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14 hours ago, Seastan said:

To the contrary, I think you'll find that many players, myself included, consider the game right now to be the best it's ever been.

To a degree I can agree with that. Plenty of options. Plenty of content.
But in the area everyone seems pretty burned out on it since at least a year. 

I'm actually unsure whether it still sells extremely well or awfully. I feel it could go either way.
It's very hard to tell with LCG's. 

We'll see. There's in any case enough steam to finish another lap given what they planned and then we'll find out what's next. :)

 

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8 hours ago, Bullroarer Took said:

As someone who remembers the core set days and how long it took us to get multiple viable archetypes I completely agree with Sea.

I also play from day 1, and I am a bit torn on the issue. I am glad we have many more cards to choose from, many more archetypes. But at the same time I agree some of the cycles are nowehere as exciting as they used to be. And with the strong decks, the old are not as exciting either. But I really think they nailed it with the Saga quests. An according to the polls, it seems many people agree.

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Frodo would be a fit in leadership or lore.  But not tactics.  I think pairing Gollum with Sam would also be appropriate.

29 player cards is an odd number since it isn't divisible by three.  But if there's only one ring, that would leave 28 players cards, also not divisible by three.  This shouldn't include the heroes, since they're called out separately -- the wilds announcement said two heroes and 39 player cards, and we got 13 distinct player cards (three copies of each), one neutral and three in each sphere.  But it's also an extremely *low* count for a Deluxe, since APs routinely come with 27 player cards plus a hero.  At 156 cards it exactly matches Wilds of Rhovanion, so the total card count matches.

The ring lets you pull a Master card in hand -- are the Master cards 3x, and how many different Master cards are there?  The one we see is clearly modelled on Black Rider Frodo, so I'll guess there's four Master cards.  If they were 3x, that plus a single ring would account for 13 player cards, leaving only 16 player cards for non-ring related cards -- making this deluxe *much* less useful than an AP for those who aren't interested in playing the ring (and still not a multiple of three).

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Yeah I'm guessing 2× 2 Master cards and then 8×3 player cards this is certainly a low numbering for a deluxe expansion, but if the scenarios are that good I don't care! Plus Faramir is likely going to be very good if they want to make him rival his leadership ally card.

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I think that that just looking at how fast reprints go and how out of stock things are that FFG would be crazy to end it.

That being said, for theory-crafting sake I do recognize some of the language and the locations sounds a bit final so I'll offer some alternative thoughts to just business as usual new cycles:

-They could be launching a new campaign set paralleling the books timeline

-They could be launching a new campaign set in the fourth age.

-they could be relaunching nightmare/saga -style campaign packs to upgrade each cycle similar to AH's packs that revisit old missions.

-They are actually insane and don't like money and want to put effort into Journey's in Middle earth or the digital version (which why is this not on IOS???)

Anyways I would be cool with any of th first three options, but not as much with the last. Only time will tell

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For the non-hero player card loadout, to hit 29 I'm placing my bet on: 1 One Ring, 1 Contract, 9x3 other player cards. Which would indeed be low for a deluxe, but hey, the Ring lies heavy, no?

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30 minutes ago, sappidus said:

For the non-hero player card loadout, to hit 29 I'm placing my bet on: 1 One Ring, 1 Contract, 9x3 other player cards. Which would indeed be low for a deluxe, but hey, the Ring lies heavy, no?

As pointed out, there usually has been 13 cards in a deluxe pack, with 3 copies of each.

So might it make more sense to say 5 unique cards + 8x3 (two from each sphere) = 13 different cards? Yours does include the neutral card, though, but I wonder if that will have 3 copies of it too.

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The accountant in me wants to know this answer.  Hopefully the next article will address more player cards.  So excited for the next cycle, and Gundabad comes out today. 

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38 minutes ago, player3351457 said:

So might it make more sense to say 5 unique cards + 8x3 (two from each sphere) = 13 different cards? Yours does include the neutral card, though, but I wonder if that will have 3 copies of it too.

If the Master Ring comes as a 1x, I see two main possibilities:

  1. There is a deck building restriction not printed on the card that limits it to one per deck—e.g., a blanket limit on Master cards. I dunno, a single use of super-Eleanor for –5 threat elimination level, and increased susceptibility to straight-up losing doesn't seem worth it to me. (Thematic? lol)
  2. There is no such restriction, and we'd have to buy multiple copies of the box to get the 3x you can put into a single deck. As far as I recall, outside of the Cores and the Collector's Edition, no product has called for that. Is that correct?

Since I don't think either of those is palatable, I believe Master Ring will be 3x.

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6 minutes ago, dalestephenson said:

I think it's possible that individual master cards are unique, but there's a set of them (four for the different Frodo versions) . You'd choose one to be in hand, and the others (if you want them) would be in your deck.

Ah, that's an interesting possibility. But the other Fellowship Frodo abilities always felt underwhelming to me. Hmm.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, sappidus said:

If the Master Ring comes as a 1x, I see two main possibilities:

  1. There is a deck building restriction not printed on the card that limits it to one per deck—e.g., a blanket limit on Master cards. I dunno, a single use of super-Eleanor for –5 threat elimination level, and increased susceptibility to straight-up losing doesn't seem worth it to me. (Thematic? lol)
  2. There is no such restriction, and we'd have to buy multiple copies of the box to get the 3x you can put into a single deck. As far as I recall, outside of the Cores and the Collector's Edition, no product has called for that. Is that correct?

Since I don't think either of those is palatable, I believe Master Ring will be 3x.

If it's both a setup mechanic and unique, why would you need more than one copy?

Edit: it also says that if it leaves play, the players lose, so you can't even get a chance to lose it and then put another copy back in play.

Edited by player3351457
Another thought

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, dalestephenson said:

Frodo would be a fit in leadership or lore.  But not tactics.  I think pairing Gollum with Sam would also be appropriate.

29 player cards is an odd number since it isn't divisible by three.  But if there's only one ring, that would leave 28 players cards, also not divisible by three.  This shouldn't include the heroes, since they're called out separately -- the wilds announcement said two heroes and 39 player cards, and we got 13 distinct player cards (three copies of each), one neutral and three in each sphere.  But it's also an extremely *low* count for a Deluxe, since APs routinely come with 27 player cards plus a hero.  At 156 cards it exactly matches Wilds of Rhovanion, so the total card count matches.

The ring lets you pull a Master card in hand -- are the Master cards 3x, and how many different Master cards are there?  The one we see is clearly modelled on Black Rider Frodo, so I'll guess there's four Master cards.  If they were 3x, that plus a single ring would account for 13 player cards, leaving only 16 player cards for non-ring related cards -- making this deluxe *much* less useful than an AP for those who aren't interested in playing the ring (and still not a multiple of three).

Thanks for the analysis. I hate at this point that we are getting so few player cards and then one of them is actually Derufin who seems very underwhelming (though I still hope to be proven wrong on that one, and I really like the art).

Edited by lleimmoen

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9 minutes ago, player3351457 said:

If it's both a setup mechanic and unique, why would you need more than one copy?

Edit: it also says that if it leaves play, the players lose, so you can't even get a chance to lose it and then put another copy back in play.

Are you perhaps conflating the One Ring, the Setup attachment; and The Master Ring, the event?

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I would hope we get a leadership hobbit, and of course Frodo makes the most sense.

Spirit: Pippin, Merry, Fatty, Frodo

Tactics: Tom, Merry, Bilbo

Lore: Pippin, Bilbo, Folco

Leadership: Sam

I mean, come on...

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1 minute ago, sappidus said:

Are you perhaps conflating the One Ring, the Setup attachment; and The Master Ring, the event?

I most certainly am. Your analysis looks right on the money then. 

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Yes, there is a several good Hobbit-theme or Hobbit-compatible cards in Leadership, so I would love to see a 2nd option in Leadership as well. Wanting Leadership Frodo as the 2nd hero in the box, and with the One Ring being included and that Master event which is Frodo-Gollum theme, I'm really hopeful.

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3 hours ago, sappidus said:

Ah, that's an interesting possibility. But the other Fellowship Frodo abilities always felt underwhelming to me. Hmm.

To me also except the one from the Black Riders; that effects saved our game so many times. The Master Ring does a similar thing without the need of reshufling, which is great, but the fact it is only an event makes it a lot less powerful.

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I also have the suspicion that this will be the last cycle.

Is anyone else a bit bummed that it looks like once again Gondor will get the most support (as it appears). They already have far and away the most allies. I hope for the rest of the cycle the other tribes (especially my Noldor and Silvans) get some more love…

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AFAIK they haven't hinted at any more saga boxes, though I've hoped for them.  But they also haven't hinted this cycle is the last cycle.

I'm not convinced this cycle will actually enter Mordor; it seems a waste to try to cram in Rhun *and* Mordor in the same cycle.  And I don't think the "Vengence of Mordor", to the extent it makes sense at all (we don't know of anything Easterlings did to offend Sauron) would take place *in* Mordor.  The flavor text says the deluxe takes place in "the lands of Rhûn that rest in the shadow of Sauron’s domain."   That's a bit fanciful for the River Running, Dorwinion, and the Hills of Rhun (just southwest of the lake).  While that does leave us reasonably close to Mordor, you'd have to go further east to get around the Ash Mountains, at which point you could just as easily go east instead of south-then-west.  Why not explore Rhun?  It's a vast space with varied races of men, kingdoms of elves, the home of a number of dwarven kindreds, and the stomping groups of at least one and possibly both blue wizards.  So much potential.

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1 hour ago, Felswrath said:

Weren't we told somewhere that there would be more saga boxes? I could see this being the last cycle, but I don't think that necessarily means the end of the game.

Perhaps they will revisit old cycles and turn them into campaigns with boxes and new cards, a la Arkham Horror TCG's "Return to" product line?

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3 minutes ago, dalestephenson said:

AFAIK they haven't hinted at any more saga boxes, though I've hoped for them.  But they also haven't hinted this cycle is the last cycle.

I'm not convinced this cycle will actually enter Mordor; it seems a waste to try to cram in Rhun *and* Mordor in the same cycle.  And I don't think the "Vengence of Mordor", to the extent it makes sense at all (we don't know of anything Easterlings did to offend Sauron) would take place *in* Mordor.  The flavor text says the deluxe takes place in "the lands of Rhûn that rest in the shadow of Sauron’s domain."   That's a bit fanciful for the River Running, Dorwinion, and the Hills of Rhun (just southwest of the lake).  While that does leave us reasonably close to Mordor, you'd have to go further east to get around the Ash Mountains, at which point you could just as easily go east instead of south-then-west.  Why not explore Rhun?  It's a vast space with varied races of men, kingdoms of elves, the home of a number of dwarven kindreds, and the stomping groups of at least one and possibly both blue wizards.  So much potential.

Certainly hope you're right!

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