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RedDogReb

Can I Make it 5 out of 5?

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Had a game on yesterday (Monday 8th), and as I was at an unprecedented (for me anyway) 4 wins from 4 games with a fleet, I went with my Up Close & Personal list again.

I tweaked it a little though, replacing ACM with APT, saving 6 points.

I felt getting crits in under shields was a better option.

It also gave me a better bid of 12 points as I really want to do the last first thing.

 

So my list was:

ISD Kuat, Screed, Strat Adv, GT, ECM, LS, APT

GSD, Intel Officer, OE, ET, APT, Demo

GSD, Intel Officer, OE, ET, APT, Insidious

Gozanti, Comms Net

Gozanti, Comms Net

Total 388.

 

I was up a friend who I hadn’t used this list against previously.

 

His fleet was:

ISD1, Screed, Flight Commander, Boarding Troopers, Rapid Launch Bays, Leading Shots, Chimera, Entrapment Formation

Raider2, GT, DCaps, Overload Pulse

Gozanti, Bomber Command Centre

Gozanti, Comms Net

Squadrons:

Boba, Maarek Steele, Col Jendon, Mauler Mithel, 2 x Tie Bombers, Black Squadron.

Total 392

 

I chose first player and his solar corona.

 

I deployed centrally, Demo, Gozanti, ISD, Gozanti, Insidious. As in previous games combat ships speed 3, gozantis speed 2.

 

He deployed as far to his right (my left) as possible, with the corona on that side also. A mix of speed 1 and 2. Crucially, the Raider was on the far side of the ISD.

 

Having beaten two squadron heavy fleets where the carriers were relatively weak, I was concerned at facing an ISD carrier, especially one with Boarding Troopers.

 

The early turns (1-3?) were a turning game as I tried to get around him, avoiding both Overload Pulse and Boarding Troopers.

 

Mid game (T3 I think) I got a glorious side shot from demo at the side of the ISD with Concentrate Fire. Five dice, 11 damage on the natural roll. No need for Screed, no need for Ord Experts! Intel Officered the brace. He burnt it to reduce the damage to six, and with some redirecting he had no shields on that side or the rear.

Demo was in side and rear arcs of the ISD and took a bit of punishment in return, but this was mainly reducing most shields to 0, maybe one internal. Although I think I had burnt at least one of my defence tokens.

 

He did go ahead though by killing one of my Gozantis, and at this point I was worried as I couldn’t flak enough to kill any of the high strength squadrons  and wasn’t sure how I’d get the ISD.

 

However, by Turn 5 I think, and having endured some squadron bombing, Insidious had got round to the rear of the ISD1, and I had lined up a double side and front arc shot. There was one shield left on one side, none at the rear and none on the other side. 12 needed to destroy it. Side arc shot first, did something like 6 damage including a black crit for APT, while front arc did about 4 including another black crit for APT. 12 exactly. ISD gone. That put me well in the lead. However it did leave Insidious close to a few of his squadrons. I think he used The BC Gozanti to activate, with the benefit of a token also.

 

The outcome of this was that Insidous went down due to damage earlier in the game. However I’d exchange a GSD for an ISD every day!

 

Last turn Demo (who had been out of the action repairing as much as possible) had been able to damage the BC Gozanti (forcing it to burn the Scatter), but having moved, I was able to take a shot at the BC Gozanti with a side shot, which unsurprisingly did the necessary to kill it.

 

A couple of bomber activations later, Demo survived, as did my ISD and his Raider.

 

Final points were 192 vs 108 (MOV 84) win for me!

 

I really am NOT used to this. 5 wins out of 5….5 losses out of 5 is my usual outcome.

 

What appears to throw the guys I’ve played so far is my high initial speed in closing the distance, and how to deal with that. My son and another chap have gone slowly, and regretted it as they weren’t able to get out of the way. In yesterdays game he was going speed 2-4 depending on the ship by the end of the game, and while it was more difficult for me than the last two games (against “weaker” carriers), the GSDs short range fire power and manoeuvrability with Engine Techs made the difference.

 

That said I still made mistakes, I had Engineering dials on the ISD when I didn’t need them – I thought it would have been shredded, and would need them, but it was more of a decoy for his ISD while my GSDs did their work. I was pleased that during the game he only had one opportunity to use Overload Pulse (he didn’t) or Boarding Troopers (that would have been against a GSD and again he didn’t). The rest of the game the Raider was out of range (being on the far side of the ISD at deployment was crucial) and he couldn’t get his ISD into short range of my Kuat.

 

One of the guys at my club (who has already lost to this) wants a rematch with him using a different fleet. He used it yesterday at the club, about 4 Hammerheads, a couple of CR90s and possibly a GR75. My activation advantage might be lost!

 

To say I am both astonished and very pleased, would be an understatement!

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1 hour ago, RedDogReb said:

His fleet was:

ISD1, Screed, Flight Commander, Boarding Troopers, Rapid Launch Bays, Leading Shots, Chimera, Entrapment Formation

Raider2, GT, DCaps, Overload Pulse

Gozanti, Bomber Command Centre

Gozanti, Comms Net

Squadrons:

Boba, Maarek Steele, Col Jendon, Mauler Mithel, 2 x Tie Bombers, Black Squadron.

Total 392

 

Your list, with ISD, double GSD and 6 activations is really nice and strong.
I don't want to lower you win in any way, but this list, from your opponent, has some major flaws, that makes it easier to play against 😉.

For your opponent, burning 8 points for a Bomber Command center, only for two TIE Bombers, is really a waste of points. Stele does not need it. And Jendon will not use his effect for a TIE Bomber. These 8 points would be more usefull in another TIE Bomber.
Next is the "easy pick" Soloar Corona mission. This mission is by far the least that should be used in a fleet, and only if there is no other good choice. It sometimes gives the impression, that the fleet has no concept, and the missions are not fitting, so they take what is causing no problems. Ending in a fleet that waste the second player status with weak missions.
Nothing against the fleet, but the missions are a crucial point of the fleet, and sometimes i just does not fit together 😉.
Even when i don't fully agree to the Flight Commanders, i can see the reason behind him. But this is blocking the slot for some of the best Officers on an ISD I (Pryce / Brunson / Tua). Officers that would have saved the ISD from destruction.

But i like the combination of Overload Pulse with Boarding Troopers. it is a nice (even a bit expensive) way to kill all defense tokens. It just force you into an activation order and range that is makes it predicatable. As you were showing and using really well.

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50 minutes ago, Tokra said:

Your list, with ISD, double GSD and 6 activations is really nice and strong.
I don't want to lower you win in any way, but this list, from your opponent, has some major flaws, that makes it easier to play against 😉.

For your opponent, burning 8 points for a Bomber Command center, only for two TIE Bombers, is really a waste of points. Stele does not need it. And Jendon will not use his effect for a TIE Bomber. These 8 points would be more usefull in another TIE Bomber.
Next is the "easy pick" Soloar Corona mission. This mission is by far the least that should be used in a fleet, and only if there is no other good choice. It sometimes gives the impression, that the fleet has no concept, and the missions are not fitting, so they take what is causing no problems. Ending in a fleet that waste the second player status with weak missions.
Nothing against the fleet, but the missions are a crucial point of the fleet, and sometimes i just does not fit together 😉.
Even when i don't fully agree to the Flight Commanders, i can see the reason behind him. But this is blocking the slot for some of the best Officers on an ISD I (Pryce / Brunson / Tua). Officers that would have saved the ISD from destruction.

But i like the combination of Overload Pulse with Boarding Troopers. it is a nice (even a bit expensive) way to kill all defense tokens. It just force you into an activation order and range that is makes it predicatable. As you were showing and using really well.

The blue objectives are easy for heavy-squadron fleets and for fleets that have strategic (and preferably Adar/FCT).  Otherwise, you have to pick Dangerous Territory, Nav Hazards, or Solar Corona - or risk encountering an opponent with strategic squadrons of his own and having your objective flipped.  Do you have any thoughts on optimizing objectives in that scenario, or would you just suggest running max squads and/or strategic in every fleet you design?

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21 minutes ago, Tokra said:

Your list, with ISD, double GSD and 6 activations is really nice and strong.
I don't want to lower you win in any way, but this list, from your opponent, has some major flaws, that makes it easier to play against 😉.

For your opponent, burning 8 points for a Bomber Command center, only for two TIE Bombers, is really a waste of points. Stele does not need it. And Jendon will not use his effect for a TIE Bomber. These 8 points would be more usefull in another TIE Bomber.
Next is the "easy pick" Soloar Corona mission. This mission is by far the least that should be used in a fleet, and only if there is no other good choice. It sometimes gives the impression, that the fleet has no concept, and the missions are not fitting, so they take what is causing no problems. Ending in a fleet that waste the second player status with weak missions.
Nothing against the fleet, but the missions are a crucial point of the fleet, and sometimes i just does not fit together 😉.
Even when i don't fully agree to the Flight Commanders, i can see the reason behind him. But this is blocking the slot for some of the best Officers on an ISD I (Pryce / Brunson / Tua). Officers that would have saved the ISD from destruction.

But i like the combination of Overload Pulse with Boarding Troopers. it is a nice (even a bit expensive) way to kill all defense tokens. It just force you into an activation order and range that is makes it predicatable. As you were showing and using really well.

@Tokra for a World Champion to say I have a nice strong list is good enough for me! Thanks.

I still class myself very much a noob, and feel I have got away with it for the last 5 games, so no issues with your comments.

The list suits me, I have less to think about (25% of the order dial is irrelevant to this fleet) and the tactics are almost only "Charge!". Its not quite that simple (I think I would have lost if I'd just gone straight in) but flying fast is, IMO, key for it.

I haven't used squadrons much (they've always been an after thought in any list I've had, rather than an integral part of it), but even I felt there was something may be not missing, but that it wasn't optimal. It felt neither one thing nor the other.

One thing I forgot to mention, he had half the squadrons on the table, the other half in Rapid Launch Bays. In my view this split his force so he wasn't able to bring over whelming fire power to bear. My son (18) has a rebel bomber list. Although I have beaten him with this list, they did shred Demo in quick order. Something last nights oppo didn't do. I think that played right, concentrated rebel/imperial bombers could certainly deal with this list. Don't know of a good imperial squadron list do you??? ;-)

I was aware of Overload Pulse and Boarding Troopers, but beyond that.... Once I knew his fleet, I wasn't sure where he would deploy, and wanted to try to avoid them if possible. I'm learning that deployment is such a big part of the game - If his Raider had been on the other side of the ISD at deployment there is no doubt he would have got Overload Pulse on the ISD thanks to DCaps. Then, who knows.

After the game a few of us were chatting and the survivability of the ISD came up and Tua/Brunson were mentioned as almost being essential.

With regard to the objectives, the others were Fighter Ambush (nope) and Close Range Intel Scan. I didn't want this one as it added two more patches for the squadrons to hide in. When I was placing the debris, I put mine right in the corners, out of the way of my ships. He placed his (not the station) quite close to my side. With me going Speed 3  was over them first/second turn.

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Do you find Gunnery Teams useful on a Kuat? I used an Ozzel one with OE and ACMs to good effect at my last regional. He was my main finisher though, going in last after my other ships. 

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2 hours ago, rasproteus said:

The blue objectives are easy for heavy-squadron fleets and for fleets that have strategic (and preferably Adar/FCT).  Otherwise, you have to pick Dangerous Territory, Nav Hazards, or Solar Corona - or risk encountering an opponent with strategic squadrons of his own and having your objective flipped.  Do you have any thoughts on optimizing objectives in that scenario, or would you just suggest running max squads and/or strategic in every fleet you design?

You know the answer to this 😁. If i could, i would take 200 points in squadrons.

But yes, the navigation missions are a hard pick. But because of this, you will always end in Solar Corona, and there is no danger to pick first player, if you can foreseen that the opponent has Soloar Corona. This is something that will be changed with the new missions, at least i hope so. 

But you have always to watch your missions. And if the fleet is not fitting well, i would adjust it a bit to make it fit a bit better. You just take SC if it is not fitting to anything else.
Just taking out the BCC and Black Squadron would allow one Shuttle. And one Shuttle is more than enought o pick Intel Sweep, Sensor Net or Salvage Run. This alone will make the opponent at least hurt a bit for being first player.

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45 minutes ago, Tokra said:

You know the answer to this 😁. If i could, i would take 200 points in squadrons.

But yes, the navigation missions are a hard pick. But because of this, you will always end in Solar Corona, and there is no danger to pick first player, if you can foreseen that the opponent has Soloar Corona. This is something that will be changed with the new missions, at least i hope so. 

But you have always to watch your missions. And if the fleet is not fitting well, i would adjust it a bit to make it fit a bit better. You just take SC if it is not fitting to anything else.
Just taking out the BCC and Black Squadron would allow one Shuttle. And one Shuttle is more than enough to pick Intel Sweep, Sensor Net or Salvage Run. This alone will make the opponent at least hurt a bit for being first player.

There is a place for Solar Corona... Raiders and CR90s, Liberties and VSD's - they live and die by accuracies.  On the other hand, I tied Intel Sweep twice (should have lost it to Yik, but it was a funky deployment for him) and lost it twice at Worlds, even with a single VCX.  I don't know if I would take it again without two VCX's, minimum.

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13 hours ago, Herr Style said:

Do you find Gunnery Teams useful on a Kuat? I used an Ozzel one with OE and ACMs to good effect at my last regional. He was my main finisher though, going in last after my other ships. 

Yes. I started with Ordnance Experts on the Kuat, but after one game was certain that Gunnery Teams were better.

So it has proved in every game since. Only 4 games is hardly a scientific study, but it’s worked better for me.

Even in the game above where the ISD didn’t do anything spectacular, GT was useful for flaking out of front arc after I’d shot the reds at his ISD.

I can see why OE might be better with Ozzel, as you can potentially leap into close range going last. Then have the devastating shot first in the next turn. However for me, with this list, GT feels better.

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