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Q10fanatic

Found a couple of revisions in the points

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1 hour ago, Q10fanatic said:

0-0-0 and BT-1 are now listed as Hyperspace Legal for Scum. I triple-checked this a couple days ago, so I know that is an update/revision. 

Has anybody else found any changes so far?

Looking at the upload dates only S&V seems to have been revised.

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39 minutes ago, ClassicalMoser said:

Talent instead of force on little Ani?

Appears to be intentional. And it makes sense, if you think about it. He doesn’t know the force exists, hardly, at this point. He’s not able to actively manipulate it (as force talents would imply). But he’s a dang good pilot.

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1 minute ago, SpiderMana said:

Appears to be intentional. And it makes sense, if you think about it. He doesn’t know the force exists, hardly, at this point. He’s not able to actively manipulate it (as force talents would imply). But he’s a dang good pilot.

It would be unprecedented though, and it makes me wonder if Anakin/Vader could get both in the future? Unlikely, but I never thought this would happen either.

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LOL they are ahead of that, its why Juke went up in points AGAIN despite quad phantoms being the only list that really used it. And they broke the Quad Juke Ace list with the across the board cost increase of Phantoms and they still upped jukes cost... I think they already know how good Juke on Annie is.

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31 minutes ago, Endureil said:

LOL they are ahead of that, its why Juke went up in points AGAIN despite quad phantoms being the only list that really used it. And they broke the Quad Juke Ace list with the across the board cost increase of Phantoms and they still upped jukes cost... I think they already know how good Juke on Annie is.

Really, how good Juke is in general. It's a mash-up of Hotshot Gunner and an always-on crack shot without the bullseye requirement. HSG is worth 7 points and always-on Crack Shot would be beyond pricing. I think Juke definitely deserves to be the most expensive talent in the game, much more so than Outmaneuver or even Lone Wolf. 7 is probably enough.

I just want to see other talents like Daredevil and Saturation Salvo that never see the light of day go down. Daredevil would be great at 1. Crack shot and Predator could maybe gain a point.

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Posted (edited)

Juke is huge, effectively an extra damage per shot if your opponent can't stop it...provided you get that evade for "free" from somewhere (otherwise you lose mods by taking an evade action)

The effect is pretty top dollar on the ships that get free evades ala Stygium and Full Throttle

Now the n1 IS at least balanced out by only having two dice, but those are some **** nice pilot abilities (****, Ole! can basically be better than a phantom!)

 

Speaking of full throttle, the defender got buffed right? Still a mighty 82 for a juke onyx, but it's another factor in the juke nerf 

Edited by ficklegreendice

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18 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

Juke is huge, effectively an extra damage per shot if your opponent can't stop it...provided you get that evade for "free" from somewhere (otherwise you lose mods by taking an evade action)

The effect is pretty top dollar on the ships that get free evades ala Stygium and Full Throttle

Now the n1 IS at least balanced out by only having two dice, but those are some **** nice pilot abilities (****, Ole! can basically be better than a phantom!)

 

Speaking of full throttle, the defender got buffed right? Still a mighty 82 for a juke onyx, but it's another factor in the juke nerf 

Ryad and Vessery got -2 cost, all the others -1. So most Juke Defenders are costing more (the Juke Onyx was 81).

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2 minutes ago, Dasharr said:

Ryad and Vessery got -2 cost, all the others -1. So most Juke Defenders are costing more (the Juke Onyx was 81).

Makes sense, since everything with juke now costs more than it would

Oh well, any bit of help for the defenders is appreciated. I really miss them :(

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32 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

Oh well, any bit of help for the defenders is appreciated. I really miss them :(

Try them without Juke? Seriously naked Deltas are quite good if you have 70 points left to fill after getting your two aces in. A blocker that has the side bonus of being un-kill-able and heavy-hitting is seriously sweet.

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8 minutes ago, ClassicalMoser said:

Try them without Juke? Seriously naked Deltas are quite good if you have 70 points left to fill after getting your two aces in. A blocker that has the side bonus of being un-kill-able and heavy-hitting is seriously sweet.

I can't vouch for them in 2.0 yet, but in 1.0 Vader, Quickdraw and a Delta was pretty fun.

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23 minutes ago, ClassicalMoser said:

Try them without Juke? Seriously naked Deltas are quite good if you have 70 points left to fill after getting your two aces in. A blocker that has the side bonus of being un-kill-able and heavy-hitting is seriously sweet.

OGP(Palp)/Delta/Delta now fits with ST-321 and FCS on both Defenders... That list keeps getting a little bit better every round.

Hrm.  Advanced Sensors with Seventh Sister crew... That's got some potential to mess with people.

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1 hour ago, ClassicalMoser said:

Really, how good Juke is in general. It's a mash-up of Hotshot Gunner and an always-on crack shot without the bullseye requirement. HSG is worth 7 points and always-on Crack Shot would be beyond pricing. I think Juke definitely deserves to be the most expensive talent in the game, much more so than Outmaneuver or even Lone Wolf. 7 is probably enough.

I just want to see other talents like Daredevil and Saturation Salvo that never see the light of day go down. Daredevil would be great at 1. Crack shot and Predator could maybe gain a point.

Except juke isn't that great. Pretty much in all cases, you'll do more damage in the long run relying on your focus token as your mod, instead of taking the evade action and juking.
 

Juke is really only good in situations where you can get the evade and offensive mods at the same time, or you have about 3 ships with juke with just an evade.

 

Interesting to note, it takes 3 torrents with juke and only an evade on each for juke to cause more damage then the equivalent number of focused torrents

 

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1 hour ago, ClassicalMoser said:

I just want to see other talents like Daredevil and Saturation Salvo that never see the light of day go down. Daredevil would be great at 1. Crack shot and Predator could maybe gain a point.

I'd be happy with 1 point Daredevil, mostly because it'd be fun rather than strong. It can't really be combined with double-action effects, and it gives a stress.  It's a lot of bend, to be sure, and has the potential to be really cool with pre-maneuver boosts into blues to clear the stress, but it's not like cheap to build a ship like that.

Saturation Salvo, however, I don't really see in the same way.  It isn't just a fun little silly thing that's cool and does something interesting.  It's a talent which doesn't do anything except add damage (more damage than Predator against 3 greens, a bit less against 2 greens), and doesn't require anything in terms of range or position, once you're able to make an ordnance attack.  It'd be auto-include if it were cheap enough, and not in the Jamming Beam sense--folks would use it.  It doesn't make anything more interesting, it just takes evades away from folks who defend against Missile or Torpedo attacks. 

There's plenty of neat things---usually they'll do movement tricks rather than provide action efficiency or make attacks hit harder---that would probably be better candidates for being a bit cheaper.  Daredevil is one of those, but Saturation Salvo just doesn't offer enough to the game in terms of actual fun to buff it just to get it onto tables.

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56 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

As to Baby-Anakin having a talent: I think a regular talent makes less sense than a force talent, and a force talent makes less sense than just not having a talent of any kind at all.

It's thematic though. His raw talent with the Force makes him a better pilot than most, but he's unskilled in controlling the Force, so he doesn't get any cool Force powers.

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58 minutes ago, SavouryRain said:

Juke is really only good in situations where you can get the evade and offensive mods at the same time, or you have about 3 ships with juke with just an evade.

This is true of most cards; that doesn't mean it's not very, very strong. Lone Wolf turns off almost all Rebel synergies. Outmaneuver requires good positioning. Advanced Sensors destroys your action economy. Still, they're priced for good use, not poor use. Torrents and most Attack Shuttles will never want Juke and that's okay. Not all upgrades are good on all ships (I'm not taking Daredevil on my Moldy Crow Jan).

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19 minutes ago, SavouryRain said:

It's thematic though. His raw talent with the Force makes him a better pilot than most, but he's unskilled in controlling the Force, so he doesn't get any cool Force powers.

Maybe it's thematic of him not getting a *force* talent, but it's certainly not thematic of him actively getting a *regular* talent.

Rookie Pilot and Grey Squadron Bomber don't get talents.  You've got to be a Red or Gold Squadron Veteran to get a Talent slot.  Anakin ain't that.

And it isn't like Luke Skywalker had vastly more combat piloting experience than Anakin at this point in the films, either, and he's got a Force Talent.

Anakin should have a Force Talent or nothing.

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@theBitterFig the force talent slot is indicative of characters using the force to accomplish things. Baby Ani wasn’t capable of that yet.

Regular pilot talent slots are indicative of a better-than-average pilot. Baby Ani was that, if only because of the force.

Other Force-users might be better Pilots than Baby Ani, but giving someone a force talent and a regular talent would simply make it more difficult than necessary to balance.

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3 hours ago, ficklegreendice said:

Juke is huge, effectively an extra damage per shot if your opponent can't stop it...provided you get that evade for "free" from somewhere (otherwise you lose mods by taking an evade action)

The effect is pretty top dollar on the ships that get free evades ala Stygium and Full Throttle

Now the n1 IS at least balanced out by only having two dice, but those are some **** nice pilot abilities (****, Ole! can basically be better than a phantom!)

 

I've been really struggling with this one though!  It sounds good on Ric, but his time on target will be MUCH less than a defender because he has to disengage and come back around.

However, maybe Lone Wolf is better?  What do you think?

 

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Anni really should not have a Force OR Talent slot. He's talked about as a gifted pilot sure, but he's really only had some experience in Podracers on the ground. It's the first time he gets in a space ship, partly piloted by R2-D2 and going straight into battle. 

It's his latent strength in the force that allows him to keep up and survive in the N1. The fact that he's not I1 and has a force point should be all he gets (thematically anyway). 

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