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The Winds of Magic...kinna pricey?

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I don't think myself as being too cheap. I certainly didn't mind the price for the main set nor the GM kit or the Gathering Storm. But $49.95 (on the product description page) for spell cards, some rules on Corruption and an adventure? I mean, really? That's almost 50 bucks (half the price of the core set) for just cards for wizards and not priests. Had it been for both I'd probably not even blinked but 50 bucks??!!! If other sets will be sticking with amount then it's going to be one pricey rpg fellas.

 

To tell you the truth, I'd rather pay another 100 bucks for another box set for the following:

1. Rules on travel, either by horse or sea vessels. I REALLY like how rules light the system is but I think it would be cool to have some rules to do jousting tournaments and naval combats.

2. What happens past Rank 3? If nothing different fine, but we'll need a different kind of characters sheet.

3. Professions like knights, squires, pirates and other careers for the previous editions.

4. Rank 4+ spell cards for Wizards and Priests.

5. Rest of the monsters. Maybe printed out on cards about the size of the party sheets.

 

I finished running my group through the two adventures a couple of weeks ago and everyone enjoyed it so I'm not trying to knock FFG nor the system, it's just a concern I have.

 


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So far, they have been pretty consistent in their pricing. With a price tag like that, I'd be inclined to wonder what's in it! Being optimistic, I would think that a $50 price tag would include a lot of bang for the buck. So far I've been very happy with the releases and the value associated with them. If this product follows suit, then there will be some good stuff in the box.

I'll always be an early adopter. If you're hesitant, wait till people like me get the box and we'll let you know the extent of the value :)

 

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Not again!! People, get over it! FFG (or any company for that matter) can't just print and release what somebody wants specifically - they release stuff that will sell well to the masses. So it doesn't really matter if a vocal minority on the forums demands elven magic or bestiary or rank X careers. I don't like everything they put out but I like most of it and am glad to get it all on day one (once it gets to the UK, that is).

When you miss a rule for something just houserule it. If a box doesn't have enough content for you to buy it - skip it. Rules for travelling? Open up wikipedia and see what's the average speed of a normal horse, of a sail ship, of a carriage, etc. Need a certain monster that's not in the current bestiary? See what you can learn about it from the fluff and make up the stats and feats - it's not rocket science!

If they price a product higher than the rest, then surely it's got more stuff in the box. And don't forget that the actual prices are almost half of what you see listed here. Then again if it's still pricey and you want it - have the price split between you and a few of the players in your party.

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WFRP 3 is a fairly expensive rpg compared to many other rpgs. You do get a lot of stuff however and as such I think the price is fair. The price for the GM kit and the Adv. kit was fair so I am sure the winds of magic will have lots of nice stuff.

But I'd rather play the price for WFRP 3, than keep playing 2nd ed. or something completely different.

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I think I will wait for reviews on the product, I waited to see how the GM kit and Gathering Storm was and I decided I'll get them. Thus far I've liked the quality of the products and didn't mind the pricing too much. It just seemed to me that $49.95 was a leap forward to what seems at this time, not a lot of content. But then again we'll see.

I know it's not that hard to wing a house rule for this system but it just would be nice to have some official rules. I'm also not the only one that's brought up what happens past Rank 3.

 

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The price on this game is, regrettably, is the end of this game for me.

I don't fault FFG for wanting to make a buck. And, if I really wanted to, I could buy every  bit. I mean lets face it, $50 every few months is not a huge deal.

 I just can't justify a game that is gonna cost as much as this one does, when it is all said and done. I just don't see it as worth it.

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 Look at it like this, most of us will spend 30 or 50 bucks on say, one trip to the cinema, tickets, petrol, candy, drinks and a meal afterwards, if you make it for two then its more like 75, something like this gives everyone around the table a kick. That said, hell yes these expansions are pricy, storm has about 60 pages in it, another 10 if you rolled all the stats on the cards into it so had it been a regular rpg you would be facing maybe a 70 or 80 page softcover book for 25 pounds, thats pricy, but you pay for what your getting, standups, cards, more cards and so on, looking forward to seeing the magic box in action.

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Parzival said:

The price on this game is, regrettably, is the end of this game for me.
You're talking about the price of the core set now, right?  Cuz... otherwise I'm confused.

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The value is not horribe, but as others have said this is one of the most expensive RPG's on the market by quite a large margin.  You are basically forced to purchase a ton of components which are really not needed to play since we are being shoved a ton of cardboard our way, and boxes.  It's a very nice quality product, but many are not going to be able to keep up with the game with so much stuff needed for it, and each time needing to buy a box of stuff.  As noted this set is $50 for more options for a single player at the table.

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Total cost. As in once the game is fully released (if ever) .

As I said, I can afford the parts (with ease), but when you begin to add  the individual parts up, it becomes the most expensive RPG I know of. Core + ATK+GMTK+WoM+?+?+?= wellll....a sizeable chunk of change.

Now I don't blame FFG for charging what they can, and I find the game fairly enjoyable, but in the end, what it amounts to is, I am not willing to spend more on it.

Again, I like the game. And FFG can charge what they want for it. But I have made my choice, and that is to spend my gaming $'s else where.

Who knows, maybe after a while, I'll take another look at it.

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Parzival said:

Total cost. As in once the game is fully released (if ever) .
Well... that's a fair point, but in my opinion, it's a strange way of looking at an RPG.  I mean, add up the total cost of all the D&D4e books that have been released so far, and you're going to get a pretty huge number too.  And sometimes they're going to release expansions that won't be of interest to you, and then there's no reason to buy them.  But of course, it's everyone's personal choice where to spend their entertainment money, so if you don't feel it's worth it, then obviously you'd want to skip it.

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I rearely buy any more then is need to play a game- For example if I were of a mind to play D&D4E (which, BTW has 0 appeal to me) I'd buy the 3 core books and be done with it. - Every other book beyound those  are strictly  optional.

The thing of it with V3 is not set up that way. that is by design. I don't think anyone would argue that the core set is "complete". Not with a straight face, any way...

 

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I'm not sure why a magic expansion that covers spellcasting for humans, as well as chaos casting (and wasn't there something else) and mutation rules even if they don't have a single caster in the party isn't useful. I'm dying for more NPC-based spellcasting options. 

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fnord3125 said:

Parzival said:

Total cost. As in once the game is fully released (if ever) .

Well... that's a fair point, but in my opinion, it's a strange way of looking at an RPG.  I mean, add up the total cost of all the D&D4e books that have been released so far, and you're going to get a pretty huge number too.  And sometimes they're going to release expansions that won't be of interest to you, and then there's no reason to buy them.  But of course, it's everyone's personal choice where to spend their entertainment money, so if you don't feel it's worth it, then obviously you'd want to skip it.

 

 

True, but you can play a long campaign with the basic D&D books. Looking at other RPGs, you can usually run a campaign with just the core book, which usually comes to around £20-£35 pounds. That's less than just the core set for WFRP3, and that's not a complete game by the standards of other RPG core sets. Expansions don't count to everything, but there's a big difference between 'expansion that adds another playable race' and 'expansion that gives you the rest of the stuff you need to run to high rank characters' - you NEED to buy the latter type if you want to play extended campaigns

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Parzival said:

The thing of it with V3 is not set up that way. that is by design. I don't think anyone would argue that the core set is "complete". Not with a straight face, any way...
I can.

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Good for you, enjoy it.

Obviously you and I differ in what we want/expect from the game.

And, yeah you could argue that I could just either fill in the parts of this edition, that I feel are missing. Or, convert material from the pervious editions. To which I say "A game that asking me to pay this amount, shouldn't require me to fill in the gaps".

 

Again. I do lik e the game. I just am not willing to pay that much for the whole thing, nor do I want to "Work" to make it do what I want. there are plenty of other RPGS out there. So, have fun and "See ya".

 

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I think it is highly possible to play different careers in 3rd ed as long as you want, but not so much as a wizard or priest. I didn't mind buying the core set like I've said but I'm not going to ask anyone to pony up some cash to play a Wizard since we only have one in our group.

Sure, I'll buy the cards at a discount, most likely from Noble Knight since that's where I get most my stuff but unless you buy from Amazon, you're not getting a massive discount.

I don't think I'm a minority either thinking that this stuff probably should have been in the core set. Or atleast the rest of these rules should have been in a core set 2 box rather than slowly parceling out over time and ultimately paying far more than the core box goes for.

I'm not trying to be pissy or start a flame war, it's just a concern I have.

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Parzival said:

I don't think anyone would argue that the core set is "complete". Not with a straight face, any way...

 

OK, I'll bite. I think the core set is complete. What more do you need? You have the basic componenets, the rule set, and everything needed to get you started. That's all you need from a core ruleset. What is actually missing?

Other colleges/faiths? I've seen posts here already saying the Magic expansion isn't useful as there aren't many spellcasting PC's. You've got 3 of each, use that as a basis. Even in FFG stuck 50 different ones in, someone would still be complaining that the snake god mentioned in the scenario in WFB2 doesn't have it's cards yet.

Higher advancement? We got loads of careers, design some more yourself. Or slow down advancement so this doesn't become an issue. One of my personal bugbears is that modern games encourage too much advancement meaning the game becomes a game of levelling your character, rather than just playing him. Compulsory Traveller campaigns for all!

After the core set, all expansions are optional modular add-ons. Are there really going to be people who have been playing this game and enjoying it, but will stop playing the game because an expansion has come out that they are not going to buy and therefore ruined the game for them?

Bugger: Hadn't seen page 2 of this thread when I wrote this, sorry. I see the point has already been discussed :(

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Regarding new careers - one thing that all the whiny people here seem to miss is how easy it actually is to create a new career!

What's a career in this system? Title; 4 traits; 2 characteristics; a few skills; stance; 7 values for advance limits; 2 talent slots; one specific skill; lots of fluff. So how many hours do you need to make up one of these, or better yet - to tweak an existing one? There's no chance of balance issues with whatever you come up with.

So for exapmle, you've finished the intermediate priest career. Go ahead and make the advanced one yourself - it would take you less than a minute!! Just look at the beginner and intermediate priest careers - the difference is one word (in traits) and two numbers (in advances)!

Want an entirely new career? Pistolier, Greatsword, Piker, Page, Knight, Cook, Plumber.... Find a similar one among the 40 you already got, rename it and you're done.

p.s. Quitting a game you like (and have) just because an upcoming product (which you obviously don't even want) seems pricey to you? Really? No comment.

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Also keep in mind that the core set etc are designed to support a group of 3-4 players.  Call it three players + a GM.  A full set of just the three core books for the GM and *just* the players' handbook for the players, for 4E D&D, will cost $210 dollars US.  Realistically this price is a lot higher, because most players will pick up all three books, not to mention Wizards' very successful marketing of D&D 3E and 4E as a "collectible book game," but that serves as a pretty fair price point for a small gaming group to buy in to the game.

So by comparison, the buy in for WH3E right now (assuming you feel the need to buy everything except the Gathering Storm, which is specifically a campaign pack), is $100 (Core set) + $30 (Adventurer's Toolkit) + $30 (GM's Toolkit) + $50 (Winds of Magic) = $210 US.

Incidentally the minimum buy-ins for both games comes out to $100 for WH3E (just the Core set) and $105 for 4E D&D (set of Player's Handbook, DM's Guide, and Monster Manual), and the WH3E Core includes plenty of extras you'd have to pay extra for in D&D, like tokens to represent PCs and NPCs.

For simplicity's sake I have used the prices listed on both companies' sites for reference.

Oh look, the prices are comparable.  Yet one company is getting flak for their prices and the other isn't.  Odd, that.

 

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You're right Iffo, you could make up new careers. Yet making up that intermediate priest isn't going to get you far without spell cards. Plus you'll need to balance those career talent cards or reuse one from another career.

The core set is somewhat like the old basic set in D&D since it has info up to Rank 3. Sure it's possible to go past that but your spellcasters get gimped. All I want to see is the "advanced" set. I think I read somewhere that core materials sell better than supplements. From what I understand the core sets sold like hotcakes so why not do so again? At this point I highly doubt this will happen but it just makes more sense to me.

Most of our gaming group bought into 4th ed and now most of those books are at used game stores. We didn't care for how it played but we all certainly enjoy Warhammer. However, D&D's core set is all you needed for high levels plus spells. At roughly the same price you got all you need versus a "basic" set. So I don't view the Winds of Magic as a supplement, but a core item. I understand FFG is a business and the cards shouldn't be free, I just think maybe more reasonable like $39.

 

 

 

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