Jump to content
Force Majeure

Most Hated Pilots

Recommended Posts

Side note. Magva crew and AP5 Sheathe are good friends for the VCX.

Its kind of at a level where point drops elsewhere will help it more than a drop on its own cost. Well, Hera anyway, the rest do not compare very favourably to her.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, ClassicalMoser said:

I mean sometimes? But when do you have the action free for a lock anyway? If you're Dash you only ever get one, and if you're Han, you usually want to boost and/or evade.

Agreed, and that's why I rather just take the bid than a missile.

41 minutes ago, ClassicalMoser said:

I'm definitely in the camp of make non-procket/barrage missiles crazy cheap (2 point ions, 3 point cluster, homing, 4 point concussion)

3 points Ion, 3-4 points Cluster, 3-4 Homing, and 4-5 Concussion would be my suggestion as I try to err on cautions side so we don't make a monster that we just aren't seeing yet. However, the lock requirement really reigns these missiles in, so perhaps you are right.

42 minutes ago, millertime059 said:

however ion missiles are bantha poodoo and no price point for them will make them good.

At 2 of 3 points, I'd take them on select ships. Really, I've found that Ion missiles and Ion Cannons should be considered for damage not ion, oddly enough. Your two die primary was likely only going to do 1 or less damage, whereas the Ion secondary will often do that 1 damage more reliably.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, 5050Saint said:

Your two die primary was likely only going to do 1 or less damage, whereas the Ion secondary will often do that 1 damage more reliably.

^^Yes.

It can also put the pressure on the defender to spend their calculate/focus and take that possible ionization in addition to the hit.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, 5050Saint said:

At 2 of 3 points, I'd take them on select ships. Really, I've found that Ion missiles and Ion Cannons should be considered for damage not ion, oddly enough. Your two die primary was likely only going to do 1 or less damage, whereas the Ion secondary will often do that 1 damage more reliably.

I've really enjoyed Ion Cannon Scyks.  However, I'd never fly them without a normal damage hitter or two.

*e*

One limitation of ion-based strategies is that they often feel like they can't close things out, particularly against high-health ships.  In the right balance, I think it's a great tool.  But I really want a Fenn Rau or Ketsu or something to provide raw damage.

Edited by theBitterFig

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
48 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

I've really enjoyed Ion Cannon Scyks.  However, I'd never fly them without a normal damage hitter or two.

*e*

One limitation of ion-based strategies is that they often feel like they can't close things out, particularly against high-health ships.  In the right balance, I think it's a great tool.  But I really want a Fenn Rau or Ketsu or something to provide raw damage.

^^^

When something gets Ioned, you want to kill it in the next 2 turns minimum. Otherwise it's just stalling.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, Cuz05 said:

^^^

When something gets Ioned, you want to kill it in the next 2 turns minimum. Otherwise it's just stalling.

I don't think of it so much in terms of stalling vs progress, but just that it's not realistic to kill some ships with Ion weapons only.

Like, there's probably no way 6 Ion Scyks could hope to win against 4 ARCs, or Rebel Beef.  Or TIE Swarm, probably.  The amount of time it takes to do enough damage to win the game is simply going to be too long.  It'll take 12 attacks to kill an Upsilon Shuttle with only Ion weapons, so that just won't work in any realistic game.  Sometimes, you'll be able to accomplish things by switching strategy, using primary rather than Ion against high-health stuff, particularly at Range 1.

But it'll go a long way if you have something else which can throw in hits.

The list I've played most to this end is 4x Ion M3-A Scyks and Fenn Rau.  Fenn does Fenn things, even if he doesn't have a talent or bid.  But even with a combined arms approach, it's probably still a tricky meta call to go so heavy into Ion weapons.  Against something like 3x T-70--which used to be fairly popular when Resistance first dropped, the RZ-2 hadn't yet caught on, and before Republic just did the whole ace thing far better--a heavily Ion-weapon based list is going to be BRUTAL.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
32 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

I don't think of it so much in terms of stalling vs progress, but just that it's not realistic to kill some ships with Ion weapons only.

Stalling is perhaps not the right word. Or at the very least, an exaggeration.

Either way, I agree :)

Apart from, as you say, very specific match ups.

Unless your name is Kavil. Then it's a whole other ball game. They'll reach a board edge eventually :D

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Iden.  It's one ship that never should have existed.  I hates it.  That stupid ability doesn't keep Howl alive for an extra round, in practice it's more like 2-3 more since you never get the dream shot you want the next couple attacks or the stupid Tie nattie evades every attack and simply refuses to die.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, gadwag said:

I'd like to thank OP and all thread participants for informing me what ships I will enjoy flying the most

It's disappointing that so many people can't enjoy games unless their opponents aren't.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 6/21/2019 at 7:55 AM, Da_Brown_Bomber said:

Wedge costs 52 pts. Vader/afterburners is 71pts. Scum Fenn Rau 68pts. vader is well costed but wedge?

 

Agreed. High threat, but alot of work for 52p.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, theBitterFig said:

I don't think of it so much in terms of stalling vs progress, but just that it's not realistic to kill some ships with Ion weapons only.

Like, there's probably no way 6 Ion Scyks could hope to win against 4 ARCs, or Rebel Beef.  Or TIE Swarm, probably.  The amount of time it takes to do enough damage to win the game is simply going to be too long.  It'll take 12 attacks to kill an Upsilon Shuttle with only Ion weapons, so that just won't work in any realistic game.  Sometimes, you'll be able to accomplish things by switching strategy, using primary rather than Ion against high-health stuff, particularly at Range 1.

But it'll go a long way if you have something else which can throw in hits.

The list I've played most to this end is 4x Ion M3-A Scyks and Fenn Rau.  Fenn does Fenn things, even if he doesn't have a talent or bid.  But even with a combined arms approach, it's probably still a tricky meta call to go so heavy into Ion weapons.  Against something like 3x T-70--which used to be fairly popular when Resistance first dropped, the RZ-2 hadn't yet caught on, and before Republic just did the whole ace thing far better--a heavily Ion-weapon based list is going to be BRUTAL.

I always wonder about combining Ion Cannons with Heavy Laser Cannon on Scyks or Gunboats - 3-4 Ion Cannons and 2-3 Heavy Laser Cannons (not sure on the right mix). A Heavy Laser Cannon is good for its cost on a relatively cheap, undergunned chassis, but actually getting a shot with it isn't that easy.

Ionized targets are extremely predictable because it's basically 1-forward with no repositioning.

That sounds like a deeply unpleasant situation when high-power boresight weapons are looking for a shot.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Magnus Grendel said:

I always wonder about combining Ion Cannons with Heavy Laser Cannon on Scyks or Gunboats - 3-4 Ion Cannons and 2-3 Heavy Laser Cannons (not sure on the right mix). A Heavy Laser Cannon is good for its cost on a relatively cheap, undergunned chassis, but actually getting a shot with it isn't that easy.

Ionized targets are extremely predictable because it's basically 1-forward with no repositioning.

That sounds like a deeply unpleasant situation when high-power boresight weapons are looking for a shot.

 

And weaving in Sunny Bounder, to be sure.  I don't know that she's worth it with an Ion Cannon (the rare chance of a 4th result on an Ion seems mostly unneeded... but maybe that could be a big highroll against an ace...), but she really seems perfect with HLC.  Since Sunny has potential for more than 2-dice worth of damage from her normal primary, the downside of HLC being hard to line up is significantly mitigated.

Depending on how points work out, Autoblaster might not be terrible.  I'm not excited for it in general on M3-A (HLC is two bonus dice in bullseye, instead of one extra die), the fact of Range 1-2 instead of 2-3 might be better when controlling folks with ion moves.  The biggest issue with Autoblaster, I figure, is there isn't a points-related reason *not* to take HLC in 6 Scyks.  Can't upgrade the whole squad to Tansarii Vets at anything close to current points, and mixed Init on generics doesn't feel good to me.

 

 

Say... Autoblaster Sunny with 3x Ion Spacers and Fenn Rau might fit (and might even get Fenn a bit or a talent).  Probably enough control, and a bit more punch.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
20 hours ago, JJ48 said:

It's disappointing that so many people can't enjoy games unless their opponents aren't.

Real talk: I want my opponent to be having fun. The best games are the ones where you can both have a laugh and enjoy it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, gadwag said:

Real talk: I want my opponent to be having fun. The best games are the ones where you can both have a laugh and enjoy it.

Also real talk, though: Scum ostensibly has debuffs as part of its schtick. And it’s not like Scum in general is tearing up the scene, despite their tricksy hobbitses.

How does this preclude fun?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
33 minutes ago, CoffeeMinion said:

Also real talk, though: Scum ostensibly has debuffs as part of its schtick. And it’s not like Scum in general is tearing up the scene, despite their tricksy hobbitses.

How does this preclude fun?

JJ48 doesn't like Scum's tricks nor non-Lambda large bases. Okay, the term "doesn't like" is a bit of an understatement. They despise them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
21 hours ago, JJ48 said:

It's disappointing that so many people can't enjoy games unless their opponents aren't.

And wishing an entire faction others like would cease to exist to further your own enjoyment is different how?

Edited by SabineKey

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, SabineKey said:

And wishing an entire faction others like would cease to exist to further your own enjoyment is different how?

It is precisely because I despise the trolling mindset that I feel Scum should be abolished.  It is not simply to further my own enjoyment, but to vastly improve the game as a whole.

In fact, I'd say they're literally opposite situations.  In the one case, you have someone specifically wanting to spoil things for other players.  The misery of others is their goal.  In the other case, you have someone looking to fix a problem, with any negative effect to other players being merely an unfortunate side-effect.

Edited by JJ48

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
46 minutes ago, JJ48 said:

It is precisely because I despise the trolling mindset that I feel Scum should be abolished.  It is not simply to further my own enjoyment, but to vastly improve the game as a whole.

In fact, I'd say they're literally opposite situations.  In the one case, you have someone specifically wanting to spoil things for other players.  The misery of others is their goal.  In the other case, you have someone looking to fix a problem, with any negative effect to other players being merely an unfortunate side-effect.

I don't know if I'd go that far, but there's some fun-killing stuff out there which just shouldn't exist.

Juke remains my favorite example.  Dice ****ing pretty much always sucks the fun out of things.  Evades are so hard to roll in this game in the first place, and now they're going away?  Always BS.  Meanwhile, Juke is almost always bad.  It's a trash upgrade on anything which has to actually use an action for it's Evade token.  Maybe there's some use on 2-red ships with high initiative, since they might be able to get double duty with passive offensive and active defensive use out of a single action, but not really.

Juke being mostly bad and something no one cares about in a thematic sense makes it really tempting to just delete.

But the people want to fly Boba Fett, @JJ48.

Dude's a lovable ****-up, like Junkrat and Roadhog, or Star Lord.  Now, Boba Fett has an ability which isn't troll-ery.  I wonder if it ought to have been only a single roll if there were any ships at 0-1, but whatever.  There's enough Scum out there which is... kinda fair and not troll.  There is potential for an existing Scum faction which isn't quite as Scum-y in game effects. 

That'd probably be quite nice.

Edited by theBitterFig

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, JJ48 said:

It is precisely because I despise the trolling mindset that I feel Scum should be abolished.  It is not simply to further my own enjoyment, but to vastly improve the game as a whole.

In fact, I'd say they're literally opposite situations.  In the one case, you have someone specifically wanting to spoil things for other players.  The misery of others is their goal.  In the other case, you have someone looking to fix a problem, with any negative effect to other players being merely an unfortunate side-effect.

But your opinion on what “vastly improves the game as a whole” isn’t based on some universal public will, but on your own biases. Despite your claims to the contrary, I can’t help but see your dislike for Scum as a whole as applying double standards. You want something gone because you don’t like it, and don’t care if other people hold another opinion or actually liking the faction, even despite the “trollish” nature. Sorry, dude, but from where I’m standing, your position isn’t the opposite to someone trying for misery in game. The timing is just different.

You also seem to be laboring under the assumption that by removing scum, you remove all the abilities that you think break the game, when it is far more likely that those abilities you despise would simply end up in another faction. I know you hate Palob’s ability. When you get right down to it, the idea behind it (steal a token) is very basic. Do you honestly believe that if Scum never existed, that ability wouldn’t have made it into the game? Remember, the status quo for Star Wars games is to shoehorn people like bounty hunters and smugglers into one side or another. Maybe it wouldn’t have the name “Palob”, but I find it highly unlikely that some smuggler or pirate wouldn’t have popped up with that ability.

So, your argument against an entire faction both doesn’t actually address what is problematic and, as you said yourself, doesn’t actually have a chance to bring about change. So, effectively, you are just taking your frustration out on others, aiming at the wrong things. I can understand your dislike of certain Pilot abilities. Believe me, there are plenty of cards I think the game is better off with out. But they aren’t all in Scum and I recognize it is the individual card at fault, not the overarching faction. 

In the end, you can think and say what you want, but like you said, such behavior elicits a reaction. Disappointment.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


×
×
  • Create New...