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Wetaas

Playing it realistic

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Does everyone feel ok to play with units that are not realistic in a given scenario. I think then of for example using snow troopers in a jungle/desert scenario.

 I know it is totally legal and at the start when this game came out it wasn’t many units to choose between, so you needed to do this to have some units to choose from. But now as many new units are released we may soon have enough units to suit every theater.

 I personally replaced my E-web unit snowtroopers with normal stormtrooper  just to feel more comfortable when I played out of a snow scenario.

What is this community feeling about this ?

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There is no such thing as "realism" in a made up world. Call them Hostile environment Troopers instead of Snowtrooper.  Maybe there are dangerous fumes in the jungle or heavy sandstorms in the desert. Paint them green/brown and you're fine. Only thing I see a bit weird is half naked models (which don't exist yet) on Hoth. But then say they wear thermal bandages 😉

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Posted (edited)

When playing at any given event, you could be playing armies that may not have any reason to face each other in a 'realistic' setting that neither army would have set foot in. 

To take an example from another game, in Middle-Earth SBG you could take your Gondorian army to fight Hobbits at the foot of the Lonely Mountain. Crazy, right? 

But you get on with the game, you have fun and maybe share a laugh about the mismatched setting. 

Edited by FearofaBlankPlanet

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It’s just one of those things. I have one army for Hoth and one for everywhere else. But when I use my Hoth army against strangers they often have to fight on Endor against desert themed rebels. So yeah.  Store games, weird matchups are the norm. At home I try to make everything match. 

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Posted (edited)

So, there are 2 assumptions that are inherently faulty going into this question:

1)  Troops will never be deployed unless they are specifically equipped for the environment

2)  All battles consist of personnel from a single unit

 

To address 1, militaries don't let perfectly good troops sit around doing nothing, while there's a battle at hand.  If you need the troops, then you need the troops and if their equipment isn't suited to that particular battlefield, they'll just have to adapt.  For an example, in the first Gulf War, the United States only had woodland camouflage MOPP gear (for protection against nuclear/bio/chem threats).  This didn't stop the troops from being deployed with this equipment or having to use it.  In universe, if you have 3 Legions of stromtroopers in your fleet, do you really think the empire will care enough to not deploy 2 of them just because it's an ice plant and they don't have the same equipment as snowtroopers?

 

2 is also another pretty big myth.  Very few battles are fought with single units.  This is especially true when manpower is short or the unit requires inorganic assets to complete the objective (organic assets are things natively in your order of battle).  It's not uncommon in the real world for US Army and Marines to work together in operations and frequently coalition allies will also find themselves in the same battlespace, but such units almost never have the same equipment.  There's usually some similarities like ammo, possibly rifles, but it's not uncommon for one of the forces to be better suited to the environment or just have better equipment in general than the other. 

 

TL:DR in a perfect world you always have the right troops and equipment for every environment, but battles are never fought in a perfect world or they wouldn't need to be fought at all.

Edited by MasterShake2

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Ha.  Here we go again.

OT: I agree in part.  I don't really care for Snowtroopers outside of snow-specific locales.  I've replaced the snowtroopers on two of my E-Webs, and painted the third up as mudtroopers.  IF I run Snowtroopers in a non-temperature challenged themed list, I've got 3D printed Mudtroopers to take their place.  If you want to do similar, more power to you.  It would have been really cool if the E-Web came with both storm and snow troopers so we could pick which ones we wanted.

What I don't' want to see is any rule on having to match certain units with each other.  It doesn't really bug me if my opponent doesn't share my interest in theming.  Let people do what they do, and leave list building in the hands of the players.  

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, MasterShake2 said:

So, there are 2 assumptions that are inherently faulty going into this question:

1)  Troops will never be deployed unless they are specifically equipped for the environment

2)  All battles consist of personnel from a single unit

All the rationalizations don't make my games look nice if I use weird mix of stuff though.

Plus, Legion uses like 40 people per side on a battlefield the size of a Wal-Mart. When multiple troop types (in real life or fantasy) are deployed they're still usually found in numbers over that. So if 3,000 stormtroopers and 600 snowtroopers are fighting in a theater of war, you're still liable to zoom in on any given hill or field the size of a Legion table and only find one troop type.

In real life, 1700 to present, the typical smallest group of people you'll find in the same uniforms anywhere is around 100 though everyone's going to start pointing out exceptions to that.

You can buy 3+ snowtroopers and run all-snow armies when you feel like it. It's not hard to have enough setting-agnostic points in the form of AT-ST's, droids, and certain expensive characters, to switch it around depending on what flavor game you feel like. I did the opposite: I have a massive Hoth army and 3x stormtroopers, 1x bikes, and a specialists box, to pull out an alternate force to use in deserts and forests if I feel like it. They can borrow AT-ST's and possibly Vader to make an 800 point force easily enough.

If you want to be "competitive" and thematic, then yeah you may need to buy 3rd party spare parts for conversions.

 
When I play Imperial Guard in 40k, I take around 25-40 each of several different uniforms. Snow and jungle uniforms that would never, ever be worn simultaneously, dress uniforms that no one would ever wear into battle... for 40k I just don't mind for some reason. But I'd never do that in Legion. (shrug)  It's a game, if you hate taking mixed uniforms, don't. It's not worth the win to do something that feels like nails on a chalkboard to you. If you don't care, then shop around and take a variety of units. Just paint them and they'll still look better than an unpainted themed force!

PS I really like that there was a whole reply submitted to this for the sole purpose of summoning me to the thread. I have no idea if the summoner views me as a malign or benevolent entity though.

 

Edited by TauntaunScout

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Posted (edited)

Wetaas

Each unit has it's own unique play style, merits and flaws.. so to me the theme or uniforms are totally irrelevant since this game isn't being created based on what everything looks like... its how everything performs and what it does that adds to game play, different tactics/strategies, hazards, tricks, etc. 

In all tabletop war games I ever seen, it just comes with the territory one way or another, whether different units or different ways ppl paint their armies ends up the same, sort of out of place yet totally acceptable. Which doesn't do anything to effect the game, it just doesn't look the best visually.

Edited by Tokous

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17 minutes ago, TauntaunScout said:

All the rationalizations don't make my games look nice if I use weird mix of stuff though.

Plus, Legion uses like 40 people per side on a battlefield the size of a Wal-Mart. When multiple troop types (in real life or fantasy) are deployed they're still usually found in numbers over that. So if 3,000 stormtroopers and 600 snowtroopers are fighting in a theater of war, you're still liable to zoom in on any given hill or field the size of a Legion table and only find one troop type.

In real life, 1700 to present, the typical smallest group of people you'll find in the same uniforms anywhere is around 100 though everyone's going to start pointing out exceptions to that.

You can buy 3+ snowtroopers and run all-snow armies when you feel like it. It's not hard to have enough setting-agnostic points in the form of AT-ST's, droids, and certain expensive characters, to switch it around depending on what flavor game you feel like. I did the opposite: I have a massive Hoth army and 3x stormtroopers, 1x bikes, and a specialists box, to pull out an alternate force to use in deserts and forests if I feel like it. They can borrow AT-ST's and possibly Vader to make an 800 point force easily enough.

If you want to be "competitive" and thematic, then yeah you may need to buy 3rd party spare parts for conversions.

 
When I play Imperial Guard in 40k, I take around 25-40 each of several different uniforms. Snow and jungle uniforms that would never, ever be worn simultaneously, dress uniforms that no one would ever wear into battle... for 40k I just don't mind for some reason. But I'd never do that in Legion. (shrug)  It's a game, if you hate taking mixed uniforms, don't. It's not worth the win to do something that feels like nails on a chalkboard to you. If you don't care, then shop around and take a variety of units. Just paint them and they'll still look better than an unpainted themed force!

PS I really like that there was a whole reply submitted to this for the sole purpose of summoning me to the thread. I have no idea if the summoner views me as a malign or benevolent entity though.

 

 

Partial credit. For most militaries, the smallest organizational unit is a platoon-sized element I.e. Smallest element with an officer.

 

It is important to note that, at the point where areas of operations intersect for different units, they work more closely together and intermingle more, both to increase coordination between elements that may not have the same means of communication and to prevent potential fratricide from misidentification.

 

You won't always see different in such a small area, but it's not so uncommon as to be immediately dismissed especially when you start talking about bringing inorganic assets (armor, aviation and personnel with more training specifically for dealing with the current situation like engineers, special operations forces,etc).

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8 hours ago, TauntaunScout said:

 I have no idea if the summoner views me as a malign or benevolent entity though.

 

Malign, clearly.

Love the "firefight in a Walmart" observation ... it's right on. Kind of like why Flames of War is a tank fight in a motorpool ... and the reason I can't bring myself to play historics.

I need to suspend disbelief to play. Star Wars allows me to suspend it enough that I don't mind mixed units. I actually base each unit slightly differently so each squad is internally the same, but different from the others so it's easy to identify squad integrity.

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Some can be worked around, like snowtroopers on the beach, some are way out of wack like having Jyn in the same list as Luke. It is true in almost every tabletop game. I like thematic feeling lists, and try to build towards them, but there are only so many varients of stormtroopers to use.

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14 hours ago, MasterShake2 said:

 

Partial credit. For most militaries, the smallest organizational unit is a platoon-sized element I.e. Smallest element with an officer.

 

It would have been exceedingly rare in the 18th and 19th century to only send a platoon somewhere by itself though, with platoons from other regiments present there as well. 

At the end of the day though, I think the OP was seeking out informal unspoken codes of gamer etiquette around this issue. 

There aren’t any that I have encountered. 

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Posted (edited)

Another way to think about it though it wouldn't be common;

Most units would need to be transported to a world, now if something goes wrong with the ship like in Episode 1: The Phantom Menace (J-type 327 Nubian royal starship) it might not make it to the destined world. Very much may need to make a emergency landing anywhere close. In this case, snowtroopers could be heading to say Hoth, yet end up on Tatooine-like world. Makes sense that literally 100% units deployed don't reach target destination, perhaps at times errors or emergencies happen...

Units equipped in gear that doesn't make sense to the local surroundings!? Here's an idea why that could be so. Hopefully it helps.

Edited by Tokous

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2 hours ago, JediPartisan said:

Half? Do bandoliers really count as half clothed?😆🤪😳

Now now, there's shoulder pads and belts as well. I don't think that look would compare unfavourably to your typical bikini if there was a human woman under there instead of the wookiee, and the belt pouches were... strategically placed.

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21 hours ago, Derpzilla88 said:

This is why I'm happy to stick with Separatists as the faction I'll play. They can be on any terrain and not look out of place.

Watch them release aqua droid

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On 4/26/2019 at 6:36 AM, Wetaas said:

Does everyone feel ok to play with units that are not realistic in a given scenario. I think then of for example using snow troopers in a jungle/desert scenario.

 I know it is totally legal and at the start when this game came out it wasn’t many units to choose between, so you needed to do this to have some units to choose from. But now as many new units are released we may soon have enough units to suit every theater.

 I personally replaced my E-web unit snowtroopers with normal stormtrooper  just to feel more comfortable when I played out of a snow scenario.

What is this community feeling about this ?

No one will refuse to play a match if you bring “unrealistic” units, so it’s perfect fine. If you prefer using all of a certain theme only (I’m looking at you @TauntaunScout) then thats also fine

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