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Captain Lackwit

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50 minutes ago, Kleeg005 said:

I just tried a Bombardment Drone with Simulator/Protons/Proxs/Fuses/Struts.  Parked it on a rock and covered two directions with ProxMines, a third with another rock, and just sat there flinging Proton Bombs and reloading them.  It was great fun, complimenting three Precise Hunters with just Struts, Sear with TA-175 (who only activated once for zero effect), and Butterbot, who sat on the rock nearest to the Bombard and passed tokens.  So much fun, in fact, that I think I may have to drop Sear pick up a second Hyena to run two of the Bombards.

That's SUPER expensive point-wise, but also hilarious

Might convince me to ape that idea of just treating proton bombs as an "attack"

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12 hours ago, Kleeg005 said:

I just tried a Bombardment Drone with Simulator/Protons/Proxs/Fuses/Struts.  Parked it on a rock and covered two directions with ProxMines, a third with another rock, and just sat there flinging Proton Bombs and reloading them.  It was great fun, complimenting three Precise Hunters with just Struts, Sear with TA-175 (who only activated once for zero effect), and Butterbot, who sat on the rock nearest to the Bombard and passed tokens.  So much fun, in fact, that I think I may have to drop Sear pick up a second Hyena to run two of the Bombards.

One important thing - did you rember,that you can only launch bombs (not mines) using trajectory simulator? Or maybe you've launched them only using 1 straight template with bombardment drone's ship ability?

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I dunno if there should be a separate thread for this but... I had an idea for a tri fighter pilot and I'm interested to hear other people's ideas if they got any.

 

(Two Dot) Plac-Arphocc Prototype: I4 (or I5)

At the start of engagement, you may exchange one of your tokens with a friendly Plac-Arphocc Prototype.

 

This is obviously the 'prototype' pilot for the ship, and I reckon it has the same 'experimental' flavor as the other prototype pilots. The effect is gone as soon as one of these things pops, but that initiative 4/5 is there to stay.

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Played 5 Hyenas last night. 404 with plasmas and probes, tub with plasmas and 3x TUBs with protons. Struts on all the TUBs. It was brutal for my opponent. The probe locks make for a scary alpha

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Posted (edited)

I finally got to use Hyena Bombers for the first time this past weekend and they certainly lived up to my hopes and then some. I took inspiration from stuff I'd seen posted here to come up with an all droids list that mixed Hyenas and Vultures together while trying out plenty of the new pilots and upgrades I had.

Out of everything in my list, I was most impressed with the combination of DBS-32C's pilot ability + DFS-311 + Passive Sensors. Three start of engagement phase actions feels really, really good. And I think it really surprised my opponent at how token'd-up my ships could get even after a bump or two. 32C's price feels a bit more justified with how useful the pilot ability is, but I still think it could come down a few points. If only so I can fit Landing Struts on it.

Scavenger Squad

DBS-404 (30)
 - Energy Shell Charges (5)

DBS-32C (42)
 - Kraken (10)

Separatist Drone (21)
 - Energy Shell Charges (5)

Separatist Drone (21)
 - Energy Shell Charges (5)

Baktoid Prototype (28)
 - Passive Sensors (3)
 - Diamond Boron Missiles (6)
 - Landing Struts (1)

DFS-311 (23)

Total: 200

Edited by Derpzilla88

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10 minutes ago, Derpzilla88 said:

Out of everything in my list, I was most impressed with the combination of DBS-32C's pilot ability + DFS-311 + Passive Sensors. Three start of engagement phase actions feels really, really good.

Be sure to take another look at Passive Sensors as it's not "start of engagement phase" it's "Before you engage" which means when the Baktoid Prototype at i1, just before then, Passive Sensors actives. 

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Posted (edited)
13 minutes ago, Derpzilla88 said:

...Passive Sensors. Three start of engagement phase actions

Careful, Passive Sensors only happens at the start of that ship’s engagement, not the beginning of the engagement phase. It’s a subtle distinction that can really hurt lower initiative ships if they decide they’d rather have the Calculate for defense.

Edited by SpiderMana
Frickin Ninjas, man.

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11 minutes ago, RStan said:

Be sure to take another look at Passive Sensors as it's not "start of engagement phase" it's "Before you engage" which means when the Baktoid Prototype at i1, just before then, Passive Sensors actives. 

 

9 minutes ago, SpiderMana said:

Careful, Passive Sensors only happens at the start of that ship’s engagement, not the beginning of the engagement phase. It’s a subtle distinction that can really hurt lower initiative ships if they decide they’d rather have the Calculate for defense.

Thanks for the heads up. Looking back on the game, I don't think I used it at the right timing but I only used it to grab a target lock anyways. I'm going to chalk it up to me misreading the card while too excited to try out all the new stuff all at once. I never coordinated the Baktoid prototype because I remembered that part, but I know I accidentally grabbed target locks before it's turn. Butterbot would then pass it a calculate token.

The more I know the better. Ultimately, it didn't matter too much because I lost the game anyways. I still like the combination of those three in a list together.

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I have not really used the Probe Droid before.  How do you move it up to be useful without getting blown up?  The only way I can think of is going up the middle while the rest slowly goes up the side.  Seems weak to someone that turns in to kill it while you can't support it.

My friends are scared about new things and want to blast anything new they see before it gets used.

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Posted (edited)
24 minutes ago, heychadwick said:

I have not really used the Probe Droid before.  How do you move it up to be useful without getting blown up?  The only way I can think of is going up the middle while the rest slowly goes up the side.  Seems weak to someone that turns in to kill it while you can't support it.

My friends are scared about new things and want to blast anything new they see before it gets used.

I’m fairly certain I’ve seen somebody shoot at any of my remotes exactly one time. Range 3 through a gas cloud, and it was only because they didn’t have any other shots for those ships.

edit: but hey, since they completely ignore obstacles while moving, maybe just try to keep them obstructed on approach?

editedit: you also move it in the system phase. So keep it out of range of their shots until you can get it within their range during the system phase, ideally.

Edited by SpiderMana

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17 hours ago, Derpzilla88 said:

I finally got to use Hyena Bombers for the first time this past weekend and they certainly lived up to my hopes and then some. I took inspiration from stuff I'd seen posted here to come up with an all droids list that mixed Hyenas and Vultures together while trying out plenty of the new pilots and upgrades I had.

Out of everything in my list, I was most impressed with the combination of DBS-32C's pilot ability + DFS-311 + Passive Sensors. Three start of engagement phase actions feels really, really good. And I think it really surprised my opponent at how token'd-up my ships could get even after a bump or two. 32C's price feels a bit more justified with how useful the pilot ability is, but I still think it could come down a few points. If only so I can fit Landing Struts on it.

Scavenger Squad

DBS-404 (30)
 - Energy Shell Charges (5)

DBS-32C (42)
 - Kraken (10)

Separatist Drone (21)
 - Energy Shell Charges (5)

Separatist Drone (21)
 - Energy Shell Charges (5)

Baktoid Prototype (28)
 - Passive Sensors (3)
 - Diamond Boron Missiles (6)
 - Landing Struts (1)

DFS-311 (23)

Total: 200

Remove the struts on the baktoid to put them on 32C, and you got your available struts ! :)

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3 hours ago, heychadwick said:

I have not really used the Probe Droid before.  How do you move it up to be useful without getting blown up?  The only way I can think of is going up the middle while the rest slowly goes up the side.  Seems weak to someone that turns in to kill it while you can't support it.

My friends are scared about new things and want to blast anything new they see before it gets used.

It takes a couple of games to get used to how the probes work but once you do it is pretty easy to have them out of range until you can acquire locks before they get shot. I typically send them to the center of the board then the following turn they can move to have range on just about anything.

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So four games in with:

TUB- Plasmas, Probe Droids

Bak Proto- Diamond Boron, Struts

5x Trade Fed Drones- ESC, Struts

 

This list is degenerate nonsense. My commentary, and one all of my opponents agreed with is "You're not playing X-Wing". Your rocketing calc-locked missiles, ignoring rocks and range bonuses, when you are on a rock, you don't even execute maneuvers. I barely caught Fenn Rau at R3 with a vultureand the Bak and casually killed him by using the the Baks ability to lob a Diamond Boron. Ketsu rolled double evades for her first 4 defense rolls and still died in 2 turns. Han tried to hard turn into a boost and was barely within range on the TUB, so he lost most of his shields. The list is just very lethal has high action economy and is very difficult to match in maneuvering with the combination of hard turns and struts.

 

I think people have seriously underestimated how much the Hyenas change a Droid swarm.

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Posted (edited)

Not sure how playing low I ships isn't "playing Xwing"

For one, you do NOT ignore rocks

A.) You have to actually land your ship on it. Struts dont flip if only your template overlaps. 

B.) Once strutted, you're stuck until you either 2-foward or roll off of the rock

C.) Don't forget the two ship per rock limit!

Ie, you're not flying an army of dash rendars. Struts are a commitment unless you're just landing to then roll off of an obstacle

Edited by ficklegreendice

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

Not sure how playing low I ships isn't "playing Xwing"

For one, you do NOT ignore rocks

A.) You have to actually land your ship on it. Struts dont flip if only your template overlaps. 

B.) Once strutted, you're stuck until you either 2-foward or roll off of the rock

C.) Don't forget the two ship per rock limit!

Ie, you're not flying an army of dash rendars. 

I mean, Dash can land on a rock, but if he does you've got 75% of your list that can't shoot that round and is still almost certainly getting shot at (he can't dodge worth anything). He can roll off of it, but he ends up stressed without a linked action. And there's only ever 1 Dash who only ever gets 1 action (no links or PTL and coordinate is still 1 per ship), not an army of calculate-passing linked-action-spammers. And if he doesn't get obstruction he definitely doesn't pay for himself. The tired old argument of "Dash just doesn't care about obstacles" is 100% untrue in 2.0; if he's not using the obstacles to his advantage, he's playing very badly.

The fact is that different unique ways of interacting with obstacles (other than the primitive "Rocks = Bad") are good for the game as it makes for more tactical variety. I think there's definitely an argument that Dash is less degenerate than landing struts, but that's, just like, my opinion man, so don't take it too seriously.

I'm happy that both exist. They're engaging to play and to play against as they bend your mind around in really funky ways.

Edited by ClassicalMoser

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Posted (edited)

Just bring Debris with Dash. They might as well not exist for him

Not so with struts. The same limitations apply as with rocks

Struts do NOT remove obstacles from the game, they completely and fundamentally change how droids manuever (and are a great way to compensate for the lack of banks)

Edited by ficklegreendice

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4 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

Just bring Debris with Dash. They might as well not exist for him

Not so with struts. The same limitations apply as with rocks

Struts do NOT remove obstacles from the game, they completely and fundamentally change how droids manuever (and are a great way to compensate for the lack of banks)

 

Struts are worse than removing rocks, you actively benefit from them.  Oh yeah, on the 2 ship per rock thing, it doesn't actually exist, you just barrel roll an existing ship off before the next one takes it's place, then the ship off the rock will ignore all obstacles for it's next maneuver.

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Posted (edited)
20 minutes ago, ficklegreendice said:

Just bring Debris with Dash. They might as well not exist for him

Not so with struts. The same limitations apply as with rocks

Struts do NOT remove obstacles from the game, they completely and fundamentally change how droids manuever (and are a great way to compensate for the lack of banks)

But my point is that this is exactly the same for Dash. If he has the title and/or Trick Shot, he DEFINITELY can’t afford to ignore the obstacles. If he’s not landing in debris or if he IS landing on rocks, he’s missing out on a lot of the dice that his price point depends on. If he’s not obstructed on defense, he dies WAY too fast. If he’s not obstructed on Attack, he doesn’t deal nearly enough damage. If he lands on a rock, he’s skipping out on a potential 10 red dice and will still be taking 100% of the enemy’s firepower.

Dash cares every bit as much about obstacles as grappling droids do, and it matters more for him as you have all your eggs in one basket.

Yes, both fundamentally reframe how obstacles play, but don’t make the mistake of thinking they’re not playing the same game. Crucially, they also are certainly not removing counterplay or agency in any meaningful way.

Edited by ClassicalMoser

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23 minutes ago, MasterShake2 said:

 

Struts are worse than removing rocks, you actively benefit from them.  Oh yeah, on the 2 ship per rock thing, it doesn't actually exist, you just barrel roll an existing ship off before the next one takes it's place, then the ship off the rock will ignore all obstacles for it's next maneuver.

You CAN benefit from rocks, but the inability to move can be a real limitation especially when you're stuck to 90 degrees pivots 

As for "just use your action to overcome a limitation"...hey, you've used your action

And while you ignore asteroids/debris while moving, struts flip back after executing a manuever. Don't overlap a rock!

And ofc, struts don't do diddly to gas clouds 

 

Once people get accustomed to actually seeing struts, we'll see counterplay both during set up and during the actual game. I wouldn't judge them degenerates after a game against the spectacularly nerfed scum Han

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1 hour ago, MasterShake2 said:

So four games in with:

TUB- Plasmas, Probe Droids

Bak Proto- Diamond Boron, Struts

5x Trade Fed Drones- ESC, Struts

I might have to try this one.  I did make some changes.  I dropped the Grapplers on the Vultures to add Munitions Failsafe on the Hyenas and also FCS on TUB.

I also realized the Drone drops at End Phase and the  moves on System.  So...that does give it about a speed 6 advance move.

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31 minutes ago, heychadwick said:

I might have to try this one.  I did make some changes.  I dropped the Grapplers on the Vultures to add Munitions Failsafe on the Hyenas and also FCS on TUB.

I also realized the Drone drops at End Phase and the  moves on System.  So...that does give it about a speed 6 advance move.

 

Grappling is stupid, keep struts, also munitions failsafe is meh with double modded shots

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4 hours ago, MasterShake2 said:

 

Grappling is stupid, keep struts, also munitions failsafe is meh with double modded shots

 

1 hour ago, Vector Strike said:

Munitions Failsafe are really underwhelming. Tried them many times, but they saved charges not more than four times. Hyenas on obstacles have white Reload, so even less reason to give them MF

I agree that MF isn't that great on the Hyenas, but it could save those charges to avoid a Reload.  If you do blank out and again with the TL, it can save those charges.

Also won't always be double moded.

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