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Quickdraw Swarm

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So fiddling around I came up with the following list. Not a very optimized, Quickdraw. However, as part of a swarm he doesn’t have to be? Simply enough of a threat to other Aces, to allow the swarm to capitalize on the threat QD can present.

TIE/fo Fighter - Epsilon Squadron Cadet - 28
    Epsilon Squadron Cadet - (28)

TIE/fo Fighter - Epsilon Squadron Cadet - 28
    Epsilon Squadron Cadet - (28)

TIE/fo Fighter - Epsilon Squadron Cadet - 28
    Epsilon Squadron Cadet - (28)

TIE/fo Fighter - Epsilon Squadron Cadet - 28
    Epsilon Squadron Cadet - (28)

TIE/fo Fighter - Epsilon Squadron Cadet - 28
    Epsilon Squadron Cadet - (28)

TIE/sf Fighter - •“Quickdraw” - 59
    •“Quickdraw” - Defiant Duelist (45)
        Fanatical (2)
        Fire-Control System (2)
        Special Forces Gunner (10)

Total: 199/200

View in the X-Wing Squad Builder

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21 hours ago, Blademaster72 said:

I've flown this list it's fun, lots of ships it is a swarm. I dont believe many practice against swarms.

It is a proper swarm, noticed most squads hardly go over 4 ships now-a-days. Since this was the best swarm I have seen for 1st order I was inspired, but with out QD :(

“Midnight” — TIE/FO Fighter 44
Fanatical 2
Advanced Optics 4
Ship Total: 50
Half Points: 25 Threshold: 2
   
Commander Malarus — TIE/FO Fighter 41
Fanatical 2
Ship Total: 43
Half Points: 22 Threshold: 2
   
“Scorch” — TIE/FO Fighter 35
Fanatical 2
Ship Total: 37
Half Points: 19 Threshold: 2
   
“Longshot” — TIE/FO Fighter 33
Fanatical 2
Ship Total: 35
Half Points: 18 Threshold: 2
   
“Muse” — TIE/FO Fighter 32
Fanatical 2
Ship Total: 34

Half Points: 17 Threshold: 2

These being the more interesting named FOs I tried to find synergies.

Not sure I like it since its only 5 ships vs your 6, but mods for everyone!

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Tested this vs the following list: 

Wedge: Predator, R4, S-Foils

Red Squad Vet: Elusive, R4, S-Foils

2x Grey Squadron Bomber: Ion Cannon, R4, VTG

A tough matchup actually those bombers could be tough. Managed to catch Wedge early, but the bombers and that RSV/Elusive was annoying tougher than needed. Managed to pull out a victory, QD and 2 Ties were still standing. The VTG ion cannons did do much but often enough to plink a Shield or push a damage through just due to volume of dice it would toss and a swarms nature to need to swing from different angles and unable to get everyone out of the second arc.

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6 ships including "Quickdraw" is pretty impressive given that the biggest First Order swarm you can ever field is 7 ships (6 Epsilons and your choice of Null, Muse, TN-3465 or Lieutenant Rivas). Quickdraw's the obvious first target, but it's almost impossible to eliminate her without giving her at least 2 well-modified attacks, so even if she gets whomped on and killed, she should still get a decent bite out of whoever kills her.

I was wondering about a similar squad with "Avenger" as a flanker.

 

 

Edited by Magnus Grendel

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18 hours ago, Glattyator said:

These being the more interesting named FOs I tried to find synergies.

5 TIE/fo with relatively generous kit works. You can field 6 named ones but they have to be the cheaper ones - you can't realistically get Malarus or Midnight in a 6-ship named swarm (though they'll fit fine with generics). Massed Fanatical has the issue that it only triggers on a shieldless target, and - given free reign - your opponent will concentrate fire on one ship at a time until it's killed.

The best synergy combinations I've seen for the various pilots:

  • Midnight
    • Frankly doesn't really need much to be great. 44 Point bog-basic Midnight is still scarier than his points worth of generic X-wing (scarily it won't even buy you an Initiative 1 Rookie!).
    • Anything which makes you generically more efficient or tougher is good.
    • Fanatical, Advanced Optics, Hull Upgrade (in increasing order of optional expense) makes you better in a head-on pass, whilst Elusive, Pattern Analyser, Afterburners lets Midnight segnor or turn without risking his green dice betraying him whilst stressed.
  • Static
    • Best synergises with a binder. In a box. On a shelf.
    • Omega Ace used to be a bit so-so in 1st edition without Swarm Leader or Opportunist let her generate attacks with more than 2 dice reliably, and Advanced Optics or Targeting Synchroniser to let her generate the requisite focus/lock without outside support. Those upgrades no longer exist (at least in their previous form), meaning getting both tokens on her takes some doing, and with only 2 dice (3 at most) the payoff of triggering it isn't that impressive.
    • If you absolutely must use her, Afterburners are good to get the range 1 attack die bonus, and a Squad Leader elsewhere in the squad.
    • Might have more to recommend her in a squad with Kylo Ren, to reliably trigger I'll Show You The Dark Side
    • The ability to put TN-3465 in a squad kind of undermines her ability since everyone else gets (a weaker version of) it too.
  • Scorch
    • Cheap, high initiative 3-dice attacker.
    • Fanatical is a good call - his need to clear stress means blue moves, which means a pretty predictable head-on pass.
    • Advanced Optics pairs well with the above, and either Hull Upgrade or Electronic Baffle.
    • It's a bit self-destructive, but Electronic Baffle is cheap and works well - fire a 3-dice attack to generate stress, burn your shield to get rid of stress, and trigger Fanatical as a result. Not a desirable outcome, but one which makes using Electronic Baffle much more palatable than it might be on another similar ship.
  • Longshot
    • 3 dice with a primary weapon at long range is better than 2 dice, but it's still far from devastating
    • Probably the second weakest pilot after Static, but at least relatively easy to use and a touch cheaper.
    • Trick Shot is nice - you can lurk in the rocks and lay down supporting fire.
  • Null
    • Targeting Synchroniser is nice with a supporting swarm of TIE/sf, but kind of irrelevant with other TIE/fo.
    • If you want to make him into a surprisingly squirrelly ship, Afterburners are nice. Primed Thrusters also only cost 4 because his 'Initiative of record' is 0. Advanced Optics, alternatively, give him a slightly more reliable attack.
  • Muse
    • At only Initiative 2 with a talent slot and the ability to dump off stress, she's the ideal Squad Leader - only slightly more expensive than AP-5, Hyperspace & D'Qar legal, and a darn sight more manoeuvrable than a sheathipede.
    • I guess Pattern Analyser isn't a bad idea - letting you segnor and still get an action (or segnor and co-ordinate and only be single-stressed).
  • Malarus
    •  I would strongly recommend Elusive. Her ability doesn't pair that well with fanatical (since they both provide the same benefit) but pairs extremely well with Elusive - Elusive plus Evade token plus a charge from her ability makes her stupidly hard to hit and able to play 'head on pass' in a way most ace TIE fighters can't.
  • Lieutenant Rivas
    • Doesn't really need anything. Any squad which stresses/tractors/ionizes/locks the enemy squad means he gets free target locks. For a 2 point surcharge over an Epsilon Cadet, I think that's an amazing deal.
  • TN-3465
    • Don't underestimate her ability. TN-3465 wants to get close because she's a TIE fighter, but once there, she essentially offers super-Ruthless to your entire squad.
    • A Shield Upgrade isn't a bad investment but it's expensive given her agility 3. Frankly I'd just accept she's expendable - she's very good at drawing fire off other members of the squad once your opponent fully understands what she represents.
    • Whilst the first critical is 'free' with her shield token, don't hesitate to dogpile multiple attacks onto her if you're attacking an unshielded low agility target - a critical on a named Y- or B-wing or YT-1300 is almost guaranteed to be worth more than a critical on a 31 point TIE fighter, and you've only got 5 chances in 33 of pulling a direct hit.

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I kinda had a different QD Swarm in mind.  Just a lot of 3-dice attacks.

  • Zeta Squadron Survivor (Special Forces Gunner) 44
  • Zeta Squadron Survivor (Special Forces Gunner) 44
  • Zeta Squadron Survivor (Special Forces Gunner) 44
  • Quickdraw (Fanatical or Trick Shot, Fire Control System, Special Forces Gunner, Afterburners) 65
  • Total 197, bid 3.

I suppose it'd be really easy to swap out those Zetas for some higher-init ship with abilities...

  • Midnight (-) 44
  • Scorch (Fanatical, Advanced Optics, Hull Upgrade) 48
    • I guess Hull Upgrade here could easily be Fanatical/Optics on Midnight...
  • Backdraft (Fire Control System) 43
  • Quickdraw (Fanatical or Trick Shot, Fire Control System, Special Forces Gunner, Afterburners) 65
  • Total 200, bid 0.

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10 minutes ago, theBitterFig said:

I kinda had a different QD Swarm in mind.  Just a lot of 3-dice attacks.

  • Zeta Squadron Survivor (Special Forces Gunner) 44
  • Zeta Squadron Survivor (Special Forces Gunner) 44
  • Zeta Squadron Survivor (Special Forces Gunner) 44
  • Quickdraw (Fanatical or Trick Shot, Fire Control System, Special Forces Gunner, Afterburners) 65
  • Total 197, bid 3.

I suppose it'd be really easy to swap out those Zetas for some higher-init ship with abilities...

  • Midnight (-) 44
  • Scorch (Fanatical, Advanced Optics, Hull Upgrade) 48
    • I guess Hull Upgrade here could easily be Fanatical/Optics on Midnight...
  • Backdraft (Fire Control System) 43
  • Quickdraw (Fanatical or Trick Shot, Fire Control System, Special Forces Gunner, Afterburners) 65
  • Total 200, bid 0.

That’s a more traditional squad as compared to a swarm. I almost want Predator instead of fanatical on QD but again basing that on just 1 outing so far.

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I don't like Fanatical on SFs because once shields are down, they kind of just tend to die. The upgrade works much better on FOs. I've never been a big fan of QD even in 1E. I just do not have good luck with him. He's much cheaper in 2E, but without LWF, those shields can just melt off at times. He's kind of needed though because I6. Honestly, I like QD with Tickshot, Shield Upgrade, and maybe FCS if you can spare the points (of course gunner). I've seen QD too loaded up and people forget he's not the tankier LWF version.

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7 minutes ago, Ronu said:

That’s a more traditional squad as compared to a swarm. I almost want Predator instead of fanatical on QD but again basing that on just 1 outing so far.

Second one is really traditional... I guess I still kinda think of the "four of the same ship" as something resembling a swarm...

Predator on QD makes as much sense as other 2-point talents.  I just have this fascination with Trick Shot.  Being obstructed is going to help lose shields more slowly, as well as rolling an extra unmodified die is going to be better than a single reroll or eye-turn from FCS or Fanatical or Predator.  It'd also be decent on rear attacks, if those happen to come up.

But I also suck at Trick Shot, so there's that.

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6 minutes ago, Jo Jo said:

I don't like Fanatical on SFs because once shields are down, they kind of just tend to die. The upgrade works much better on FOs. I've never been a big fan of QD even in 1E. I just do not have good luck with him. He's much cheaper in 2E, but without LWF, those shields can just melt off at times. He's kind of needed though because I6. Honestly, I like QD with Tickshot, Shield Upgrade, and maybe FCS if you can spare the points (of course gunner). I've seen QD too loaded up and people forget he's not the tankier LWF version.

The thing with Fanatical is that if you have that and FCS, you can evade every turn, and have decent mods.  And it also keeps folks honest w/r/t Quickdraw.  Folks have to commit to actually killing them, rather than letting them escape on a few hull.  At least, that's the plan.  Whether or not it's worth it?  That's part of why I keep being tempted by Trick Shot in list building.

Personally, the upgrades I want most on QD are afterburners or Advanced Sensors.  Maybe it's the wrong plan, but I want to try to leverage Init 6 to not get shot.

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22 hours ago, Glattyator said:

It is a proper swarm, noticed most squads hardly go over 4 ships now-a-days. Since this was the best swarm I have seen for 1st order I was inspired, but with out QD :(

“Midnight” — TIE/FO Fighter 44
Fanatical 2
Advanced Optics 4
Ship Total: 50
Half Points: 25 Threshold: 2
   
Commander Malarus — TIE/FO Fighter 41
Fanatical 2
Ship Total: 43
Half Points: 22 Threshold: 2
   
“Scorch” — TIE/FO Fighter 35
Fanatical 2
Ship Total: 37
Half Points: 19 Threshold: 2
   
“Longshot” — TIE/FO Fighter 33
Fanatical 2
Ship Total: 35
Half Points: 18 Threshold: 2
   
“Muse” — TIE/FO Fighter 32
Fanatical 2
Ship Total: 34

Half Points: 17 Threshold: 2

These being the more interesting named FOs I tried to find synergies.

Not sure I like it since its only 5 ships vs your 6, but mods for everyone!

Yes the fos are good lost of different pilot abilities good dial.

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I've been thinking alot about the tie sf alot for the past month, I think its underrated under used people think it's bad or it's not triple upsilon. Lolol

I was thinking why not bring 4 to next system open instead of what I was gonna bring??? Then I listen to the krayts last night and I'm reminded I can fit 5 zeta squadron sf with a zeta fo for 199pts. All are naked and I have 5 ships that have 2 arms.

I love flying generics and I love flying swarms.

Edited by Blademaster72

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7 hours ago, Blademaster72 said:

I've been thinking alot about the tie sf alot for the past month, I think its underrated under used people think it's bad or it's not triple upsilon. Lolol

I was thinking why not bring 4 to next system open instead of what I was gonna bring??? Then I listen to the krayts last night and I'm reminded I can fit 5 zeta squadron sf with a zeta fo for 199pts. All are naked and I have 5 ships that have 2 arms.

I love flying generics and I love flying swarms.

I'm not sure the S/F is underrated so much as people are just not used to it being an average ship after being well above average in 1.0. 

As for the 4 Zetas and a F/O. That doesn't seem as effective as compared to a true swarm or even a 5 ship swarm. Mainly because the S/F is both just average and not much more durable as the F/O simply based on the Defense Dice. Swarms with 2 dice really want as many shots as possible to make up the difference in total dice. I mean certainly try it out and see what you think. I just think the S/F would need more to separate it from the F/O than just a rear arc to shoot from and a couple extra shields to make up for the 1 less Defense Dice. Otherwise it's just going to run out of fire power too soon to other swarms and 4 ship list with more guns. which is more common in 2.0

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  • Expected attacks to die: TIE/fo with 4 HP and 3 green dice, not willing to use defensive actions vs 3 focused red dice: 3.287
  • Expected attacks to die: TIE/fo with 5 HP and 3 green dice, not willing to use defensive actions vs 3 focused red dice: 4.108
  • Expected attacks to die: TIE/sf with 6 HP and 2 green dice, not willing to use defensive actions vs 3 focused red dice: 3.919

So a TIE/sf without the gunner lasts about as long as a TIE/fo would, if it had an extra HP, and also has a rear arc, for 5 more points than a Zeta FO. To me, that kinda seems... fair?  Not like an amazing ship, but an appropriate level of extra toughness and arc coverage for the price.  Clearly weaker offense per point, however.  The SF without a gunner or missiles is kinda a TIE Bomber, but with a rear arc and some crit resistance.  I guess it's fine, but nothing too special.

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On 2/10/2019 at 6:16 AM, Ronu said:

So fiddling around I came up with the following list. Not a very optimized, Quickdraw. However, as part of a swarm he doesn’t have to be? Simply enough of a threat to other Aces, to allow the swarm to capitalize on the threat QD can present.

TIE/fo Fighter - Epsilon Squadron Cadet - 28 x5
    Epsilon Squadron Cadet - (28)

TIE/sf Fighter - •“Quickdraw” - 59
    •“Quickdraw” - Defiant Duelist (45) + Fanatical (2) + Fire-Control System (2) + Special Forces Gunner (10)

Total: 199/200

View in the X-Wing Squad Builder

I tried out this list and it was fun---the power of swarms is real---but dropping one FO in order to get Advanced Optics on the generics and fleshing QD out a bit more gave it sharper teeth--in my experience anyways.

“Quickdraw” (45)
Elusive (3)
Pattern Analyzer (5)
Special Forces Gunner (10)
Fire-Control System (2)
Shield Upgrade (6)

Epsilon Squadron Cadet (28)
Advanced Optics (4)

Epsilon Squadron Cadet (28)
Advanced Optics (4)

Epsilon Squadron Cadet (28)
Advanced Optics (4)

Epsilon Squadron Cadet (28)
Advanced Optics (4)

Total: 199

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

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first order discord (200)
“Quickdraw” — TIE/SF Fighter    45
Pattern Analyzer    5
Special Forces Gunner    10
Fire-Control System    2
Shield Upgrade    6
Ship Total: 68
     
Omega Squadron Ace — TIE/FO Fighter    31
Fanatical    2
Ship Total: 33
     
Omega Squadron Ace — TIE/FO Fighter    31
Fanatical    2
Ship Total: 33
     
Omega Squadron Ace — TIE/FO Fighter    31
Fanatical    2
Ship Total: 33
     
Omega Squadron Ace — TIE/FO Fighter    31
Fanatical    2
Ship Total: 33
 

you could go with predator instead of FCS on QD if you prefer.

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22 minutes ago, meffo said:

first order discord (200)
“Quickdraw” — TIE/SF Fighter    45
Pattern Analyzer    5
Special Forces Gunner    10
Fire-Control System    2
Shield Upgrade    6
Ship Total: 68
     
Omega Squadron Ace — TIE/FO Fighter    31
Fanatical    2
Ship Total: 33
     
Omega Squadron Ace — TIE/FO Fighter    31
Fanatical    2
Ship Total: 33
     
Omega Squadron Ace — TIE/FO Fighter    31
Fanatical    2
Ship Total: 33
     
Omega Squadron Ace — TIE/FO Fighter    31
Fanatical    2
Ship Total: 33
 

you could go with predator instead of FCS on QD if you prefer.

Similar to an earlier squad. Fanatical doesn’t proc enough to justify that many ships using it. Additionally, I am beginning to wonder if everyone is discounting the effect that 6th ship has on a game. 

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10 minutes ago, Ronu said:

Similar to an earlier squad. Fanatical doesn’t proc enough to justify that many ships using it. Additionally, I am beginning to wonder if everyone is discounting the effect that 6th ship has on a game. 

i think it definitely procs often enough. more ships are generally better though, yes. if it's not your style, don't fly it. i mean, you can always just go with predator on all of them if you like - or replace them all with something cheaper so you get another ship in. i'd definitely rather get pattern analyzer than fcs and fanatical on QD though. so just like this:

Unnamed Squadron (200)
“Quickdraw” — TIE/SF Fighter    45
Pattern Analyzer    5
Special Forces Gunner    10
Ship Total: 60
     
Epsilon Squadron Cadet — TIE/FO Fighter    28
Ship Total: 28
     
Epsilon Squadron Cadet — TIE/FO Fighter    28
Ship Total: 28
     
Epsilon Squadron Cadet — TIE/FO Fighter    28
Ship Total: 28
     
Epsilon Squadron Cadet — TIE/FO Fighter    28
Ship Total: 28
     
Epsilon Squadron Cadet — TIE/FO Fighter    28
Ship Total: 28

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So here's an oddball.

  • Quickdraw (Special Forces Gunner) 55
  • Zeta Squadron Survivor (Advanced Optics) 38
  • Zeta Squadron Survivor (Advanced Optics) 38
  • Zeta Squadron Survivor (Advanced Optics) 38
  • TN-3465 (-) 31

The Zetas have a decent amount of hit points, fairly reliable dice front-and-back with Advanced Optics, and well, 2 arcs.  RZ-2 fans will tell you how good those are.  TN-3465 also amps up the consistency of the dice on the rest of the ships in your squad.  If you manage to get her close when QD loses a shield, that could be painful.

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