Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
BlastyMcBlasterFace

Are 4 T-70s Good?

Recommended Posts

I am responsible for making three lists to go to the CAC tournament.  One already is Rebel, mine is Separatists, and the last one is for the least experienced player and I thought 4 T-70s would be good for him.  Jess, Bastian, Heroic i3 and Heroic i4.  

I want something that is simple to maneuver but still solid.  Can't do Rebel, because someone already is doing that one.  I thought maybe Republic, but I would have to mix in a couple formation flying medium base ships (Sinker, ARC, Mace, Tucker) and that could get real tough and result in a lot of bumps.

Any help would be appreciated.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

The T-70 chassis is solid. Your choices are about as basic as you can get flying T-70s without going with only 4 generics. How inexperienced is the player? Will they be able to remember to the flip the S-Foils? Are they expecting to win every game or are they just wanting to have fun and shoot at stuff? The lower Initiative of the pilots should allow the player to make full moves and take actions. I always worry about my son, who is inexperienced, not having fun because he doesn't get to take his actions that help his ships.

This feels like a good, solid, forgiving list for somebody to get a good feel for the game without being overburdened with triggers and interactions but still having some beef to last several rounds of dog-fighting.

Maybe throw Jamming Beam on each one so the player feels like they can have some counter-play if they want it.

Edited by Skitch_

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I have had pretty good success with 3 t70 + Lulo.  Specially Nien, 2 x Black squad and Lulo.  Crack on the T70's and heroic and crack on Lulo.  It's a good mix of health, init, and punch.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, viedit said:

I have had pretty good success with 3 t70 + Lulo.  Specially Nien, 2 x Black squad and Lulo.  Crack on the T70's and heroic and crack on Lulo.  It's a good mix of health, init, and punch.  

I flew Nien, Bastian, Bastian, and Lulo and made top 16 at our local regional.  Muh dice!  But I don't want to give the new guy all the complicated things that are on Nien, and Lulo pops if put in the wrong place.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, BlastyMcBlasterFace said:

I flew Nien, Bastian, Bastian, and Lulo and made top 16 at our local regional.  Muh dice!  But I don't want to give the new guy all the complicated things that are on Nien, and Lulo pops if put in the wrong place.

If you want easy just give him gas clouds and set him up with this:

Red Squadron Expert (48)    
    Trick Shot (2)    
    Integrated S-Foils (0)    
    
Ship total: 50  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 4    
    
Red Squadron Expert (48)    
    Trick Shot (2)    
    Integrated S-Foils (0)    
    
Ship total: 50  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 4    
    
Red Squadron Expert (48)    
    Trick Shot (2)    
    Integrated S-Foils (0)    
    
Ship total: 50  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 4    
    
Red Squadron Expert (48)    
    Trick Shot (2)    
    Integrated S-Foils (0)    
    
Ship total: 50  Half Points: 25  Threshold: 4    
    
    
Total: 200    
    
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0: https://raithos.github.io/?f=Resistance&d=v6!s=200!257:133,,,175,,,:;257:133,,,175,,,:;257:133,,,175,,,:;257:133,,,175,,,:&sn=Unnamed Squadron&obs=

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

If you are concerned about easy and triggers, Bastian is not a great choice.  He is easy to miss and has to be R2.  I'm not convinced on Jess.  With these guys you just focus and embrace 4 red dice and a buttload of health.  You also have same init across the board so can resolve activation as needed.

Edited by viedit

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, BlastyMcBlasterFace said:

@viedit, I know those would be easy to play, but I'm concerned about the lack of mods.  That's why I though maybe mixing in Jess and Bastian might be a good idea.  

I just don't see 4 T-70 lists that are getting that good of finishes so I'm worried that I'm missing something and they aren't good.

My buddy got 1st Swiss in the Austin regional (mages santum) with 3 heroic reds and Jess, unfortunately got sick the day of the cut

Its a solid list

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
42 minutes ago, BlastyMcBlasterFace said:

I'm concerned about the lack of mods

I've been finding that the best source of mods is not missing your action and if the only thing you need to worry about is picking maneuvers where you don't bump or land on an obstacle it is easier to pick the right maneuvers. If you don't have interactions to maintain and various ranges and such it is a lot easier to pick the right move for each ship especially if they are all at the same initiative since they activate in your most convenient order. A lot easier to pick the right moves if you're not trying to setup some combo and just trying to get a shot with a mod. Just fly, action, roll dice. 

Ahosoka for example is stellar but she has to do complete maneuvers. You have to be able to fly or you won't get much out of her. 

If you've got to provide a list for this guy is he really going to get the most out of some tricksy hobbits? A newer player is going to have a lot of trouble with ships at three different initiatives. It isn't going to give him room to deviate if the plan goes wrong. 

All that said. Jess and 3x Red Squadron Expert comes in at 196. Four ships at I3 with just one ability to remember and a bid. I like Viedit's list with four Trick Shot Red Sqd. Experts. I'm leaning to lists like that a lot myself lately. Firing arcs on targets. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd recommend Jess Pava, Joph Seastriker, and 2x Red Squadron Experts. That way the whole squad is Initiative 3, giving the player agency and flexibility in maneuvering and avoiding bumps. Also, it's a very, very simple squad with good health, offense, mods, and re-positioning

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
14 hours ago, NervousSam said:

lol no to the jamming beam, its nearly always better to just shoot for damage. 

It has one noticable point that's worth it - removing reinforce tokens. If you can peel off a reinforce token then hammer the attacker with 3 primary shots, you have in theory scored 3 extra damage the reinforce would have prevented - the same as a 'perfect' primary attack which is very unlikely for a generic T-70 without multiple ways to modify attack dice.

14 hours ago, BlastyMcBlasterFace said:

I'm concerned about the lack of mods

12 hours ago, Frimmel said:

I've been finding that the best source of mods is not missing your action and if the only thing you need to worry about is picking maneuvers where you don't bump or land on an obstacle it is easier to pick the right maneuvers. If you don't have interactions to maintain and various ranges and such it is a lot easier to pick the right move for each ship especially if they are all at the same initiative since they activate in your most convenient order. A lot easier to pick the right moves if you're not trying to setup some combo and just trying to get a shot with a mod. Just fly, action, roll dice. 

This, and concentrating arcs of fire. Heavy Swarms like strikers work fine on just focus tokens because the best special rule going is "you've now used all your once-per-turn tricks and I still have another primary-3 ship left to attack with".

It's harder with T-70s since you 'only' get a 1-ship advantage over 3-ship ace lists but T-70s do take a lot of killing so hopefully your numerical advantage will last longer because you shouldn't be too worried about losing a ship in the first engagement. 

Edited by Magnus Grendel

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 5/1/2019 at 6:59 AM, NukeWash said:

I'd recommend Jess Pava, Joph Seastriker, and 2x Red Squadron Experts. That way the whole squad is Initiative 3, giving the player agency and flexibility in maneuvering and avoiding bumps. Also, it's a very, very simple squad with good health, offense, mods, and re-positioning

Hmmm Joph vs 3x Heroic... With my dice, I'm gonna have to stick with Heroic 🤣🤣

The flexibility of choosing any activation/attack order is great and underrated, and middling Ini isn't near as bad as people make it out to be. The performance ceiling of this list might be a tad lower than a comparable higher-PS/less-meat list but floor is much higher.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

I definitely wouldn't think t70s are necessarily new player friendly

They're kind of wildly expensive for their statline, which is something that they seem to compensate for with situational but powerful dice modding or positioning abilities. Plus theres integrated sfoils and the mess of rules therein.

For pilots, Pava is the definite all-star with an impressive reroll ability, and I think Bastian is quite alright if a little situational and easy to forget if you're new. I'd also heartily recommend m9-g8, just slap a lock on a friendly and have them enjoy action independent rerolls!

But after those, you're kinda stuck with very inefficient generics or more complicated positioning-orientated pilots. There's also the issue of Black 1, which is clutch as **** but also difficult for newer players to process/plan ahead for

Way I see it, we got two options: the mob blob or just embrace the ace

4 T-70s mod blob

(52) Jessika Pava [T-70 X-wing]
(0) Integrated S-foils
Points: 52

(48) Lieutenant Bastian [T-70 X-wing]
(0) Integrated S-foils
Points: 48

(46) Blue Squadron Rookie [T-70 X-wing]
(7) M9-G8
(0) Integrated S-foils
Points: 53

(46) Blue Squadron Rookie [T-70 X-wing]
(0) Integrated S-foils
Points: 46

Total points: 199

Not as much initiative symmetry as I would like, but plenty of action independent rerolls and few upgrades!

3 T-70s embrace the ace

(68) Poe Dameron [T-70 X-wing]
(2) R4 Astromech
(0) Integrated S-foils
(1) Heroic
Points: 71

(56) Ello Asty [T-70 X-wing]
(5) R5-X3
(1) Heroic
(0) Integrated S-foils
Points: 62

(55) Nien Nunb [T-70 X-wing]
(0) Integrated S-foils
(1) Heroic
(7) M9-G8
Points: 63

Total points: 196

Honestly, given the ridiculous advantage of high I, it's probably a LOT easier to fly aces than lower initiative

The squad is a little complicated because Ello and Nien have very situational abilities that may take time to get used to, but high initiative should generally always give you opportunities to come back

Edited by ficklegreendice

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As a relatively inexperienced player myself, I think the single biggest issue is dial selection among multiple different initiatives. I echo the advice of @NukeWash above. Alternatively (if you have the stuff) you could give him 5 Resistance A-Wings. Something like this:

Green Squadron Expert (34)    
    Heroic (1)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
    Advanced Optics (4)    
    
Ship total: 40  Half Points: 20  Threshold: 2    
    
Green Squadron Expert (34)    
    Heroic (1)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
    Advanced Optics (4)    
    
Ship total: 40  Half Points: 20  Threshold: 2    
    
Green Squadron Expert (34)    
    Heroic (1)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
    Advanced Optics (4)    
    
Ship total: 40  Half Points: 20  Threshold: 2    
    
Green Squadron Expert (34)    
    Heroic (1)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
    Advanced Optics (4)    
    
Ship total: 40  Half Points: 20  Threshold: 2    
    
Green Squadron Expert (34)    
    Heroic (1)    
    Crack Shot (1)    
    Advanced Optics (4)    
    
Ship total: 40  Half Points: 20  Threshold: 2    
    
    
Total: 200    
    
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0: https://raithos.github.io/?f=Resistance&d=v6!h=200!300:172,116,,186:;300:172,116,,186:;300:172,116,,186:;300:172,116,,186:;300:172,116,,186:&sn=5 A's (Generic)&obs=

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
40 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

I definitely wouldn't think t70s are necessarily new player friendly

They're kind of wildly expensive for their statline, which is something that they seem to compensate for with situational but powerful dice modding or positioning abilities. Plus theres integrated sfoils and the mess of rules therein.

For pilots, Pava is the definite all-star with an impressive reroll ability, and I think Bastian is quite alright if a little situational and easy to forget if you're new. I'd also heartily recommend m9-g8, just slap a lock on a friendly and have them enjoy action independent rerolls!

But after those, you're kinda stuck with very inefficient generics or more complicated positioning-orientated pilots. There's also the issue of Black 1, which is clutch as **** but also difficult for newer players to process/plan ahead for

 

Honestly, given the ridiculous advantage of high I, it's probably a LOT easier to fly aces than lower initiative

The squad is a little complicated because Ello and Nien have very situational abilities that may take time to get used to, but high initiative should generally always give you opportunities to come back

T-70s also have a Blue 1 straight which is the new-player friendliest move in the game. T-70s have all the basic moves at speed 2 and 3 at white or blue which is very versatile.

I'm leaning more to its not new player friendly to throw a lot of abilities and interactions at them. You want to reduce the decisions they have to make and the things they have to worry about. If you drop a ship to give the other ships lots of things the newb doesn't know how to manage or leverage properly or that complicate choosing the correct maneuver you're hurting them more than giving them more efficient ships. Even you admit the squad is complicated. 

And higher I isn't necessarily better for the inexperienced player. Moving first with the mindset of "don't bump" is going to make things easier for them. As a new player I had lots of trouble picturing what the board was going to look like after maneuvers. Moving last benefits from a better understanding of where your opponent is going to end up. 

It depends on the newb I guess. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Outside the context of the OP (a team-tournament where Rebels aren't a valid choice):

I feel like there are probably some fun 4x T-70 lists.  Blues with BB-Astromechs and Tractor Beams.  Blues with R2 for regen (potentially 36 HP across the entire list, if you're able to use all the regen).  Reds can have some OK talents.

But.

Any 4 T-70 list seems just kinda worse than a 4x T-65 + Leia list from Rebels.  I think T-70 spam and Rebel Beef essentially work out to be roughly the same lists, but Rebel Beef is just going to do it better.

//

In context? I might fly ARCs or TIE/sfs.  Rear arcs are good.

For ARCs, Jag, Sinker, 2x Squad Seven Veteran (one with Clone Commander Cody) is an all Init 3 list for easy maneuvering (ARCs can take up a lot of space, so being able to activate in any order helps prevent one from sitting somewhere awkward), as well as a lot of small synergies for rerolls and CCCody potentially softening up a target.  Just a massive amount of HP, too.

4 Gunner TIE/sfs will probably do about as good at maneuvering as T-70s, but will provide a very handy rear-firing turret.  It'll require a bit more thinking than a T-70 or ARC, a bit more guessing about when a good time to rotate is, but it's a pretty similar concept.  5x non-Gunner SFs is a pretty straightforward list to fly (point the turret arc rear and never move it!), with simple upgrades like Advanced Optics, or Fanatical (maybe also with FCS, or upgrading one pilot to Blackout).  Consistent spam 2-dice attacks kind of matter in 2e, TIE/sfs are pretty durable, and they've got the amazing 5-straight, so they can fly over engagements and keep guns on the target, and can slowroll with 1 straight and 1-bank afterwards.

RZ-2 A-Wings are probably technically better than sfs, due to the access to the Boost action, but SFs are simpler, and they have much less to worry about with stress.

Edited by theBitterFig

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Jess/Bastian are fantastic.  For a little I was flying Them with M9g8 on jess and Lulo/Tallie.  Did some wonders.
For ease of use you could also do 4 naked with HLC, its pretty easy to line up that bullseye with em.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Sign in to follow this  

×
×
  • Create New...