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Pooleman

Legion outpacing X-Wing

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Query: Is Legion on pace to become more popular than X-Wing in the next year? I know its completely anecdotal but Legion has become more popular at my FLGS than X-Wing. People still play and enjoy X-Wing, but for the most part our players will choose Legion over X-Wing if given the option. In the past 2 weeks alone we’ve had 2 new people stop by to interested in Legion. 

Shameless plug: Come to Wonderland Comics - Putnam, CT every Friday to play X-Wing and Legion. Our group is growing and we would love to have you. Join our Facebook group here: Star Wars X-Wing & Legion @ Wonderland Comics.

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To counter your anecdote in my local area, I haven't been able to get a meetup of legion more than once since release and X-wing meets 3+ times a week regularly. 

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5 minutes ago, Lukez said:

To counter your anecdote in my local area, I haven't been able to get a meetup of legion more than once since release and X-wing meets 3+ times a week regularly. 

Wow. I left my FLGS because 2.0 murdered the community, X-Wing and Legion for some reason.

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Anecdotally, in the Twin Cities area, the only place running Legion consistently is ffg itself. There’s plenty of casual gamers who meet up at homes and what not, but Legion is not outpacing Xwing by any stretch here. I can name at least 5-6 places hosting a 2.0 xwing event every week.

X-wing is always going to be bigger than Legion, because it has a much lower barrier to entry - I can make a viable list for $80 msrp for an xwing player. Can’t do that for Legion... plus there’s the hobbying aspect of assembly and painting that not everyone is ready to do (I wasn’t when I got into xwing a few years ago). 

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I wish this was a problem, IA is still the best game FFG puts out despite all its faults and I could never cobble together  enough consistent players even though everybody has some. Legion is the same way, Lots of people bought in a t the beginning and then disappeared and haven't been seen since

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38 minutes ago, ScummyRebel said:

Anecdotally, in the Twin Cities area, the only place running Legion consistently is ffg itself. There’s plenty of casual gamers who meet up at homes and what not, but Legion is not outpacing Xwing by any stretch here. I can name at least 5-6 places hosting a 2.0 xwing event every week.

X-wing is always going to be bigger than Legion, because it has a much lower barrier to entry - I can make a viable list for $80 msrp for an xwing player. Can’t do that for Legion... plus there’s the hobbying aspect of assembly and painting that not everyone is ready to do (I wasn’t when I got into xwing a few years ago). 

X-Wing is sold in Target for crying out loud. It's almost like comparing us to Monopoly or RISK.

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2 hours ago, Pooleman said:

Shameless plug: Come to Wonderland Comics - Putnam, CT every Friday to play X-Wing and Legion. Our group is growing and we would love to have you. Join our Facebook group here: Star Wars X-Wing & Legion @ Wonderland Comics.

I would totally join you guys but thats over an hour drive for me.  It definitely varies area to area/store to store, Im in central CT, ive been playing since launch weekly with a buddy but we have only seen one other pair of people playing legion once in that time.  I did go to a tourney at the newington table top shop, i was the only local guy and luckily 7-8 others drove up from long island to come to the tournament.  my area is just jam packed with MTG and 40k sadly, every store in my area has a huge following of that, some x wing but hardly any legion (based on my observations)

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8 minutes ago, Zeph01 said:

I would totally join you guys but thats over an hour drive for me.  It definitely varies area to area/store to store, Im in central CT, ive been playing since launch weekly with a buddy but we have only seen one other pair of people playing legion once in that time.  I did go to a tourney at the newington table top shop, i was the only local guy and luckily 7-8 others drove up from long island to come to the tournament.  my area is just jam packed with MTG and 40k sadly, every store in my area has a huge following of that, some x wing but hardly any legion (based on my observations)

 

3 hours ago, Pooleman said:

Query: Is Legion on pace to become more popular than X-Wing in the next year? I know its completely anecdotal but Legion has become more popular at my FLGS than X-Wing. People still play and enjoy X-Wing, but for the most part our players will choose Legion over X-Wing if given the option. In the past 2 weeks alone we’ve had 2 new people stop by to interested in Legion. 

Shameless plug: Come to Wonderland Comics - Putnam, CT every Friday to play X-Wing and Legion. Our group is growing and we would love to have you. Join our Facebook group here: Star Wars X-Wing & Legion @ Wonderland Comics.

As much as I love a roadtrip to the Peabody Museum at Yale and Louie's Lunch... CT is a bit of a haul for a game.

 

48 minutes ago, buckero0 said:

I wish this was a problem, IA is still the best game FFG puts out despite all its faults and I could never cobble together  enough consistent players even though everybody has some. Legion is the same way, Lots of people bought in a t the beginning and then disappeared and haven't been seen since

It's common to all hobbies. People buy any given big boxed game, assemble a bunch of extra stuff, and then never finish painting their army and sell it all off and move away. Very common. Most reenacting recruits who get their kit together immediately fall off the face of the earth too. People like to BUY things. People don't like to DO things.

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3 hours ago, Pooleman said:

Query: Is Legion on pace to become more popular than X-Wing in the next year? I know its completely anecdotal but Legion has become more popular at my FLGS than X-Wing. People still play and enjoy X-Wing, but for the most part our players will choose Legion over X-Wing if given the option. In the past 2 weeks alone we’ve had 2 new people stop by to interested in Legion. 

Shameless plug: Come to Wonderland Comics - Putnam, CT every Friday to play X-Wing and Legion. Our group is growing and we would love to have you. Join our Facebook group here: Star Wars X-Wing & Legion @ Wonderland Comics.

I would, but I'm on the other side of the country. As much as I like legion, that's like a 5 hour flight or several days in a car.

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Posted (edited)
14 minutes ago, Senjius said:

It never ceases to puzzle me how GW stays on top. I glance over the GW aisle in the store now and think "wtf?" instead "cool!" like I used to. The new stuff is just weird looking to me, and has risen in price very quickly compared to inflation. And worse, there's a lot of awesome models competing for my money now. Whereas they used to corner the market on quality and had an unrivaled market compared to lots of cool little companies, prior to internet mail order. Now that I can find any company anywhere, and buy from them... yeah. No way yet another-other Septuimius Segundiazus Andromedon Space Marines kit or yet another-other squad of Bloody Bled Bloodbane Bloodbleeders of Khorne is getting my money. The product line has mostly become an intellectually/artistically inbred self-parody. There's so much great stuff to pick from and GW's stuff has literally outpaced college tuition against inflation. For the unaware, college tuition is the poster child for something which is seen as having increased too quickly compared to other products.

Edited by TauntaunScout

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10 minutes ago, TauntaunScout said:

It's common to all hobbies. People buy any given big boxed game, assemble a bunch of extra stuff, and then never finish painting their army and sell it all off and move away. Very common. Most reenacting recruits who get their kit together immediately fall off the face of the earth too. People like to BUY things. People don't like to DO things.

Oh yeah......for much of my life I found that I could really be into a thing for 6 months or more and then the second I spent a significant amount of money on it I became disinterested.  Then this money pit came along with just the right things to keep me interested......😬

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I can see this on the local level, but not at the larger level. 

I live in a relatively small, rural area. There was a small yet active, more casual, X-Wing community where I am at. Two things happened at the same time that killed X-Wing here. First, 2.0 came and not everyone switched. It wasn't so much a dislike of 2.0 (although there was some of that) and more of a cost. For more casual players, it was just too much. At first this wasn't a big deal, but now there is a mix of 1.0 and 2.0 players. New 2.0 products just sit on the shelf now since 1.0 players can't use it  and not enough games are happening for 2.0 players.

Legion came out very close to when X-Wing 2.0 came out. With a gap in X-Wing product with the wait for 2.0 to release, several X-Wing players switched to Legion. The regular releases for Legion really helped. It is still a smaller gaming group than X-Wing was, but it is easier to get a game of Legion in. It is also easier to schedule a casual game, since for many players it is easier to play Legion at our LGS (even casually ) than it is casually at home just because of space and terrain restraints. Most of the former X-Wing players now prefer Legion over X-Wing. I my son and I both prefer Legion (and I switched to 2.0).

This is most likely more of a result of our smaller gaming community, though. If there was a larger X-Wing player base to begin with that could support a 1.0 and 2.0 group, I don't think X-Wing would be suffering locally. I do think that as time goes on and X-Wing 2.0 becomes the only option available, the X-Wing community will return. It is simply cheaper and the pre-painted ships remove a barrier to play.

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1 hour ago, Zeph01 said:

I would totally join you guys but thats over an hour drive for me.  It definitely varies area to area/store to store, Im in central CT, ive been playing since launch weekly with a buddy but we have only seen one other pair of people playing legion once in that time.  I did go to a tourney at the newington table top shop, i was the only local guy and luckily 7-8 others drove up from long island to come to the tournament.  my area is just jam packed with MTG and 40k sadly, every store in my area has a huge following of that, some x wing but hardly any legion (based on my observations)

I played there fir the CAC tournament last year. I know it a haul for you but we have a great group of guys and people are eager to play. We meet on fridays but sone of the guys have expressed I trest in playing on Saturday or Sunday. If you like join the Facebook page and just stay in touch, you may be able to organize a game. I’m on there a lot organizing and playing “matchmaker”, so to speak. 

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1 hour ago, thepopemobile100 said:

I would, but I'm on the other side of the country. As much as I like legion, that's like a 5 hour flight or several days in a car.

My company is worth the time and expense. 😉

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2 hours ago, TauntaunScout said:

It never ceases to puzzle me how GW stays on top. 

It does not stays on top. It just has recovered the top spot (which until last year, was X-Wing spot).

In quality terms, there is nothing like GW. GW has the best miniatures BY FAR. Legion miniatures are great for me but if you compare them with GW miniatures they lose bad.

You know their miniatures are the best when they can afford to create sea elves with flying sharks, flying giant turtles and octopus familiars to carry the wizard´ s scrolls AND THEY STILL SELL THEM.

I had doubts when they killed Fantasy and develop Age of Sigmar but they are on top again so I suppose it payed off. And 40k always sells well. The frakking space marines are like a drug for kids (and mature people).

Maybe we can send some bothan spies to GW factories and copy the plans for their sculpting machines.

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1 hour ago, Senjius said:

It does not stays on top. It just has recovered the top spot (which until last year, was X-Wing spot).

In quality terms, there is nothing like GW. GW has the best miniatures BY FAR. Legion miniatures are great for me but if you compare them with GW miniatures they lose bad.

You know their miniatures are the best when they can afford to create sea elves with flying sharks, flying giant turtles and octopus familiars to carry the wizard´ s scrolls AND THEY STILL SELL THEM.

I had doubts when they killed Fantasy and develop Age of Sigmar but they are on top again so I suppose it payed off. And 40k always sells well. The frakking space marines are like a drug for kids (and mature people).

Maybe we can send some bothan spies to GW factories and copy the plans for their sculpting machines.

I disagree about them being the best nowadays. There is such a thing as too much of a good thing. I am serious when I say, I think GW's models are too detailed, and I'm tired of the "matrix poses". Overly dynamic posing makes a model fragile, hard to store, hard to game with, etc. They are more detailed, more intricate, better posed... and as a result, WORSE miniatures than what many other people offer now. I liken it to music. The best selling music is not always the best music. I just have no idea who's buying this stuff. The core sets are great but the rest just strikes me as such a lopsided fun-to-dollars conversion, compared to the fun I could convert those dollars to elsewhere, without even talking about other miniatures games.

The detail (like the rest of the line) is getting stale too. They just keep re-sculpting the same stuff, using auto-CAD to cram more of the same things on. If chaos, they may as well slap a virtual banner on it saying "NOW! With 30% MORE spikes and chains!" or if not chaos, "30% MORE scrolls and candles!".

They may be historical but there is nothing in terms of technical quality to set GW apart from Perry Bros. It's entirely different subject matter but the sculpting and casting is the same. And they cost less than a dollar apiece for plastic and go up from there. Compared to GW's which start at $5 apiece and go up. I don't get it.

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Well GW also brought back Necromunda, Blood Bowl, and now the quite accessible Kill Team (not to mention Shadespire)... plastic Sisters even... After over a decade of swearing off the brand they're finally putting out stuff that I want to buy.

X-wing releases for factions I play (the big 3) have virtually stopped so the only money FFG is getting from me is for their relatively slow and if we're being honest softly sculpted and problematic moldline riddled Legion releases.

You can't compete with WoW... And when it comes to 28mm-ish infantry games you can't really compete with GW either.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, GreatMazinkaiser said:

Well GW also brought back Necromunda, Blood Bowl, and now the quite accessible Kill Team (not to mention Shadespire)... plastic Sisters even... After over a decade of swearing off the brand they're finally putting out stuff that I want to buy.

Kill team's interesting! I'm hoping to get that going, I did buy the book. But they do this thing where they keep releasing a skirmish version of 40k, then kill it off for a couple years when a new edition of 40k comes out, then announce "NEW! Never before seen: a Skirmish version of 40k!!!!"

Quote



You can't compete with WoW... And when it comes to 28mm-ish infantry games you can't really compete with GW either.

I don't know about sales, I'm sure no one is currently competing with them for sales. I just know about products. There's a lot of 28mm lines out there which are a far better value than GW's now. I used to spend like 20% more on Warhammer stuff to get a 50% increase in quality. Nowadays it feels more like, you spend 150% more on Warhammer to get a (debatable) 20% increase in quality.

And it's not like you have to be the top in sales to be financially viable. It's still very much a cottage industry with plenty of healthy small companies. I really like the wild stuff Eureka, Antediluvian, and others are doing.

Edited by TauntaunScout

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Senjius said:

It's funny, Im interested in the 40k models due to their nicer sculpts and the larger range of options but for some reason I just can't really understand the gameplay. I've heard a lot people say Kill Team is fun and easy so might give that a shot. But $60 for 10 models is pretty pricey when I realize I can get two units and a commander for Legion for almost the same price depending where Im shopping.

Edited by Jman444

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