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xanderf

Rapid Launch Bay + Expanded Hangars = yes or no?

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Expanded Hangar Bay says "Your squadron value is increased by 1"

Rapid Launch Bay says "Before deploying fleets, you may set aside a number of friendly squadrons up to your squadron value..."

(emphasis added)

Does the 'before deploying fleets' qualifier mean that Expanded Hangar Bay has not been played yet, ergo you are limited to the printed squadron value on your ship?  Or do the effects of all cards take effect more or less at once, so you get the boost from EHB before determining how many squadrons you can set aside via RLB?

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It will count, but currently only works on ships with two Offensive Retrofit slots, so the Quasar Fire-1, ISD-1, for example. 

Once your fleet is set it's set, think like Tua - she adds a slot to your ship, which doesn't happen before/after deployment etc it happens during the list-building. ExHB applies during the list building once it is added to the ship. 

This works different than say Engineering Team, which gives you "1" Engineering Point, but does not increase your "Engineering Value"

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Minister Tua, however, does not specify 'before deploying fleets', as RLB does.  AFAIK, it's only RLB (and a few objectives) that specifically call out this 'before deploying fleets' as a distinct step, which made me wonder if there is something special about that, regarding how it interacts with other upgrades that do not use the same wording.

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22 minutes ago, Drasnighta said:

As a thought experiment:

 

At precisely what point would upgrades be assumed to be off, abd then turn on, if that were to be the case? (Instead of on until stated otherwise)

Normally I'd assume step 6 of setup - 'Deploy Ships' - is when upgrades are 'on', and 'on' simultaneously so all effects are effective for use (IE., Minister Tua adding a defensive retrofit so it can be equipped)

RLB (and only RLB of upgrade cards, AFAIK) specifically says before deploying fleets, though.  So...I dunno, in step...uhhh...5.5 for that one?

At least, if that 'before' keyword means anything.  It's not used in other places where that add or modified slots or stats (IE., Tua, Chimaera title, Spinal or Enhanced Armaments, Phoenix Home title, etc).  The Profundity title uses it, but I'm not sure what interactions there would be similar - other than the nesting doll effect, which appears to not have been allowed for in the original rules and so needed a special section of the FAQ added entirely for 'set aside ships and squadrons'.

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Nesting Doll was allowed to be put IN on order - the question with nesting dolls and the faq was about pulling it OUT, wether they all could go in the same turn, or because they were nested, wether dropping one meant passing the timing window for the others.

Because that was half Of the questions I asked over “The Raddus Bomb” specific build.

 

As I said. It’s just a thought experiment - butbto me - ships must have their statistics come the placement of your cards on the table - this is where your opponent is effectively verifying your list, so things that have restrictions must be applying, and ships must have their essential statistics including sizes- it’s not a big step to assume that modifications are present there, especially in the potential future of things that require certain values (say, a hypothetical “squad 1 only”).

 

There is no break to the game to assume they’re on until stated as off, so I inherently lean that way.  But other thoughts are welcome 🙂

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Reading through the FAQ, I'm currently leaning towards the answer that they do apply and the whole 'Before...' isn't really conveying any useful meaning.

I think the closest the FAQ comes to answering is in...

Quote

Q: During Setup, can ships and squadrons resolve card effects before they have been deployed?
A: Yes. During Setup, ships and squadrons that have not yet been deployed are in play, and their ship, squadron, and upgrade cards are active, unless that ship or squadron has been destroyed or set aside.

This effectively indicates that there are four states a ship/squadron might be in:

- 'Before deployed': ship and equipped card effects do function

- 'Deployed': ship and equipped card effects do function (obviously, this is most the game)

- 'Destroyed': ship and equipped card effects DO NOT function

- 'Set aside': ship and equipped card effects DO NOT function

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7 minutes ago, xanderf said:

Reading through the FAQ, I'm currently leaning towards the answer that they do apply and the whole 'Before...' isn't really conveying any useful meaning.

I think the closest the FAQ comes to answering is in...

This effectively indicates that there are four states a ship/squadron might be in:

- 'Before deployed': ship and equipped card effects do function

- 'Deployed': ship and equipped card effects do function (obviously, this is most the game)

- 'Destroyed': ship and equipped card effects DO NOT function

- 'Set aside': ship and equipped card effects DO NOT function

The "before" on the Rapid Launch Bays is in my opinion, purely to make sure it happens, well before the step of "At the Start of Deployment", to proof it against any effects potentially happening at that step.

I mean, "before" a step is inherently a nebulous meaning...  I mean, it kind of means you need intent to go into a step, before stopping, and doing something related to that step, but by having intent to go into that step, you're already post-breaking your timing window by granting a window back.

 

But that's the Rules-World we live in :)

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