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Who uses crit tokens?

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3 hours ago, SabineKey said:

May I ask why me saying it helps me is not enough? 

 

2 hours ago, GuacCousteau said:

I really don't get why that isn't enough for you. You don't have to understand the thought process behind it, just accept the result that I find them better reminders than the cards arrayed out in front of me.

It's not the most satisfying answer, but I could probably accept it better if not for the many posts saying, not only that they use it and find it helpful, but that they force (not merely request) other players to do the same; and I figured there would be more of a reason for such strong action.  It sounds like this is the best answer I'll get, so play the way that works for you, but please, be courteous to other players as well.

And I'm sorry for getting so combative about it, but it's just really frustrating to not be able to understand something that every single other player seems to find so obvious.

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59 minutes ago, JJ48 said:

 

It's not the most satisfying answer, but I could probably accept it better if not for the many posts saying, not only that they use it and find it helpful, but that they force (not merely request) other players to do the same; and I figured there would be more of a reason for such strong action.  It sounds like this is the best answer I'll get, so play the way that works for you, but please, be courteous to other players as well.

And I'm sorry for getting so combative about it, but it's just really frustrating to not be able to understand something that every single other player seems to find so obvious.

I guess the best boiled down answer is that it is another failsafe to prevent a game error. If you haven’t had that net and adapted to not use it, then I suppose it can seem redundant. However, many safety features are.

From my experience playing the game, the token is not the only thing standing between players and forgetting a crit, but i’ve seen it be a useful reminder enough times to believe it to be a good thing. Now, personally, I don’t require an opponent to use them. If they feel they’ve got a handle on remembering their crits, have at it. And I’ve seen that work out just fine. But, I’ve also seen that bite some people in the @$$. And depending on the particulars of the game and how bad the forgotten crit screwed it up, I can understand some being more insistent in the token’s use afterwards. Not necessarily agree in all cases, but still understand. 

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I think I tend to not forget crits due to two factors.

  • I use the giant promo deck.
  • I tend to put said giant damage cards along my edge of the game mat.

Obviously the latter doesn't work so well if there's fighting going on along my edge of the board, but I don't tend to have that issue often. In the meantime, the cards themselves are about as obvious as they can be for me.

I don't know, I've at least got the tokens with my stuff now, instead of in 1e/extra card storage, but I still don't think I'm too likely to start using them, at this point.

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2 hours ago, JJ48 said:

 

It's not the most satisfying answer, but I could probably accept it better if not for the many posts saying, not only that they use it and find it helpful, but that they force (not merely request) other players to do the same; and I figured there would be more of a reason for such strong action.  It sounds like this is the best answer I'll get, so play the way that works for you, but please, be courteous to other players as well.

And I'm sorry for getting so combative about it, but it's just really frustrating to not be able to understand something that every single other player seems to find so obvious.

In tournament play we should be expected to use crit reminder tokens, even if they aren't particularly useful for ourselves. Crits and their triggers are the responsibility of both players, and while we might always check the entire board state, our opponent may not necessarily.

So it's a courtesy to our opponent, a guard against human error, and a way to avoid being accused of cheating should we forget a crit and gain an advantage.

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16 hours ago, JJ48 said:

Exactly.  The damage cards are already on the board in plain view to both players.  If people can forget about crits with the actual cards staring them in the face, they will forget about them even with tokens.  I honestly don't understand how they are not considered redundant.

At my local gaming pub, space is at a premium. We often wind up stacking cards or making piles of cards on small fold out tables next to the gaming table. It's super easy to miss a crit card in the mess.

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Different crits also have different timings so you need to remember to check at each possible instance. By having the crit token next to the ship it reminds you every time that that ship is activated/engaged/etc that you need to remember what crit it is.

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9 hours ago, spacebug said:

I do.  Sometimes I still forget the crit though.

Heck.  Don the guy who plays my x-wing HOTAC campaign, even with his cards by his ship, still at times forgets some of his stuff on his ships...

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On 2/13/2019 at 6:13 AM, JJ48 said:

Exactly.  The damage cards are already on the board in plain view to both players.  If people can forget about crits with the actual cards staring them in the face, they will forget about them even with tokens.  I honestly don't understand how they are not considered redundant.

On the other side of the table, upside down, is not in your face.  Sure, if I look it may be obvious there's a crit, but a) I have to actively remember to look, and b) it's not so easy to work out which ship it's actually on.  The token means it's always in our mental map of the game state.

On 2/13/2019 at 5:10 PM, JJ48 said:

It sounds like this is the best answer I'll get, so play the way that works for you, but please, be courteous to other players as well.

The courteous way to play is to always use crit tokens.  It's not just for your benefit - your opponent has a right to expect them to be there, and shouldn't have to ask you to use them.  I'm not having a go at people like you who didn't know about them, but people who do know about them should make sure they use them, and not make an opponent feel bad about asking them to.

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2 hours ago, mazz0 said:

The courteous way to play is to always use crit tokens.  It's not just for your benefit - your opponent has a right to expect them to be there, and shouldn't have to ask you to use them.  I'm not having a go at people like you who didn't know about them, but people who do know about them should make sure they use them, and not make an opponent feel bad about asking them to.

In organized play, maybe.  For casual game nights where nobody uses them, it makes more sense to just go with the flow, unless it gets to be a problem.

Edited by JJ48

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1 hour ago, JJ48 said:

In organized play, maybe.  For casual game nights where nobody uses them, it makes more sense to just go with the flow, unless it gets to be a problem.

Why differentiate though?  It’s surely easier to just use them all the time so it becomes habit, therefore you don’t have to worry about remembering, plus casual players you play with who prefer to play using them don’t feel pressured into not using them because nobody else does.

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16 minutes ago, mazz0 said:

Why differentiate though?  It’s surely easier to just use them all the time so it becomes habit, therefore you don’t have to worry about remembering, plus casual players you play with who prefer to play using them don’t feel pressured into not using them because nobody else does.

Why would I worry about remembering something that is a non-issue for myself and everyone I play with?  If you show up to our game nights and want to ask people to play your way, go ahead.  If someone does that, I've got no problem accommodating them.  For my part, I see no reason to insist that everyone change their play style over an issue that I personally don't really care about, when it's never been an issue before, and doesn't look like it'll be an issue in the future.

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2 hours ago, JJ48 said:

In organized play, maybe.  For casual game nights where nobody uses them, it makes more sense to just go with the flow, unless it gets to be a problem.

This. This is a fine way to play. It's only in tournaments where I find them essential so I now use them all the time; JJ48 doesn't go to those, but still accepts that he'd use them if there was a problem which they could help fix. He's also aware why those of us who advocate using them feel the way we do about them.

So, lay off him folks! He doesn't need to change. "I dunno. Just...fly casual?"

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4 hours ago, JJ48 said:

Why would I worry about remembering something that is a non-issue for myself and everyone I play with?  If you show up to our game nights and want to ask people to play your way, go ahead.  If someone does that, I've got no problem accommodating them.  For my part, I see no reason to insist that everyone change their play style over an issue that I personally don't really care about, when it's never been an issue before, and doesn't look like it'll be an issue in the future.

OK, if your opponent doesn't do it then they're probably not bothered, but if they do I think it would be considerate to do it yourself too, even if they don't ask, as many people find it more comfortable to keep quiet about something that bothers them than to ask somebody else to change their behaviour, which can sound like a rebuke.  I even think there's a risk there are people who would like to use crit tokens themselves but don't do so because that's simply how it's done locally, kind of a mild form of peer pressure.

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