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Church14

List Breakdown - What hero for Uthuk blitz list.

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Here’s the core of a dumb fun list I’ve run with middling success. 

141/200
Flesh Rippers [38] 2x2
Moment of Inspiration [5]
Dead Sprint [4]
Total Unit Cost: 47

Flesh Rippers [38] 2x2
Moment of Inspiration [5]
Dead Sprint [4]
Total Unit Cost: 47

Flesh Rippers [38] 2x2
Moment of Inspiration [5]
Dead Sprint [4]
Total Unit Cost: 47

http://tabletopadmiral.com/runewars/uthuk/p132u24u68p132u24u68p132u24u68

 

So so what would players add for the last 59 points? I normally do a maxed out Gorgemaw just so I can cross the map turn one. What would other players use?

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I actually like Viper’s because of their flexible build options, but I think this force is lacking that “Wow” factor...  ...that one unit that is a credible threat for the point of decision in the game.  My feeling is Ravos, but with upgrades it seems to leave you with some dead points as he comes in less than 59.  Maybe you could upgrade one of the 2x2 Ripper units?

 

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3 hours ago, sarumanthewhite said:

I actually like Viper’s because of their flexible build options, but I think this force is lacking that “Wow” factor...  ...that one unit that is a credible threat for the point of decision in the game.  My feeling is Ravos, but with upgrades it seems to leave you with some dead points as he comes in less than 59.  Maybe you could upgrade one of the 2x2 Ripper units?

 

Hm. 25 to upgrade to a 6 tray and then you’re left with 34 to go. Add Beastmaster Embedded and A 2 tray vipers for:

200/200
Flesh Rippers [38] 2x2
Moment of Inspiration [5]
Dead Sprint [4]
Total Unit Cost: 47

Flesh Rippers [38] 2x2
Moment of Inspiration [5]
Dead Sprint [4]
Total Unit Cost: 47

Flesh Rippers [63] 3x2
Beastmaster ThuUk Tar (C) [14]
Moment of Inspiration [5]
Dead Sprint [4]
Total Unit Cost: 86

Viper Legion Archers [18] 2x1
Aim of the Serpent [2]
Total Unit Cost: 20

Ignoring that I don’t have 14 trays of rippers (just 12), the list kind of ends up like this. Though you could pull dead sprint off the big formation. Beastmaster kind of covers that.

 

Though I would challenge that a list has to have a wow-factor unit. The big scary units are prime targets for massed fire or bane slinging. This list just kinda goes and nothing really needs support. 

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What’s been your experience with Feeding Frenzy?  I haven’t played it, but it seems like with the 3x2 build, you might be able to get more use out of it.  

By “Wow” factor, I guess I meant that I like to have a unit that I makes my opponent take notice and play a bit defensively so that I can control the point of decision in the game.  Your 2x3 Death Knights is a good example of this.  At the same time, the tactical situation on the board may dictate something else.  My 2x2 Oathsworn was my best performing unit primarily because it was able to get flank shots and reload with Rallying Cornicen.  That happened because people went after my 3x2 Scouts which had a propensity to Flee in Terror all day... ☹️

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I have tried Feeding Frenzy; I wasn't particularly impressed.  Being able to engage correctly makes Dead Sprint so much better.

I think the bigger problem is not the absence of a "wow" unit.  I've got lists that have solid units, but not a "wow" unit, and 2x2 Rippers are generally going to be reliable damage-dealers.  To me, the bigger problem is someone being able to circle up and do more efficient damage back at you than you can bring to bear upon them.

I think I still like Gorgemaw with rippers, and the 2x2 MOI taking a wound to pick up its inspiration seems reasonable.  I could see Gorgemaw, two 2x2 Rippers, and then another unit, probably Vipers.  Maybe two if those unit types are small enough, e.g. 2x1 Vipers and 2x1 Threshers.

 

Kethra can also be really good with Rippers, since her skill ability allows them to take wounds.  So she helps Rippers with their problems of having no other bonuses against armor.

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On 6/13/2019 at 6:22 PM, sarumanthewhite said:

What’s been your experience with Feeding Frenzy?  I haven’t played it, but it seems like with the 3x2 build, you might be able to get more use out of it.  

By “Wow” factor, I guess I meant that I like to have a unit that I makes my opponent take notice and play a bit defensively so that I can control the point of decision in the game.  Your 2x3 Death Knights is a good example of this.  At the same time, the tactical situation on the board may dictate something else.  My 2x2 Oathsworn was my best performing unit primarily because it was able to get flank shots and reload with Rallying Cornicen.  That happened because people went after my 3x2 Scouts which had a propensity to Flee in Terror all day... ☹️

Soapbox on! 

 

Feeding Frenzy is one of those cards where I think they underpowered it to prevent something from getting broken. Either that broken combo didn’t get released or they goofed up. The tourney we just had had lists with 11-18 trays. So if a Ripper unit was engaged with every single lost tray that’s a peak of lethal 3-5. Being engaged with every lost tray is never gonna happen. Being engaged with half of the opposing trays that died is still optimistic and that drops the card to provide lethal 1-3 at the end of the game. It does nothing during the first 3rd of the game or so. 

 

Look at Forged in Battle, which gives you precise and brutal for the simple task of not dying and is cheaper. 

 

Feeding Frenzy would be hard to choose if it was free because of the opportunity cost of not having Dead Sprint. So making it cheap isn’t enough. It would need to be changed to something good. I’d try lethal 1 per 2 trays of dead engaged enemies. If that seems weak then maybe lethal per tray. Alternatively, Lethal per every 3rd enemy tray on the battlefield dead might have worked. Then 3 Rippers with Feeding Frenzy could make each other stronger.  

 

The card as it exists is trash competitively and should only be brought out for casual games where both sides bring their B-teams. 

Edited by Church14

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Church, I love your point about “opportunity cost”.  That is spot on and highlights that points alone can’t just fix something.  The card has to be relevant and compelling before you price it.  That’s why it’s so difficult to come up with an option for Tempered Steel...

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