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Turcopolier

When does the calcs from TA-175 get distributed?

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I've heard many say that the calculates from TA-175 isn't distributed until the ship is removed at the end of the engagement stage of the current initiative, and that there's a line in the rules reference that adresses this. However, I can only find the following on page 9: 

DESTROYING SHIPS
A ship is destroyed after it has a number of damage cards that equals or exceeds its hull value. A destroyed ship is placed on its ship card.

• After a ship is destroyed in a phase other than the Engagement Phase, it is removed from the game.

• If a ship is destroyed during the Engagement Phase, it is removed after all ships that have the same initiative as the currently engaged ship have engaged, which is called simultaneous fire

• If an effect triggers after a ship is destroyed, the effect resolves immediately before the ship is removed.

• A destroyed ship’s abilities remain active until that ship is removed unless the ability specifies a different timing for the effect to end, such as “until the end of the Engagement Phase.” Such effects remain active until the end of the specified time.

 

The third point seems to indicate that the calculates are distributed when a ship is destroyed, i.e the moment when the number of damage cards exceeds the number of hull point. This would for example mean that the ship itself would get a calc token that another vulture could use when it's defending or attacking.

Am I missing something here? People seems sure that it isn't until the ship is removed, but I can't read the rules that way. 

 

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• If an effect triggers after a ship is destroyed, the effect resolves immediately before the ship is removed.

That clearly state that the effect resolver immediatly before the ship is removed, thus after all ships of the same initiative have engaged.

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Ah, I see what you mean. Must have been a mental comma in my head. I read it as:

 If an effect triggers after a ship is destroyed, the effect resolves immediately, before the ship is removed

Thanks!

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That's actually a major issue with TA-175 in certain match-ups.  If you're opponent has a number of ships at the same initiative, you don't get any bonus calcs until all of their ships have fired.  That kinda sucks.

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1 hour ago, Turcopolier said:

This would for example mean that the ship itself would get a calc token that another vulture could use when it's defending or attacking.

This example actually hits on the 2nd instance. 

 

Quote

If a ship is destroyed during the Engagement Phase, it is removed after all ships that have the same initiative as the currently engaged ship have engaged, which is called simultaneous fire

If they are attacking or defending, then you are in the Engagement phase, and the ship isn't removed until the end of whatever initiative you are on. If the attack against that ship was the last attack of that initiative, then the ship gets the calc token, then is removed from the game (as well as the calc token) so no other ship would be able to use it. 

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Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, Lyianx said:

That's incorrect. Ships are still Destroyed the moment they reach 0 hull, even if they are not removed. So "after ship is destroyed" effects still trigger, even if the ship isnt immediately removed. 

Quote

• If an effect triggers after a ship is destroyed, the effect resolves immediately before the ship is removed.

Quote

After a friendly ship at range 0-3 with [calc] on its action bar is destroyed, each friendly ship at range 0-3 with [calc] in its action bar gains 1 calculate token.

Nope, the rules are actually pretty clear here.

Edit:  You do get the calc tokens but not until the ship is removed.  Which means if your opponent has 3 ships at Initiative 5, they all shoot before you get any bonus calcs.  You still get them but they may not do as much good.

Edited by gamblertuba

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7 minutes ago, gamblertuba said:

Nope, the rules are actually pretty clear here.

Yay conflict 

 

Quote

After: The effect resolves immediately following the timing specified.

 

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43 minutes ago, irishthump said:

So Dead Man’s Switch also triggers in the same way?

And Resistance Chewie?

Yes.

 

It's annoying, because this particular timing fraggle is an artefact of certain Destroyed abilities being timed as Destroyed when they should have been timed as Removed, but FFG preferring to fix them with rules rather than errata.

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