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SpiderMana

ARC Article - Hammer the Opposition

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4 minutes ago, SpiderMana said:

swz33_7th-fleet-upgrade.png

Not pocket or rocket... Not sure how useful I see this guy being. Depends on points, I guess.

+1 dice that doesn't require TL, the trigger condition is an already desirable condition (focus fire), works out the rear, and has a built in reload. Would prob see play at 4pts.

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5 minutes ago, SpiderMana said:

swz33_7th-fleet-upgrade.png

Not pocket or rocket... Not sure how useful I see this guy being. Depends on points, I guess.

I can see it being quite nasty. 

Firstly, provided it's cheap, it's a one-use extra attack die that any attacker can use (though since it's primary-locked you'll get the most bang for your buck with someone who's already got at least 3 dice). More importantly, with two arcs, the ARC-170 can cover a fair amount of the board with support, and whilst disarming it may waste an attack, it's still able to do other things; for example, an R2 Astromech is two bonus shields that you need to disarm yourself to recover.....Seventh Fleet Gunner means your offensive output is still there whilst you do, it's just channelled through your wingmen. Plus, if you've got a trio of ARC-170s, one ARC-170 giving up a 2-dice tail gun to turn another ship's tail gun into a 3-dice attack is a pretty fair deal, especially against an agility 3 target, and especially with the ability of some of the named pilots to support one another in line abreast.

 

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6 minutes ago, Max Teranous said:

You don't even give up the shot in the same turn - so the alpha strike is real. You just have to take a disarm later in the game if you want to reuse it, but there's often a dead turn where that's viable.

Less often when you have a buttgun though.

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2 minutes ago, Max Teranous said:

You don't even give up the shot in the same turn - so the alpha strike is real. You just have to take a disarm later in the game if you want to reuse it, but there's often a dead turn where that's viable.

The system phase trigger and dual arcs will make this more rarely used than a normal reload which is already pretty rare (except on the gunboat ocf). But still, a little gravy never hurts

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5 minutes ago, thespaceinvader said:

Less often when you have a buttgun though.

^ But yeah, being able to power up a couple of attacks for an alpha strike of sorts would definitely be worth missing a butt-shot later to recharge.

I doubt it, but if points allow I’d be very interested to try 4x i2 generics with these guys. Dedicated too, if points allowed for it.

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11 minutes ago, prauxim said:

The system phase trigger and dual arcs will make this more rarely used than a normal reload which is already pretty rare (except on the gunboat ocf).

Agreed. Which is why I mentioned R2 Astromechs - if you're going to miss out on shooting for a turn, it's probably more tempting the more stuff you can achieve without shooting. 

Giving up a shot in general in return for a boost in some future turn is not very tempting. Having the damaged ship give up a shot to recover its shields and still boost its intact wingmen's firepower that turn (since the charge comes back in the system phase and can be used 'immediately') is a lot more appealing.

 

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7 minutes ago, Magnus Grendel said:

Giving up a shot in general in return for a boost in some future turn is not very tempting. Having the damaged ship give up a shot to recover its shields and still boost its intact wingmen's firepower that turn (since the charge comes back in the system phase and can be used 'immediately') is a lot more appealing.

Yeah but R2 isn't that good on low agi/high hp ships. You'd have to do it 2x to even have a defensive advantage over just taking SU at the same price. If both of those cost you a 2die attack, I don't think you've gained anything.

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38 minutes ago, prauxim said:

Yeah but R2 isn't that good on low agi/high hp ships. You'd have to do it 2x to even have a defensive advantage over just taking SU at the same price. If both of those cost you a 2die attack, I don't think you've gained anything.

Depends on the build and how you fly it.

Sinker, Tactical Scrambler, 7th Fleet Gunner, and R2 with Dedicated or Intimidation? Get all up in there like a nose tackle and take up space and let your linebackers clean it up. 

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7th gunner card is gonna be all about cost. 2pts and its spammed and we see 3 or 4 ships all tossing 4 dice. 3 or 4pts and I think that is the sweet spot it will see play, and control the spam.

It's a very powerful card. Jedi not taking the title get 4 dice at range 1.  Jag gets fre locks, so 4 dice full mod shots with him will be nice. Jag + Sinker + Anakin/Obi combo should be sweet.

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1 hour ago, Frimmel said:

Depends on the build and how you fly it.

Sinker, Tactical Scrambler, 7th Fleet Gunner, and R2 with Dedicated or Intimidation? Get all up in there like a nose tackle and take up space and let your linebackers clean it up. 

Meh. No amount of flying changes how weak regen is on low agi / high hp ships.

I you are fully decided to aggressively take the disarm/reload, then yeah you take R2, but the overall opportunity costs of that strategy don't seem worth the benefit.

I like the idea of multiple copies of 7th as cost efficient (assuming 4pt cost) flexible alpha strike, but not investing in the reload/disarm strategy.

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Seeing a lot of people saying how strong 7th Fleet Gunner is (which I agree), but then many say it will end up around 4 pts. If it's that strong by us just seeing it for the first time and not seeing table play, what makes you think it will be that cheap? Sure in general it's a one time use in most games, but so are some munitions that require you to have a lock and those increase attack dice as well. Don't be surprised to see this closer to 7 pts (heh). Granted, I'd welcome it to be a bit lower, but 3-4 is likely a bit too low unless ARC base cost is higher and we already see in the Rebel faction low 50s is already a bit too high for them. 

Edited by RStan

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14 minutes ago, RStan said:

Seeing a lot of people saying how strong 7th Fleet Gunner is (which I agree), but then many say it will end up around 4 pts. If it's that strong by us just seeing it for the first time and not seeing table play, what makes you think it will be that cheap? Sure in general it's a one time use in most games, but so are some munitions that require you to have a lock and those increase attack dice as well. Don't be surprised to see this closer to 7 pts (heh). Granted, I'd welcome it to be a bit lower, but 3-4 is likely a bit too low unless ARC base cost is higher and we already see in the Rebel faction low 50s is already a bit too high for them. 

I started at ptorps/12, cut it in half due to single charge to get 6, then took 2 off for no crit.

But you're probably right, that's undervaluing the lack of TL requirement a bit. Probably 4 is great, 5-6 is good and 7 is still playable/marginal

And I would guess they are intentionally going to make ARC's good somehow, this seems like a good route to accomplish that

Edited by prauxim

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12 minutes ago, RStan said:

Seeing a lot of people saying how strong 7th Fleet Gunner is (which I agree), but then many say it will end up around 4 pts. If it's that strong by us just seeing it for the first time and not seeing table play, what makes you think it will be that cheap? Sure in general it's a one time use in most games, but so are some munitions that require you to have a lock and those increase attack dice as well. Don't be surprised to see this closer to 7 pts (heh). Granted, I'd welcome it to be a bit lower, but 3-4 is likely a bit too low unless ARC base cost is higher and we already see in the Rebel faction low 50s is already a bit too high for them. 

I think I agree with RStan. 7 points sounds more accurate than 4 for these boys, and that would allow the i2 ARC to be a touch cheaper without being able to spam 4 with 7FG.

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51 minutes ago, RStan said:

Seeing a lot of people saying how strong 7th Fleet Gunner is (which I agree), but then many say it will end up around 4 pts. If it's that strong by us just seeing it for the first time and not seeing table play, what makes you think it will be that cheap? Sure in general it's a one time use in most games, but so are some munitions that require you to have a lock and those increase attack dice as well. Don't be surprised to see this closer to 7 pts (heh). Granted, I'd welcome it to be a bit lower, but 3-4 is likely a bit too low unless ARC base cost is higher and we already see in the Rebel faction low 50s is already a bit too high for them. 

It's a better version of Jan Ors's ability... 7 might be too cheap.

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