Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
xanderf

Sliding (Hangar Bay) Doors...

Recommended Posts

Inspired by a comment in a recent thread, and recent Kimmy Schmidt episode making reference to a dreadful 90s movie...

What if Disney hadn't bought Lucasfilm?  What would the game look like?  Recall that it was in development well before the acquisition, so FFG had almost certainly some back-of-napkin plans for where they were going to take it before...everything changed.  The cutover is roughly 2013, so includes the first six movies, EU as it existed at that point, and 'Clone Wars' CGI TV series

We can make some safe assumptions:

  • No MC75 (obviously), as it was created for 'Rogue One'
  • No Hammerhead corvettes ('Rebels')
  • No VCX-100 (ditto)
  • No Quasar Fire carrier (ditto...ish*)
  • No Gozanti carriers (ditto...ish*)

Some things get fuzzier:

  • The * comments from above - the Quasar Fire DID exist in the EU...as a purely Rebel design.  It was the 'Rebels' TV show that made it Imperial first, so...?maybe it gets into the game after all, as a Rebel-only ship?  It was certainly never associated with the Empire in the EU.  Similarly, the Gozanti-type ships.  Existed in the prequels, so might have come to the game...but in what form?  The old EU favored giving all Old Republic stuff to the Rebels, so....???
  • Spinning off that last observation...the Arquitens and Pelta-class.  Both Republic designs, the Jedi used.  Would non-Disney-Lucasfilm and FFG have decided the Empire got those (as Disney decided)?  Or would the Rebels get them?
  • We can assume more of the EU ships fit into the game, which is nice, as they EU ships are nearly all scaled a lot more friendly for the game than the post-Jedi Disney designs.  AF mk 1, Dreadnought, Nebulon-B2, Ton Falk-class escort carrier, etc

And some outright speculation:

  • Are the Vong a shoe-in, in this reality?  Marketing would love it - you're appealing to the Khorne and Nurgle crowd, here.  The technology is completely incompatible with existing galactic tech, allowing a lot more flexibility in game design space (fewer risks of upgrade combos being 'broken' with previous ships)...
  • More flexibility in post-Jedi content, generally, allowing easier new faction options.  Ssi-Ruuk, Hapans, Imperial Remnant, etc.

Thoughts?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, xanderf said:

We can make some safe assumptions:

  • No Hammerhead corvettes ('Rebels')

For this one it could go the way of your additional comment section, it is based off the design of the Republic vessels in the Knights of The Old Republic series. Now with the FFG having created the Raider specifically for X-Wing (I assume Disney had to give them the go-ahead in order to actually do it), I am sure a pre-Disney acquisition they could of been entertaining the ideas of bringing back old ships/designing new ones. So this may not be out of the realm of possibility either.

To kind of cover your other points, with the way Lucas Arts and Lucas Books was churning out EU content I am sure some of these would of came to fruition regardless, in one manner or another, even if it was one-time Imperial use of previously owned rebel craft i.e. Quasar as you mentioned. It also makes sense that the Imperials would still use a number of the Republic's ships as tie overs until the entire/majority of the Imperial fleet was outfitted with ISDs.

22 minutes ago, xanderf said:

And some outright speculation:

  • Are the Vong a shoe-in, in this reality?  Marketing would love it - you're appealing to the Khorne and Nurgle crowd, here.  The technology is completely incompatible with existing galactic tech, allowing a lot more flexibility in game design space (fewer risks of upgrade combos being 'broken' with previous ships)...
  • More flexibility in post-Jedi content, generally, allowing easier new faction options.  Ssi-Ruuk, Hapans, Imperial Remnant, etc.

I think it could go either way for the Vong in this reality. The Vong suffer from an either you love it or you hate it situation, I haven't seen too many non-polarized opinions on them (just my observations).. We also have to look at who they'd be competing with in terms of an additional faction. The lore for bounty hunters, gangs, criminals, outlaws and scum was fairly large as well. With a large number of ships both recognizable and not, as well as characters to pick and choose from.

Assuming Star Wars had some kind of resurgence comparable to the Disney acquisition, I definitely think we would still be seeing scum for the likes X-Wing, with a strong possibility of Vong being added. I also feel that there'd be a bigger chance for a third GCW/Post GCW faction like your Vong or Scum for Armada...

One other thought in regards to you mentioning the Imperial Remnants. I could see them being added, but in a different sort of way. Not via boxed ships (except for very specific/unique ones) but as cardboard, rule sets, and faction specific cards. With this I could of seen Armada have some faction specific bonuses, not unlike commander abilities, not sure how it would work, but I definitely could see it.

 

Anyway this was a fun topic to read, really makes you wonder. I miss Lucas Arts though, and a lot of the EU lore. I really hope they delve more into it, and bring more back. I want good star wars video games!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Liberator class from the old Rebellion pc game is particularly missed. That was a really interesting design.

Eclipse class as well for imperials.

Likewise, there are lots of fighter designs that could have found a home in the game, TIE Avenger & Droid, Assault Gunboat, Missile boat, K wing.

Id still like to see the Acclamator for the imperials. If FFG reworked the Assault mechanism it could be the perfect vehicle for it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, ISD Avenger said:

Eclipse class as well for imperials.

Heh, yeah - that's a gorgeous ship.  WAY more interesting than the 'TOTALLY NOT A B-2 BOMBER AT ALL NO WHY' ship from the Disney post-Jedi era.

And in some of the re-scaling work that's been done, it's not even particularly ridiculously in size (IE., not that much longer than the Executor-type Super Star Destroyer).  Still - no matter how you scale it...it's a LOOOOOOT more massive, which makes it...sadly unlikely to fit in the game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm guessing the Empire would still have gotten an Escort Carrier type of ship - if they didn't go for the Quasar, they could have just put in the Ton-Falk class instead (in fact, I think it probably would have been more likely they did so - Ton Falk was the "standard" Imperial Escort Carrier from a few of the old games, whereas the Quasar was almost entirely a rebel ship and wasn't even all that widely seen until Rebels).

If the Gozantis weren't the Empire's flotilla ships, I'm guessing they would have been replaced - my choice would have been the old ATR-6 Assault Transports, as those seem to be one of the closest ships in terms of both role and scale from the old EU. They could have used Sentinels as well, but given that those are closer to shuttle size, I'm guessing they would have picked something else. 

We might have seen some more ships from the Rebellion game - the Liberator Cruiser would have been a good swap-out for the MC75. We also might have seen a Star Defender or Bulwark Battlecruiser as the Rebel version of the SSD. I'm guessing Dreadnoughts would be a more likely include, given the outsize role they played in the old EU. Lancer frigates also could have been an interesting add for the Empire as a pure anti-starfighter platform.

Still hoping we might see some of those, honestly.

Edited by darkknight109

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, xanderf said:

Heh, yeah - that's a gorgeous ship.  WAY more interesting than the 'TOTALLY NOT A B-2 BOMBER AT ALL NO WHY' ship from the Disney post-Jedi era.

And in some of the re-scaling work that's been done, it's not even particularly ridiculously in size (IE., not that much longer than the Executor-type Super Star Destroyer).  Still - no matter how you scale it...it's a LOOOOOOT more massive, which makes it...sadly unlikely to fit in the game.

Technically it’s shorter than the Executor I believe but deeper, so it could still work I reckon 👍🏻

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, ISD Avenger said:

Technically it’s shorter than the Executor I believe but deeper, so it could still work I reckon 👍🏻

Depends on how you scale it

Fiypavp.png

Or 

AllShips.gif

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If my memory serves right, Rebels was already in development when Disney bought Lucasfilm. At least they were already thinking about a successor for the Clone Wars for sure.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Interdictor would be in its proper place as:

1) A Star Destroyer, not a cruiser, and 

2) ISD sized and on a large base.

 

7th Fleet title might actually be useful, and you could take the interdictor defensive fleet to the next level.  

 

Totally off topic, I wonder how relevant the Interdictor would be if ECMs were a grav well upgrade instead of a defensive retrofit.  They would probably be called something different, but the mechanic could stay the same.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Darth Sanguis said:

Um.... why though? 
 

Because we only saw them as one of the many dozens of types of freighters that have popped up in the Star Wars universe over the years.

The redesign from the freighter to the fighter-carrier under Imperial colors was quite a change in role - it's fairly unlikely FFG would have come up with that on their own (especially since the Carrack cruiser had roughly the same concept of 'externally rack mounted TIE fighters')

3 hours ago, Norell said:

If my memory serves right, Rebels was already in development when Disney bought Lucasfilm. At least they were already thinking about a successor for the Clone Wars for sure.

That doesn't feel right, no - remember that it was Disney that actually cancelled Clone Wars before it was even finished.  It was supposed to be a proper 7-season story, so they were already thinking about several more years of content.  Disney killed it at season 5, then let them finish up what they were currently working on as a sort of half-season-6.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Jabby said:

Depends on how you scale it

Fiypavp.png

Or 

AllShips.gif

The 2nd image is canon (as much as it can be).

No idea where they get 35000m for Eclipse from in the top image. Dark Empire states 10 miles from front to back for Eclipse. Which is shorter than Executor.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
12 hours ago, Khyros said:

The Interdictor would be in its proper place as:

1) A Star Destroyer, not a cruiser, and 

2) ISD sized and on a large base.

 

Ehhhh...from the West End Games RPGs, which is basically where the Interdictor came from, it always was kind of a LOT smaller than an ISD...

152483128_4.jpg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
10 hours ago, xanderf said:

Ehhhh...from the West End Games RPGs, which is basically where the Interdictor came from, it always was kind of a LOT smaller than an ISD...

152483128_4.jpg

Meanwhile, I've always known it based on the novels and the wiki article.  So I suppose that every time I read about the Interdictor, it could have been one of those baby cruisers, but that doesn't seem anywhere near as difficult to be destroyed as an ISD.

 

https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Interdictor-class_Star_Destroyer/Legends

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Interdictor Star Destroyer is a different ship than the Immobilizer "Interdictor" Cruiser, which is the original interdictor in Star Wars lore. The Interdictor Star Destroyer was probably originally a mistake from an author less caught up on his lore, although I can't say that for certain.

 

As for the Quasar, in Legends, that was never an Imperial ship.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
45 minutes ago, Knightcrawler said:

The Interdictor Star Destroyer is a different ship than the Immobilizer "Interdictor" Cruiser, which is the original interdictor in Star Wars lore. The Interdictor Star Destroyer was probably originally a mistake from an author less caught up on his lore, although I can't say that for certain.

That would be my understanding.  When Star Wars was all but dead in popular culture and Timothy Zahn decided to start writing his Thrawn books and there wasn't anything like a formal story group to provide guidance, he was given the West End Game's RPG books as the 'background of the EU as it exists at this point'.

That's also what LucasArts used as the basis for the ships in their X-Wing, TIE Fighter, and strategic games.

So the 'small' Interdictor is definitely the most prevalent one in the EU.

But the EU was poorly managed, and at some point some author made one of many mistakes and thought it was Star Destroyer sized.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/7/2019 at 6:52 PM, xanderf said:

Inspired by a comment in a recent thread, and recent Kimmy Schmidt episode making reference to a dreadful 90s movie...

What if Disney hadn't bought Lucasfilm?  What would the game look like?  Recall that it was in development well before the acquisition, so FFG had almost certainly some back-of-napkin plans for where they were going to take it before...everything changed.  The cutover is roughly 2013, so includes the first six movies, EU as it existed at that point, and 'Clone Wars' CGI TV series

We can make some safe assumptions:

  • No MC75 (obviously), as it was created for 'Rogue One'
  • No Hammerhead corvettes ('Rebels')
  • No VCX-100 (ditto)
  • No Quasar Fire carrier (ditto...ish*)
  • No Gozanti carriers (ditto...ish*)

Some things get fuzzier:

  • The * comments from above - the Quasar Fire DID exist in the EU...as a purely Rebel design.  It was the 'Rebels' TV show that made it Imperial first, so...?maybe it gets into the game after all, as a Rebel-only ship?  It was certainly never associated with the Empire in the EU.  Similarly, the Gozanti-type ships.  Existed in the prequels, so might have come to the game...but in what form?  The old EU favored giving all Old Republic stuff to the Rebels, so....???
  • Spinning off that last observation...the Arquitens and Pelta-class.  Both Republic designs, the Jedi used.  Would non-Disney-Lucasfilm and FFG have decided the Empire got those (as Disney decided)?  Or would the Rebels get them?
  • We can assume more of the EU ships fit into the game, which is nice, as they EU ships are nearly all scaled a lot more friendly for the game than the post-Jedi Disney designs.  AF mk 1, Dreadnought, Nebulon-B2, Ton Falk-class escort carrier, etc

And some outright speculation:

  • Are the Vong a shoe-in, in this reality?  Marketing would love it - you're appealing to the Khorne and Nurgle crowd, here.  The technology is completely incompatible with existing galactic tech, allowing a lot more flexibility in game design space (fewer risks of upgrade combos being 'broken' with previous ships)...
  • More flexibility in post-Jedi content, generally, allowing easier new faction options.  Ssi-Ruuk, Hapans, Imperial Remnant, etc.

Thoughts?

I'd like to think the Venator, Super Star Destoryer, Arc-Hammer Factory Star Destroyer (Especially with the fact that the HWK is in both Armada and X-Wing) , Lancer Corvette instead of Raider or Gozanti or Arquitens.

Rogue Squadron might have been deployed outside of the campaign as its own expansion, along with a SSD Lusanyka

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
18 hours ago, Wintercross said:

I would have loved to have the Dreadnaught and the Vindicator, the Escort Carriers would have been great too.

We may still yet get the Dreadnought - something very like it appeared in the 'Rebels' finale, and since that team is now working on going back to do a final wrap-up of the Clone Wars, who knows...might show up there.

Escort Carriers were pretty clearly lost in the sliding doors, here - the Quasar Fire just fits their role too closely, and in that ship becoming Imperial (canon) instead of only Rebel (EU), I fear it bumped the Escort Carrier out of its position.

And yeah, the Vindicator-class also seems DOA.  The Interdictor, in canon, is now its own unique design rather than being derivative of a standard warship.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Disney's acquisition of Star Wars and the subsequent EU purge sunk a large amount of established potential content for Armada. It seems to me FFG's only options are to keep everything currently released in circulation until the game is retired or branch out into the other Star Wars Timelines. That's where the "new" content seems to be coming from so far. It's a shame really, I would have liked to have seen that strike cruiser on the table.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Forresto said:

WHAT is that from? It looks awesome!

Huh, never even occurred to me that someone might not have it!

It's from the West End Games Star Wars RPG module 'Imperial Sourcebook'.  Chock full of good stuff, all non-canon at this point - but a lot has been used as sources in newer material.  For instance, the recent 'Rebels' CGI series - the Imperial Security Bureau (ISB) started out, here.

(FWIW this is a supplement for the RPG system that FFG just reprinted the core books for, for its 30th anniversary.  It's mostly obsolete, of course, but interesting to kind of see what most writers were using as their de factor bible for so many decades, and as noted many still attempt to pull things in from it.)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, RedPriest said:

Disney's acquisition of Star Wars and the subsequent EU purge sunk a large amount of established potential content for Armada. It seems to me FFG's only options are to keep everything currently released in circulation until the game is retired or branch out into the other Star Wars Timelines. That's where the "new" content seems to be coming from so far. It's a shame really, I would have liked to have seen that strike cruiser on the table.

I don't think FFG is worried about crossing over to Legends stuff. I don't keep up on what's been "re-canonized" following the Disney purchase, but both Armada and X-Wing have ships from the old canon ported over that I'm pretty sure have not been in any recent material (off the top of my head, this includes TIE Phantoms, E-Wings, Decimators, K-Wings, HWK-290s, and StarVipers) as well as some characters (Maarek Stele, Keyan Farlander, Ryad, Dash Rendar, Xizor, Guri, etc.). They haven't really done that with any capital ships (the only possible exception I can think of are the VSDs - are those still canon?) but I don't see why they couldn't, given that they're clearly alright with going back to old lore for starfighters and upgrades.

Edited by darkknight109

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/9/2019 at 6:41 AM, xanderf said:

Ehhhh...from the West End Games RPGs, which is basically where the Interdictor came from, it always was kind of a LOT smaller than an ISD...

152483128_4.jpg

How beautiful! What a great Armada rooster that would make!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 hours ago, darkknight109 said:

They haven't really done that with any capital ships (the only possible exception I can think of are the VSDs - are those still canon?) but I don't see why they couldn't, given that they're clearly alright with going back to old lore for starfighters and upgrades.

I THINK, the VSD was in the Tarkin novel. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. That's the only new cannon I have read.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×