of bulk with an ace Obi-Wan.

Obi-Wan Kenobi (47)    
    Delta-7B (19)    
    
Ship total: 66  Half Points: 33  Threshold: 3    
    
"Tucker" (29)    
    Proton Rockets (7)    
    Munitions Failsafe (1)    
    
Ship total: 37  Half Points: 19  Threshold: 3    
    
104th Battalion Pilot (42)    
    Seventh Fleet Gunner (9)    
    
Ship total: 51  Half Points: 26  Threshold: 5    
    
104th Battalion Pilot (42)    
    Clone Commander Cody (3)    
    
Ship total: 45  Half Points: 23  Threshold: 5    
    
    
Total: 199    
    
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0: https://raithos.github.io/?f=Galactic Republic&d=v8ZsZ200Z278XWW201WY319X102W108Y341XWW227WWY341XWW225WW&sn=Junk Republic 2&obs=

 

Edited by Wazat

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1 hour ago, Wazat said:

Obi-Wan Kenobi (47)    
    Delta-7B (19)    
    
Ship total: 66  Half Points: 33  Threshold: 3    
    
"Tucker" (29)    
    Proton Rockets (7)    
    Munitions Failsafe (1)    
    
Ship total: 37  Half Points: 19  Threshold: 3    
    
104th Battalion Pilot (42)    
    Seventh Fleet Gunner (9)    
    
Ship total: 51  Half Points: 26  Threshold: 5    
    
104th Battalion Pilot (42)    
    Clone Commander Cody (3)    
    
Ship total: 45  Half Points: 23  Threshold: 5    
    
    
Total: 199

How heavily wedded are you to 7B on Obi-Won? This fits with 4 more points to do whatever with over the 7B version:

Obi-Wan Kenobi (47)
Sense (5)
R2-A6 (6)
Calibrated Laser Targeting (4)
Total: 62

It is a "meta" Obi, but it does possibly mean more toys for the clones.

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You want some scum? I've got some scum.

First off, here's a crazy list flown by @Dalli and another player in the top 16 of german nationals (I think). I've not played it but it looks like a lot of fun, and I know @Dalli is very good at making things work that seem like they are bad (see the decimator thread).

Latts Razzi (59)    
    Unkar Plutt (2)    
    0-0-0 (5)    
    Hound's Tooth (1)    
Ship total: 67  Half Points: 34  Threshold: 6    
    
Nashtah Pup (6)    
Ship total: 6  Half Points: 3  Threshold: 2    
    
4-LOM (49)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
    Contraband Cybernetics (3)    
Ship total: 53  Half Points: 27  Threshold: 5    
    
Koshka Frost (70)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
    IG-88D (3)     
Ship total: 74  Half Points: 37  Threshold: 5

 

Next, here's my own list, "Vorpal Blade", which I and others have flown to great success in hyperspace tournaments across the world. It's built to deal with aces, including jedi, and it does a great jump of bumping and destroying them.

Fenn Rau (68)    
    Crack Shot (1)      
Ship total: 69  Half Points: 35  Threshold: 2    
    
Captain Seevor (30)    
Ship total: 30  Half Points: 15  Threshold: 2    
    
Black Sun Assassin (48)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
Ship total: 49  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 3    
    
Black Sun Assassin (48)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
Ship total: 49  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 3    

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I've tried Capt Seevor, 3 Ion Scyks, and a fully loaded Palob. Great fun and completely wrecked my opponents' ace lists in both games I tried it in.

Lost one Scyk. Killed off Soontir, Duchess, a Sabre, and a Lambda; followed by Anakin, Mace, and Ahsoka.

A friend has tried 4 gunboats. He lost every practice game and then every tournament game: 8 games in a row. They were bad.

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11 hours ago, Blail Blerg said:

@Wazat, but competitive!!!1! 

Hahahaha. Welcome to the dark side. 

 

Yeah sometimes it still has to be a good list, and surprise there are bad lists. Rolling around in the muck is fun until someone elbows you in the face. 

Haha yea, and I've been getting elbowed, kicked, and stomped in the face a... lot.  Normally it's fine for casual play, some people just play too hard (they something meta with a minor tweak is suddenly casual jank, hah).  But the gloves come off in a tournament, or worse, and I don't want to be the boxer who shows up to a gun fight.  I'm too familiar with how that goes.  I have to compromise a lot for tournaments.

11 hours ago, Hiemfire said:

How heavily wedded are you to 7B on Obi-Won? This fits with 4 more points to do whatever with over the 7B version:

Obi-Wan Kenobi (47)
Sense (5)
R2-A6 (6)
Calibrated Laser Targeting (4)
Total: 62

It is a "meta" Obi, but it does possibly mean more toys for the clones.

I'd considered dropping 7B, but didn't pursue it.  I'm seeing CLT-Wan a lot, which indicates he's a solid choice.  Sense is something I was lamenting not having in the list, and it pairs well both with the astromech and with the init-2 allies.  I like this quite a lot!

I'll still not face mirror matches and I'm doing different stuff than most Republic lists (e.g. Tucker), which is the goal.  Still off-meta enough to feel interesting.

10 hours ago, gadwag said:

You want some scum? I've got some scum.

First off, here's a crazy list flown by @Dalli and another player in the top 16 of german nationals (I think). I've not played it but it looks like a lot of fun, and I know @Dalli is very good at making things work that seem like they are bad (see the decimator thread).

Latts Razzi (59)    
    Unkar Plutt (2)    
    0-0-0 (5)    
    Hound's Tooth (1)    
Ship total: 67  Half Points: 34  Threshold: 6    
    
Nashtah Pup (6)    
Ship total: 6  Half Points: 3  Threshold: 2    
    
4-LOM (49)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
    Contraband Cybernetics (3)    
Ship total: 53  Half Points: 27  Threshold: 5    
    
Koshka Frost (70)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
    IG-88D (3)     
Ship total: 74  Half Points: 37  Threshold: 5

 

Next, here's my own list, "Vorpal Blade", which I and others have flown to great success in hyperspace tournaments across the world. It's built to deal with aces, including jedi, and it does a great jump of bumping and destroying them.

Fenn Rau (68)    
    Crack Shot (1)      
Ship total: 69  Half Points: 35  Threshold: 2    
    
Captain Seevor (30)    
Ship total: 30  Half Points: 15  Threshold: 2    
    
Black Sun Assassin (48)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
Ship total: 49  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 3    
    
Black Sun Assassin (48)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
Ship total: 49  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 3    

I guess IG-88D is there to give Koshka a split-able focus token?  That's a neat idea I'd not thought of; when I see IG-88D in the list I always auto-skip it because I'm not fielding Aggressors.  Lots of neat ideas in the list, ranging from Latts stressing and tractoring foes to feed Koshka, to 4-LOM making generous donations for next round.

I like the Fenn-Vipers list too.  One ace and some heavy-hitting bumpers, plus Seevor for jamming locks and tokens away.

I'd like to give these a try sometime soon.

6 hours ago, Gilarius said:

I've tried Capt Seevor, 3 Ion Scyks, and a fully loaded Palob. Great fun and completely wrecked my opponents' ace lists in both games I tried it in.

Lost one Scyk. Killed off Soontir, Duchess, a Sabre, and a Lambda; followed by Anakin, Mace, and Ahsoka.

A friend has tried 4 gunboats. He lost every practice game and then every tournament game: 8 games in a row. They were bad.

Yea, I've won some games but not the serious ones, and that's a problem.  So maybe I should stop pursuing gunboats.  I keep feeling like they're too cumbersome to tango with the stronger fleets, and it gets so frustrating when they're rendered helpeless and impotent by the opponent's really solid flying.  They just can't match up the way ships with k-turns, rolls, or other tricks can, and the hit&run strategy gives too much advantage to foes that can outmaneuver me and take potshots at me during the escape, or stay on my tail so I can't get turned around.  The Ion Shutdown fleet I faced last night was painful; I just felt useless.  I don't want to spend all day at a tournament feeling that.

Seevor, Ion Scyks, and Palob are an interesting team.  Lots of utility effects there.  Post the list -- I want to see what's on Palob.

 

Thanks, everyone!

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3 hours ago, Wazat said:

Seevor, Ion Scyks, and Palob are an interesting team.  Lots of utility effects there.  Post the list -- I want to see what's on Palob.

 

Sunny Bounder (30)    
    Ion Cannon (5)    
    
Ship total: 35  Half Points: 18  Threshold: 2    
    
Cartel Spacer (28)    
    Ion Cannon (5)    
    
Ship total: 33  Half Points: 17  Threshold: 2    
    
Cartel Spacer (28)    
    Ion Cannon (5)    
    
Ship total: 33  Half Points: 17  Threshold: 2    
    
Captain Seevor (30)    
Ship total: 30  Half Points: 15  Threshold: 2    
    
Palob Godalhi (40)    
    Elusive (3)    
    Engine Upgrade (2)    
    Stealth Device (6)    
    Moldy Crow (18)    
    
Ship total: 69  Half Points: 35  Threshold: 3    
    
    
Total: 200    
    
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0: https://raithos.github.io/?f=Scum and Villainy&d=v8ZsZ200Z138XW11Y139XW11Y139XW11Y247XWY112X119WWWW107W166W156&sn=Unnamed Squadron&obs=

You can swap Sunny for a 3rd cartel spacer and add eg Crack Shot to Seevor.

I originally had Palob, Sunny, and Torani Kulda in the list, but left the Kimogila's dial at home. Fortunately, I had 2 extra scyks with me and they added up to exactly the same cost. Better list too.

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