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lologrelol

Cover Rules Contradict Themselves

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Rules Ref. 1.3.0

Pg. 25

1. Determine number of obscured minis.

'If any part of a defending mini, including its base, is blocked by a piece of terrain, the player then traces an imaginary line from the center of the base of the defending mini. If the imaginary line crosses the piece of terrain that blocked line of sight, the defending mini is obscured.'

Pg. 27 Declaring Terrain

'Once the level of cover that a piece of terrain will provide has been determined during setup, that piece of terrain provides that cover to the relevant units regardless of the degree to which minis in those units are blocked by that terrain.'

'Checking whether a piece of terrain is blocking half or more, or less than half, of a mini is only used during setup to determine whether or not that piece of terrain will provide cover during the game.'

...

What am I missing?

...

Also... Can we please get a definition of 'Obscured'. I can't find a reference to what obscured actually does, and what it means. We just have the rules saying things are or are not obscured. Yet we also have rules say units get cover, but it says nothing about obscured. In the rules ref we have Obscured as its own special entry, but no definition.

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Posted (edited)

This took me ages to get. I think it goes like this. 

1) before setup determine which terrain has the capability of covering 50% of the unit. Ie a barricade is capable of heavy cover for troopers, but its not automatic in all cases.

2) in game, to see if the cover applies trace a line base to base. If it crosses designated terrain it is obscured. Obscured means it could potentially provide cover.

3) to see if cover actually applies then check line of sight from attacking units eye view to the centre of the defender's base.

Obscured doesnt automatically grant cover, but it signifies that predesignated terrain could provide cover. So a line of sight check is invoked.

 

I think. 

Edited by Alan Noir

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During an attack, terrain that lies between two units can grant protection to the defender in the form of cover.
To determine if a unit has cover, the attacker traces an imaginary line between the center of their unit leader’s base and the center of each miniature’s base in the defender. If the line crosses any terrain, the mini is obscured. If at least half the minis in the defender are obscured, the entire unit is treated as obscured and that unit gains cover from the terrain that the imaginary line was traced through.
When determining cover, if the attacker’s unit leader is in contact with a piece of terrain, that piece of terrain is ignored when determining if a minis are obscured.

L2P book p. 16

Obscured means that the line of sight is somehow (partially) blocked and it is a requirement for cover. You test this first, because no obscured minis means no cover for the defending unit.

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3 hours ago, lologrelol said:

'If any part of a defending mini, including its base, is blocked by a piece of terrain, the player then traces an imaginary line from the center of the base of the defending mini. If the imaginary line crosses the piece of terrain that blocked line of sight, the defending mini is obscured.'

 

3 hours ago, lologrelol said:

Also... Can we please get a definition of 'Obscured'

This part that you quoted answers your question. Determining obscurity is a 2-step process:

1) Any part of the base+mini is blocked from LOS

2) The centerline between minis crosses the blocking terrain

If both of those are true, the defending mini is "obscured". If at least half of the minis in the defender are obscured, then the unit has cover (and the type of cover is determined by the terrain that the centerline crossed).

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Okay I think I get it now. In a nutshell:

1. Before the battle begins you determine what terrain can give cover, and to which unit types.

2. If a unit is shot it will gain that cover, if an imaginary line to the center of its base, crosses a terrain piece that grants its unit type (size etc) cover.

?

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8 minutes ago, lologrelol said:

Okay I think I get it now. In a nutshell:

1. Before the battle begins you determine what terrain can give cover, and to which unit types.

2. If a unit is shot it will gain that cover, if an imaginary line to the center of its base, crosses a terrain piece that grants its unit type (size etc) cover.

?

And the terrain obscurs some portion of the miniature. It is possible for the imaginary line to pass through a piece of terrain while the terrain does not obscure the miniature, such as the shooting miniature's elevation allowing it to see the entirety of the targeted unit's bases. 

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Cool, thanks.

At the last tournament I went to cover was an issue rules wise.

I'd like to see FFG make the next rules update make some of the issues stated in this thread more clear.

Cheers

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This is a confusing issue.    

So if you are in cover do the opposing player get the "cover" while you are shooting?  So if a unit is in light cover and shoots another unit in light cover will that unit get heavy cover?

 

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Posted (edited)
34 minutes ago, SSGClark said:

This is a confusing issue.    

So if you are in cover do the opposing player get the "cover" while you are shooting?  So if a unit is in light cover and shoots another unit in light cover will that unit get heavy cover?

 

Cover does not stack. Some things do increase your cover level by one (such as suppression) but two instances of cover to not add together. Also, if your unit leader is in base contact with a piece of terrrian that provides cover, the targets of that unit's attacks do not get cover from that piece of terrain.

Edited by arnoldrew

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Thank you for that.  I didn't think that it did but couldn't find it in the rules worded that way.  

I had this come up today...First game in a year.  

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Huh, I guess we’ve been playing it wrong.  We’ve just been using the imaginary line from the bases to determine things.  LoS we use to determine LoS but not cover itself.  In fact we often use 2d terrain like the cardboard ones from Runewars.  

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