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Thrst77

Best current first order lists?

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Another five ship option:

Avenger (57)
Outmaneuver (6)
Advanced Optics (4)

Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)
Advanced Optics (4)

Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)
Advanced Optics (4)

Epsilon Squadron Cadet (26)
Advanced Optics (4)

Epsilon Squadron Cadet (26)
Advanced Optics (4)

Total (199)

I don't know if it's quite as good as OP's six ship swarm, but each ship is a little more consistent.

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My currently prefered FO list:

Kylo Ren (76)    
    Advanced Optics (4)    
 
"Scorch" (34)    
    Fanatical (2)    
    Advanced Optics (4)    
    
Lieutenant Tavson (64)    
    Captain Phasma (5)    
    Ion Cannon (5)    
    Electronic Baffle (2)    
    
Total: 196    
    
View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0: https://raithos.github.io/?f=First Order&d=v8ZhZ200Z236XW186WWY262X181W186WY289XWW183WWW11WW106&sn=Unnamed Squadron&obs=

 

Nothing really original but pretty efficient.

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Was thinking of running this list this weekend to give it a spin

“Quickdraw” (45)
Fanatical (2)
Special Forces Gunner (10)
Fire-Control System (2)
Shield Upgrade (6)

“Backdraft” (39)
Fanatical (2)
Special Forces Gunner (10)
Fire-Control System (2)

Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)
Concussion Missiles (6)
Passive Sensors (3)

Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)
Concussion Missiles (6)
Passive Sensors (3)
Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

 

Edited by Captain Mayhem
context

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10 hours ago, Captain Mayhem said:

Was thinking of running this list this weekend to give it a spin

“Quickdraw” (45)
Fanatical (2)
Special Forces Gunner (10)
Fire-Control System (2)
Shield Upgrade (6)

“Backdraft” (39)
Fanatical (2)
Special Forces Gunner (10)
Fire-Control System (2)

Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)
Concussion Missiles (6)
Passive Sensors (3)

Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)
Concussion Missiles (6)
Passive Sensors (3)
Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

 

One suggestion is to change SU on QD for Afterburners. 

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Flew the following tonight. 

Kylo (76)

Commander Malarus (39)
Crack shot (1)

Midnight (43)
Crack shot (1)

Null (31)

Total (191)

I was curious as to how a high initiative, large bid, FO list would do. It did okay, but way more testing needs to go into this one.

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5 hours ago, Magnus Grendel said:

Interested to know if you feel you got more mileage out of Malarus & Null than you would have from Quickdraw.

For me probably so.

Numbers wise it's eight health (and an extra body) versus six health.

For whatever reason, I've just not been able to make QD work very well the few times I've flown her.

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On 12/12/2019 at 12:34 PM, Captain Mayhem said:

Was thinking of running this list this weekend to give it a spin

“Quickdraw” (45)
Fanatical (2)
Special Forces Gunner (10)
Fire-Control System (2)
Shield Upgrade (6)

“Backdraft” (39)
Fanatical (2)
Special Forces Gunner (10)
Fire-Control System (2)

Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)
Concussion Missiles (6)
Passive Sensors (3)

Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)
Concussion Missiles (6)
Passive Sensors (3)
Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

 

Did you get a chance to give this a spin over the weekend? If so, how did it go?

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10 hours ago, Captain Mayhem said:

No. Family obligations cropped up last weekend. I plan on using it THIS weekend though.

Fair enough; I intend to fly it tonight (as the start of my local group's System Open 'training'), and will report back on how it goes.

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1 hour ago, AceDogbert said:

Fair enough; I intend to fly it tonight (as the start of my local group's System Open 'training'), and will report back on how it goes.

I'm still on the fence on QD's upgrade. Don't know if I want Afterburners, the Shield, or nothing and take a 6 point bid.

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2 hours ago, Captain Mayhem said:

I'm still on the fence on QD's upgrade. Don't know if I want Afterburners, the Shield, or nothing and take a 6 point bid.

I was pondering dropping the gunner from Backdraft to give QD a Pattern Analyzer and a five point bid, but will see how the list works in the original format before tinkering.

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1 hour ago, AceDogbert said:

I was pondering dropping the gunner from Backdraft to give QD a Pattern Analyzer and a five point bid, but will see how the list works in the original format before tinkering.

Cutting Gunner from Backdraft, switching FCS to Advanced Optics, and using the rest of the points to give Pattern Analyzer to QD would be an upgrade to the list, IMHO.

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On 11/11/2019 at 3:49 AM, Oldpara said:

Yes, Evans list was inspiration for Avenger swarm. 

What are your thoughts on replacing Avenger with Rush for that i6? I cant imagine he would be more than 57pts (my guess is 55pts). If they go for your big 3 dice gun, they create an i6 ace, or they go for the fodder and leave the big gun alone to be aggressive with. If 55pts, leaves a 3pt bid for Rush when he does become an i6. Of course, Vonreg could also slot into that spot for instant i6 🤔

Edited by wurms

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22 minutes ago, wurms said:

What are your thoughts on replacing Avenger with Rush for that i6? I cant imagine he would be more than 57pts (my guess is 55pts). If they go for your big 3 dice gun, they create an i6 ace, or they go for the fodder and leave the big gun alone to be aggressive with. If 55pts, leaves a 3pt bid for Rush when he does become an i6. Of course, Vonreg could also slot into that spot for instant i6 🤔

Since Rush has a Talent slot and will potentially become really awesome @I6 I'm guessing he'll be at FOTP+ pricing.

Just Fanatical and PT and he'll be a monster to verse as soon as that damage card gets on him. 

 

On a related note, it's only Seyn and ISYTDS that can put cards under shields right? Rush loves those pilots!

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Hrm.  I guess the logic behind a Rush in an otherwise-Avenger Swarm would be to have a ship that if an opponent comes at rush and doesn't finish them off, they'll be a nasty finisher.  Go after Avenger early, and it's just taking a valuable ship off the board.

Personally, I like the thought of Rush more with like a 3 ship aces build (two of Kylo, QD, Vonreg).  There, perhaps Rush is the only one your opponent is able to approach easily, not wanting to over-commit on an ace who can get past you.  But if the opponent fails to kill Rush in one go, you've now got a 3rd high-init ship.

There's something funny to me about the thought of Quickdraw, Rush, and Tavson together.  I'm sure it's not as good as Kylo, but I just think it's funny.

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48 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

Hrm.  I guess the logic behind a Rush in an otherwise-Avenger Swarm would be to have a ship that if an opponent comes at rush and doesn't finish them off, they'll be a nasty finisher.  Go after Avenger early, and it's just taking a valuable ship off the board.

Personally, I like the thought of Rush more with like a 3 ship aces build (two of Kylo, QD, Vonreg).  There, perhaps Rush is the only one your opponent is able to approach easily, not wanting to over-commit on an ace who can get past you.  But if the opponent fails to kill Rush in one go, you've now got a 3rd high-init ship.

There's something funny to me about the thought of Quickdraw, Rush, and Tavson together.  I'm sure it's not as good as Kylo, but I just think it's funny.

I think all of the new pilots coming to the FO are going to breath new life into the faction, they all seem incredibly interesting and strategy defining. And the Tie/Ba seems like an amazingly efficient platform

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1 hour ago, LeMightyASP said:

I think all of the new pilots coming to the FO are going to breath new life into the faction, they all seem incredibly interesting and strategy defining. And the Tie/Ba seems like an amazingly efficient platform

We'll have to see the cost before we know whether it's efficient or not.  :D :P

But it surely is very flexible in-game.  I mean, each one is basically L'ulo L'ampar with only a front arc.

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8 hours ago, wurms said:

What are your thoughts on replacing Avenger with Rush for that i6? I cant imagine he would be more than 57pts (my guess is 55pts). If they go for your big 3 dice gun, they create an i6 ace, or they go for the fodder and leave the big gun alone to be aggressive with. If 55pts, leaves a 3pt bid for Rush when he does become an i6. Of course, Vonreg could also slot into that spot for instant i6 🤔

I am on hold with all list building until 9th January :)

Except new ships there will be a lot of changes among old ones like possible dorp points on generics so who knows what will fit? 

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A case for SF/FOs.

I’m a long-time wargamer (1979)and Star Wars fan. Played casual V1 mostly ending top half with my own lists in Tournaments. Come V2, I decided to improve my score. Failed dismally, after hitting rock bottom with Empire, set me on a path to find me a list that would fly according to my character and style.  I trolled the net and had various lists (no Scum Faction, sold all that to get other ships). Studying List Fortress and MetaWing, reading articles etc and using the X Wing Calculator and a simple spreadsheet. What inspired me was X Wing Analytica(GreenDragoon) and the Rebelbeef article.  Why is this list so good XXXA list could it be done in another faction.  Tie FO/SF with AO comes close.

 

I put together various options and tested them out at the club. Three straight wins against good players with netlists. I knew I was on to something.  Using the FLYCasual program I refined the list and developed tactics to suit, It also happened to suit my loose playing style.

Initial List.

"Scorch" (34)    Advanced Optics (4)  Ship total: 38  Half Points: 19  Threshold: 2   

"Longshot" (32)      Advanced Optics (4)  Ship total: 36  Half Points: 18  Threshold: 2   

Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)        Advanced Optics (4)    Ship total: 36  Half Points: 18  Threshold: 3   

Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)       Advanced Optics (4)    Ship total: 36  Half Points: 18  Threshold: 3   

Zeta Squadron Pilot (27)    Ship total: 27  Half Points: 14  Threshold: 2   

Zeta Squadron Pilot (27)    Ship total: 27  Half Points: 14  Threshold: 2   

Total: 200   

With all these lists you need to have the initiative, you need the focus token.I use Gas Clouds. This is not a traditional fly-in formation swarm list, as a matter of fact, the looser the better. I start with the S/F in the middle, FO and ace on each flank. Depending on my opponent I have Long Shot further away from my opponents' ships to fly in on the flank with his accompanying FO.  Scorch and his FO fly in behind the S/Fs . The trick is to choose a spot on the board where all your guns will be pointed just when your opponent one or multiple ships reach it, some openings will be slow some fast. Approach the point from all angles. I found that if ONE S/F rolls defense dice at range three from one opponent's ship, I have the optimal opening. The next round you will be in a prime position.  Focus fire, Scorch and Long will finish stragglers next round.   Swarms, you need to take at least one opponents ship a round, against Vultures at least two. Generally, I fire at Aces only when all their support is gone or if the opportunity presents destroy with extreme prejudice. Most other lists, they all fly in a certain way, watch/scroll youtube, they all have set opening.

I also use the S/F and FO to bump to deny return fire not so much to stop my opponent from taking actions.  Use your Focus in defense if you are down to 2 hull.

So I’ve managed more wins than loses around 75% never lost to the same netlist twice. 6+ Drones are still the main problem but I think everyone has an issue with them. I’ve climbed back into top half and my best is a second at a tournament of 18 players in the last 6 months

Current List:

"Scorch" (34)        Fanatical (2)        Advanced Optics (4)   Ship total: 40  Half Points: 20  Threshold: 2      

"Longshot" (32)        Crack Shot (1)     Advanced Optics (4)        Ship total: 37  Half Points: 19  Threshold: 2   

Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)        Advanced Optics (4)        Special Forces Gunner (10)    Ship total: 46  Half Points: 23  Threshold: 3   

Zeta Squadron Survivor (32)        Advanced Optics (4)        Special Forces Gunner (10)    Ship Total: 46  Half Points: 23  Threshold: 3   

 Zeta Squadron Pilot (27)        Advanced Optics (4)        Ship total: 31  Half Points: 16  Threshold: 2   

Total: 200   

The MOV of the list isn’t good, you will lose ships every game, I usually end up with 3 damaged ships at time or winning the game. Don’t be afraid to let the one hull ship run away with an evade. Often your opponent will chase it, play accordingly and chase them. (Sounds like the First Order to me.)

Psychology: A lot of my opponents don’t believe it can do well, after the game, you had good dice, too maneuverable, too much hull/Shields to chew through is heard.  Be prepared for a long game, Your opponent is about to die by a thousand cuts. You’ll need stamina to finish a tournament. I cannot stress more, know the rules and your opponents' lists, each game I now ask what this ship doing, who is passing tokens and the like. Please psych your opponent out in your special way,( The First Order demands it). I have my dials down before my opponent, tapping the board saying  “Set”. I plan where a ship will be up to three turns ahead. Be imaginative and occasionally do the unexpected. I once caught Whisper on the tail of two SFs by flying 5 straight instead of one straight as expected .  Next round  Whisper faced 8 dice after I did two sloops as he followed up.

I do expect the point change but for the better. 

Please use the FLY Casual simulator to test these out.  I will read your posts with great interest.

 

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