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TylerTT

I want to be able to go to a store ask for the Star Wars RPG and they can point me at a single book called the Star Wars RPG

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The two recent generic Star Wars source books have given me hope that perhaps FFG will finally release a single book or product line that lets me run a Star Wars adventure for my friends.

I understand deeply the desire to make separate games about Star Wars. 

In fact I tried to run edge of the empire years before it was released. I told all my freinds I was going to run a fringe crime noir Star Wars game. Set between episode 3 and 4

You know what happened?

i got two jedi, a frenger and a Rebel.

i was trying to make Star Wars a thing it wasn’t and my stupid campaign suffered for my ignorance. The players knew what Star Wars was. A group of characters with diverse backgrounds and motivations coming together and growing through that exposure to each other’s differences.

I enjoyed the edge of the empire starter set but never made the leap to the full game because heck I don’t want to learn three huge games to run something that looks like the Star Wars movies I like. 

 

Fix this.

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Unless FFG plans to either do a second edition or completely revamp things so that it uses the Genesys system (not very likely), odds of getting a single universal corebook are next to non-existent.

While it would be nice, the main problem is just the sheer volume of material that would need to be covered, not only for player-related material, but also regarding the general galaxy info that each book has, as well as adversaries and vehicles.  The larger the book, the higher the price point, and the books as they currently stand are already at the higher end at 60 US$ a pop.  A single book with the same level of visual quality would probably be pushing into the $100 range, and unless it's a special edition catering to die-hard fans or serious collectors, that price point would be a death knell.

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Posted (edited)

That’s a big problem. A Star Wars game should be lighter weight. 

Even at 100 it’s still cheaper then $180. 

It doesn’t need to be a new edition. It can just be an edited down version of the existing game.

Edited by TylerTT

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While early on this was a complaint given by many, I think now it's a moot point. As pointed out, it isn't going to be fixed. It's a little late for that. There are three lines of books with several supplements each. Second, this game has been around long enough there are quite a few sources out there which would allow you to grab the Force & Destiny book and easily run the group you described above.

The only way you are going to get one generic core book would be a re-release of the entire line in a 2nd edition. I don't see that happening for years, perhaps another decade. So, you can either wait for that or simply grab one book and start googling sources to cover the others.

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26 minutes ago, Sturn said:

The only way you are going to get one generic core book would be a re-release of the entire line in a 2nd edition. I don't see that happening for years, perhaps another decade. So, you can either wait for that or simply grab one book and start googling sources to cover the others.

To be fair, the Star Wars RPG line has been in production for over 5 years now, especially if you count the EotE Beta.  It's rare for an RPG to go without updating to a second/newer edition that much past the 5 year mark, with WotC's 4e being a major exception (likely as they were re-assessing in wake of the negative feedback before moving forward with 5e) and Palladium (which is due to Siembieda being stuck in the past and delusional in the belief that the Palladium system is just fine as is despite being decades out of date from what it was written).  Even HERO System has made various tweaks during their edition changes while keeping the fundamental core mechanics largely the same.

As was discussed when the line was starting up, FFG is stuck between a rock and a hard place, as they're going to get flak for either having three separate corebooks as they've done, or go the way of Genesys with one very bare-bones corebook and then requiring the GM/players to either purchase at least one add-on book to play the theme they want or do a whole lot of work homebrewing up the material they'd need for that theme (or hoping that somebody else did the work of writing up the theme and didn't bungle the job).

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28 minutes ago, Donovan Morningfire said:

To be fair, the Star Wars RPG line has been in production for over 5 years now, especially if you count the EotE Beta.  It's rare for an RPG to go without updating to a second/newer edition that much past the 5 year mark, with WotC's 4e being a major exception (likely as they were re-assessing in wake of the negative feedback before moving forward with 5e) and Palladium (which is due to Siembieda being stuck in the past and delusional in the belief that the Palladium system is just fine as is despite being decades out of date from what it was written).  Even HERO System has made various tweaks during their edition changes while keeping the fundamental core mechanics largely the same.

 

Uhm, D&D 4e was one of the shortest RPG line, and definately the shortest D&D line. 3e was in print for 8 years. Pathfinder is only now going to update to a 2e after 10 full years, etc etc. However that said you are not wrong; major RPGs definitely go through newer editions after a couple of years, typically 5 or so. However keep in mind that Star Wars is a major licensed product; we don't now how long FFG has the license as per their original contract with Lucasarts; the Disney takeover happened after their initial contract and who knows if Disney will renew it once its up. Personally I doubt they will.

Another thing to keep in mind is the way FFG has treated its prior licensed RPGs: WFRP 3e & WH40K were both shut down with hardly any warning, and their forums here were purged. The fact that FFG has put out Genesys after popularizing the system with the Star Wars brand and its related supplements, as well as purchased a new license in the form of L5R makes me believe it will not be long before this iteration of Star Wars RPG is shut down as they lose the license.

 

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Updates sure. But what we're speaking of is an entire new line since you would not just be tweaking the rules but adjusting the entire concept of production from 3 lines down to 1. For tweaking comparisons, D&D 3.0 to 3.5 was 3 years. But, D&D from edition to edition on average has been closer to the decade mark, and it's the biggest company in the industry.

Please note that I was on the side of one core book and many supplements from the start. I get the OP's sentiment, but we are on the losing side. We can go back to the original posts and discuss it all again, wait years hoping for a single core book line, or offer methods to play multiple SW genres with only one core book.

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I don't think it's anywhere near that, there's no real difference in the lines, it would be simple to have a master core. However it's the established method of selling books, spread rules out in chunks in the various splats. You sell more books that way.

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They are moving onto the campaign books, and will be focusing on publishing this material for the next year or two.  Then it will be interesting to see where they go from there. 

 

Because at the end of the day it is about making money. If FF can no longer make money off FF Star Wars they will publish and release a 2nd edition.  

They can go the way of shadowrun...

1.Campaigns

2. Allies and adversaries (aka monsters Manuel, which they are doing.)

2a. A beast/monsters book  

3. Star ship book

4.  Weapons (Arsenal books) 

 

3-4 would be compilation books with some new material. 

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On 3/10/2019 at 7:14 AM, TylerTT said:

 In fact I tried to run edge of the empire years before it was released. I told all my freinds I was going to run a fringe crime noir Star Wars game. Set between episode 3 and 4

You know what happened?

i got two jedi, a frenger and a Rebel.

You know, having three different Core Book solve this ''problem''. You want to make a game around the underworld of Star Wars in the Outer Rim? Use Edge of the Empire. You want your story about Force Users? Force And Destiny! How about a good ol' Rebels against the Empire? Age of Rebellion it is!

Rules are the same in all Core books, the only difference is the Careers included and the focus of the background.

I personnally like it this way. I never picked Age of Rebellion and doesn't feel the need to. If my players want to play something that is not included in the Corebook of the type of campaign I want to run, they need to have a very good reason instead of 'just because'.

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On ‎3‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 11:56 AM, alphastryke said:

RPGs: WFRP 3e & WH40K were both shut down with hardly any warning, and their forums here were purged.

While I don't think there's been confirmation, this did happen around the same time FFG started pumping out minis games. 40k and WFB are GW's only consistently money making game/IP, so FFG dropping a competing product on the table would be reason for GW to end things. And per GW's license, when they kill it, it's D-E-D Dead. 

On ‎3‎/‎10‎/‎2019 at 11:56 AM, alphastryke said:

The fact that FFG has put out Genesys after popularizing the system with the Star Wars brand and its related supplements, as well as purchased a new license in the form of L5R makes me believe it will not be long before this iteration of Star Wars RPG is shut down as they lose the license

This is actually super freaking common, and not an indicator of the license as a whole.

The ideal pairing of a Licensed IP to a game company is a HUGE IP to a company that's shown it's go the chops to produce something good, but doesn't have the in-house IP to back up it's skills. FFG has done well, used the License to fund development, and now is rolling with it. No more weird than an aircraft company landing a Military air-tanker contract and then designing a plane that's also good as a cargo or passenger plane too. Heck, WotC used Saga Edition to test-drive some D&D 4e mechanics...

Additionally, this license isn't just for the RPG, it's also the cards, minis, ect. So as long as X-wing, Armada, Legion, Destiny, and so on are also making money, it's no biggy to let the RPG coast on reprints and occasional era books.

If anything the biggest problem is exactly what you see here. Newbies getting intimidated by the 3-core concept and thinking they gotta drop a pile of cash to even start (when they don't).

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On 3/10/2019 at 1:56 PM, alphastryke said:

However keep in mind that Star Wars is a major licensed product; we don't now how long FFG has the license as per their original contract with Lucasarts; the Disney takeover happened after their initial contract and who knows if Disney will renew it once its up. Personally I doubt they will.

I'm pretty sure it's come up for renewal at least once already after Disney.

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Three core books does not solve the problem of my group wanting to play a diverse Star Wars cast. It meant that when edge of the empire dropped no one wanted to play it because it did not have jedi or commanders. 

 

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On 3/10/2019 at 12:56 PM, alphastryke said:

Another thing to keep in mind is the way FFG has treated its prior licensed RPGs: WFRP 3e & WH40K were both shut down with hardly any warning, and their forums here were purged.

FFG and GW had an abrupt divorce, and per the terms of that divorce, FFG was required to stop selling any product under the WH lable. FFG was very transparent about this turn of events. It happened quickly, and in fact FFG still had WH products in their pipeline, which leads me to believe it was not expected. 

 

On 3/10/2019 at 12:56 PM, alphastryke said:

Another thing to keep in mind is the way FFG has treated its prior licensed RPGs: WFRP 3e & WH40K were both shut down with hardly any warning, and their forums here were purged. The fact that FFG has put out Genesys after popularizing the system with the Star Wars brand and its related supplements, as well as purchased a new license in the form of L5R makes me believe it will not be long before this iteration of Star Wars RPG is shut down as they lose the license.

Given the investment into X-wing 2.0, Legion, and the recently announced SSD for Armada, I have a very hard time believing FFG is in any danger of losing their license to print SW games and material. They certainly may stop producing the RPG line if it isn't profitable (and profit on RPGs tends to be very, very thin). My guess is they will continue to produce a source book or two per year, assuming they don't take the plunge and create some sort of SWRPG 2.0. 

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39 minutes ago, TylerTT said:

Three core books does not solve the problem of my group wanting to play a diverse Star Wars cast. It meant that when edge of the empire dropped no one wanted to play it because it did not have jedi or commanders. 

 

Nor would one core book so stripped down of information to be useful, or so huge and expensive to be unmarketable.  That’s the problem FFG had to face. If they want to play characters from all three systems, have different players each get a core book appropriate for that type of characters they want to play. Problem solved. No one says you personally have to have all three books as long as the group as a whole does.

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42 minutes ago, TylerTT said:

Three core books does not solve the problem of my group wanting to play a diverse Star Wars cast. It meant that when edge of the empire dropped no one wanted to play it because it did not have jedi or commanders. 

 

And yet it had the Force Sensitive Exile universal spec to allow for an Obi-Wan or Luke type character as presented in the original movie. A “commander” could be accomplished via roleplay without having to have a career or spec titled Commander.

What, exactly, specifically, prevented them from playing the type of characters they wanted?

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1 hour ago, TylerTT said:

Three core books does not solve the problem of my group wanting to play a diverse Star Wars cast. It meant that when edge of the empire dropped no one wanted to play it because it did not have jedi or commanders. 

 

Not entirely true, but I get the opinion...

Now however? All the force powers and talent trees are available online...all three cores use the exact same rules... There's nothing preventing you from getting the EotE core, the FaD GM kit, DLing the trees, dumping Obligation and just giving them the XP/Credits, and... you've basically got everything you need to go full spectrum on a budget.

 

If you want help, we'll help. If you've come to cry, might I suggest the local pub? The booze is better there.

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On 3/10/2019 at 9:44 PM, TylerTT said:

In fact I tried to run edge of the empire years before it was released. I told all my freinds I was going to run a fringe crime noir Star Wars game. Set between episode 3 and 4

You know what happened?

i got two jedi, a frenger and a Rebel.

A good session 0 fixes all of these issues, no books or FFG involved.

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Posted (edited)

People want what they want. If I say Star Wars people expect that diverse Star Wars cast because that’s what all the good Star Wars movies have. 

Maybe I could get people to buy into crime noir Star Wars, but that’s not what Star Wars is. It’s definitely not the first product you put out there.

After the failed Star Wars campaign seeing edge of the empire announced completely demoralized all my friends a two year wait and two extra core books. We still gave it a shot with the beginners game. But they wanted jedi and we never picked it up again.

 

any how. I really hope they release a paired down alternative core book or box set that represents the typical Star Wars cast.

Edited by TylerTT

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1 hour ago, TylerTT said:

People want what they want. If I say Star Wars people expect that diverse Star Wars cast because that’s what all the good Star Wars movies have. 

Maybe I could get people to buy into crime noir Star Wars, but that’s not what Star Wars is. It’s definitely not the first product you put out there.

After the failed Star Wars campaign seeing edge of the empire announced completely demoralized all my friends a two year wait and two extra core books. We still gave it a shot with the beginners game. But they wanted jedi and we never picked it up again.

 

any how. I really hope they release a paired down alternative core book or box set that represents the typical Star Wars cast.

This would have been much easier with the Genesys model where a career is a very short bit of text and the are no specializations (or talent trees) piling up.  Of course,  that means the edges of the archetypes are all going to be ground down. 

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5 hours ago, TylerTT said:

People want what they want. If I say Star Wars people expect that diverse Star Wars cast because that’s what all the good Star Wars movies have. 

Maybe I could get people to buy into crime noir Star Wars, but that’s not what Star Wars is. It’s definitely not the first product you put out there.

After the failed Star Wars campaign seeing edge of the empire announced completely demoralized all my friends a two year wait and two extra core books. We still gave it a shot with the beginners game. But they wanted jedi and we never picked it up again.

 

any how. I really hope they release a paired down alternative core book or box set that represents the typical Star Wars cast.

I’ll ask again....

What, exactly, specifically, prevented them from playing the type of characters they wanted using the EotE CRB?

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