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Double-Tap Vennie

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Vennie (62)
Trajectory Simulator (10)
Pattern Analyzer (5)
C-3PO (Resistance) (6)
Veteran Turret Gunner (6)
Rey (14)
Seismic Charges (3)

Lieutenant Bastian (48)
M9-G8 (7)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

L’ulo L’ampar (38)
Heroic (1)

Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

 

lots of  mods for Vennie. Bastian locks Vennie on turn1. on engage Vennie brutally assaults someone and deals a damage card. Bastian moves lock and now has full mods. rinse and repeat. 

 

oh and pattern on vennie is fun! my first turn usually looks like this: chuck siesmic with Vennie to destroy whatever rock is gonna be in my way later (usually mid rock that I placed early). reveal stop, use pattern to reload. Bastian locks Vennie. Lulo moves as slow as possible and rolls back.

 

turn 2. turn towards enemy with Vennie.

Turn 3. Throw another bomb, stop, double calc. 

Edited by Wiredin

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14 minutes ago, punkUser said:

A regular printed "front arc attack" is still a primary attack, else how would stuff like predator or crack shot or whatever *ever* work on most ships? The printed bowtie is still a primary attack too, so firing out of either will trigger Paige.

That's just it, there's some dispute on Predator working on the RZ-2. Granted, I think it's a stupid dispute and it's clearly meant to work, but duly noted.

13 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:

Start with the turret arcs aimed to the sides. Attack out the front arc with the front 3 red primary, Paige triggers giving the option to drop a bomb or rotate, rotate so that one of the two turret arc primaries now overlap the front arc, fire from that arc with Vet Turret Gunner, this is still a primary attack so Paige triggers again, rotate the turret arcs back to their original position. Make sense now?

Hmm. Yeah, it does. So basically, if you've got Paige+Vet (I always do, it seemed smart as ****.), you can always double-tap going forward, but allow yourself the chance to shoot to the sides if you need to. Interesting.

Here's a question then. Can I attack out the sides, then with the primary forward arc?

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7 minutes ago, Captain Lackwit said:

That's just it, there's some dispute on Predator working on the RZ-2.

🤨 As long as the RZ-2's Primary is pointed forwards and the target is in the RZ-2's bullseye arc (every ship has a bullseye arc, not every ship has a bullseye arc only weapon) then it works. Outmaneuver doesn't on the RZ-2 since it doesn't have a front arc weapon.

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I’ve been running 4-5s in a lot of iterations, and the next I want to try swaps out a T70 altogether for Vennie:

Ello Asty (56)
Heroic (1)
Integrated S-Foils (0)

L’ulo L’ampar (38)
Heroic (1)

Tallissan Lintra (35)
Heroic (1)

Vennie (62)
Veteran Turret Gunner (6)

Total: 200

View in Yet Another Squad Builder 2.0

I’ve tried all sorts of missiles on the As and nothing satisfies me, so fitting this beef in almost feels like cheating. Again, haven’t set it to table just yet, but I have extensive 4-5 testing and Vennie in the mix looks like a gain.

Tallie support for Vennie allows a potential 3 Evade result on Vennie with Focus. Also add Jamming Beam onto Ello in Extended.

Edited by Skargoth

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I just picked up a third A-Wing tonight and have been trying this out:

RZ-2 A-wing - •L’ulo L’ampar - 39
    •L’ulo L’ampar - Luminous Mentor (38)
        Heroic (1)

MG-100 StarFortress - •Vennie - 88
    •Vennie - Crimson Cutter (62)
        Perceptive Copilot (8)
        Veteran Turret Gunner (6)
        •Paige Tico (7)
        Pattern Analyzer (5)

RZ-2 A-wing - •Tallissan Lintra - 36
    •Tallissan Lintra - Deadly Approach (35)
        Heroic (1)

RZ-2 A-wing - •Zari Bangel - 36
    •Zari Bangel - Aerial Exhibitionist (35)
        Heroic (1)

Total: 199/200

I think Vennie’s ability seems made for the A-wings and their natural turret arcs. I’m running Zari just bumping into Vennie each turn so her ability is almost always on when she’s attacked (and Zari’s ability allows her to still take an action.)

Edited by dadocollin

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This list besides my Rey/Poe list has been the most successful for me. It’s Vennie, Poe Dameron and Tallisan Linstra who’s ability synergizes with Vennie perfectly. I use the Proton Bombs and Proximity Mines to cover my rear while Poe and Tallie cover Vennie flank.

T-70 X-wing - •Poe Dameron - 77
    •Poe Dameron - Trigger-Happy Flyboy (68)
        Heroic (1)
        R4 Astromech (2)
        •Black One (2)
        Integrated S-foils (Open) (0)
        Heavy Laser Cannon (4)

RZ-2 A-wing - •Tallissan Lintra - 37
    •Tallissan Lintra - Deadly Approach (35)
        Marksmanship (1)
        Heroic (1)

MG-100 StarFortress - •Vennie - 86
    •Vennie - Crimson Cutter (62)
        Proton Bombs (5)
        Proximity Mines (6)
        Veteran Turret Gunner (6)
        •Paige Tico (7)

Total: 200/200

View in the X-Wing Squad Builder

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8 hours ago, punkUser said:

No, the front 3 die is not a [mobile arc] attack so can't trigger off of VTG.

Ah, okay.

...man i'm still confused. So primary arc allows paige to take a spin, eh?

 

8 hours ago, Hiemfire said:

🤨 As long as the RZ-2's Primary is pointed forwards and the target is in the RZ-2's bullseye arc (every ship has a bullseye arc, not every ship has a bullseye arc only weapon) then it works. Outmaneuver doesn't on the RZ-2 since it doesn't have a front arc weapon.

Oh right that's the one.

That's still really really stupid by the way.

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47 minutes ago, Captain Lackwit said:

Ah, okay.

...man i'm still confused. So primary arc allows paige to take a spin, eh?

 

Oh right that's the one.

That's still really really stupid by the way.

I think it's tough mostly because we can get stuck in a 1.0 mentality.  Strip that away and I find a lot of things have been easier to wrap my head around.

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4 hours ago, AlexW said:

I think it's tough mostly because we can get stuck in a 1.0 mentality.  Strip that away and I find a lot of things have been easier to wrap my head around.

True. Like torpedoes not needing to spend their lock.

What a crazy one THAT was to learn..!

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my contribution to this entertaining idea

MG-100 StarFortress - •Ben Teene - 101
    •Ben Teene - Crimson Bolide (63)
        Trajectory Simulator (10)
        •C-3PO (6)
        Proton Bombs (5)
        Shield Upgrade (4)
        •Paige Tico (7)
        Veteran Turret Gunner (6)

MG-100 StarFortress - •Vennie - 98
    •Vennie - Crimson Cutter (62)
        Perceptive Copilot (8)
        Shield Upgrade (4)
        •Rey (14)
        •Finn (10)

Total: 199/200

View in the X-Wing Squad Builder

I'm also playing with the idea of Vennie and 2 Cobalt Squadron bombers for 3x270 degrees of fun :) 

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Played a couple games today.

First tried

Vennie w/ rose,finn,vtg,pa

x3 Blue sqd Awings w/ adv optics

Won the game vs kylo double SFs. Finn was nice but only got two primarys all game with him. Second one was for a full 5 dice attack followed by a 3 dice attack. 1 rounded an SF at the end of the game thanks to a direct hit. Only 1 hull Kylo was left. I lost 1 awing and vennie on 1 hull.

Game 2, I swapped out finn for paige + seismics.

Paige is a little dirty, like 1st ed 360.

Won pretty handily against a Norra,Sabine,Jake,Arvyl list. Vennie double tapped arvyl for two shields, arvyl dodged his arc next round, but i range 3 shot at jake, then paige spun around and finished arvyl off. Seismics did 2 dmg on sabine who likes staying next to rocks. And all her shenanigans still found her taking shots from vennie with paige on board.

Awings were fast enough to zip passed norra and try to stay out of range 1. Vennie had 5 hull left, and had 2 awings only down a shield.

Love these ps1 awings. Prefer them over higher ps ships cuz they cant be blocked, always focused.

Edited by wurms

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So just to confirm, Vinnie, Paige, vtg needs to proceed on firing with th front primary? At Phoenix hyperspace trials a friend went up against that build with Vinnie, and his ship was attacked from a side arc, the guy flipped the turret and fired again. The judge was called over and ruled that it was ok. 

The thought was that the side arcs were different arc A and arc B. He fired from arc A flipped the arc to the same side with arc B and fired again.

It was odd that the judge said that was ok. It seemed broken. He shouldn't of been able to fire him j the same arc the way?

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11 minutes ago, Richardizme said:

So just to confirm, Vinnie, Paige, vtg needs to proceed on firing with th front primary? At Phoenix hyperspace trials a friend went up against that build with Vinnie, and his ship was attacked from a side arc, the guy flipped the turret and fired again. The judge was called over and ruled that it was ok. 

While the rulings of judges stand at the time, the Judge was wrong. Rules Reference Page 16, Rotate, first bullet point:

"If a ship rotates a double turret arc indicator, it must select the other two standard arcs it was not already selecting."

So yes, the first primary attack for a Paige + VTG  Shoot/Rotate/VTG Shot/Rotate sequence MUST be from the front arc ( Icon arc standard front ) primary.

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15 minutes ago, Richardizme said:

So just to confirm, Vinnie, Paige, vtg needs to proceed on firing with th front primary? At Phoenix hyperspace trials a friend went up against that build with Vinnie, and his ship was attacked from a side arc, the guy flipped the turret and fired again. The judge was called over and ruled that it was ok. 

The thought was that the side arcs were different arc A and arc B. He fired from arc A flipped the arc to the same side with arc B and fired again.

It was odd that the judge said that was ok. It seemed broken. He shouldn't of been able to fire him j the same arc the way?

You cannot rotate the bow tie arc 180°. From the rules reference:

If a ship rotates a double turret arc indicator, it must select the other two standard arcs it was not already selecting.

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40 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:

So yes, the first primary attack for a Paige + VTG  Shoot/Rotate/VTG Shot/Rotate sequence MUST be from the front arc ( Icon arc standard front ) primary.

I knew about the turret rotation rule. Admittedly I did play a friendly match doing it wrong.

Why must you shoot out the front first though? A turret Attack is still a primary attack.

If for some reason no one was in front of me but instead to my rear and side I could shoot the turret out the back at first target then rotate and shoot out side at second target. 

Or even better if they are an angle when both my rear and side arch could hit the same target I could hit him twice. 

Of course attacking from the front arch first and front turret second is probably still better because of the one extra attack die on front arch attack. 

Edited by Codes

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6 minutes ago, Codes said:

Why must you shoot out the front first though?

The turret is a bowtie (dual turret) and when it is rotated is must be rotated to the arcs that neither side of the bow tie had occupied. The extremely unlikely exception to not being able to trigger it with one of the turret arcs is when the target is overlapping the rear arc and a side arc, then it would be shoot from the side arc, rotate so the opposite arc is now rear, vtg shot, rotate.

Edited by Hiemfire

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22 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:

The turret is a bowtie (dual turret) and when it is rotated is must be rotated to the arcs that neither side of the bow tie had occupied. The extremely unlikely exception to not being able to trigger it with one of the turret arcs is when the target is overlapping the rear arc and a side arc, then it would be shoot from the side arc, rotate so the opposite arc is now rear, vtg shot, rotate.

Actually this happened several times in a match last night where sometimes i had nothing in front of the bomber but i did to the side and behind it. And I also was able for 2 turns able to keep a ship in one of the side arcs and the back arc.

Edited by KiraYamatoSF

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Just now, KiraYamatoSF said:

Actually this happened several times in a match last night where sometimes i gad nothing in front of the bomber but i did to the side and behind it. And I also was able for 2 turns able to keep a ship in one of the side arcs and the back arc.

A large base was the target? Mediums and smalls should have been able to clear the second arc after the first time you shot them.

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5 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:

A large base was the target? Mediums and smalls should have been able to clear the second arc after the first time you shot them.

Small base, barely got him the 2nd time but his x wing was in a bad spot near a rock and I think he was more worried about my Poe closing in.

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Three more games with:

Vennie w/ rose,paige,vtg,pattern,seismics

x3 Blue Awings w/ adv optics

First game was some scum mix of Nym, Sol, and a couple mining ties. Sol dropped in two rounds before dropping a bomb. I lost an awing from a nym seismic. Nym dropped shortly after and it was a near full vennie and two full awings vs ties. Vennie is monster against 1 agility ships like scurrgs.

Second game was fenn and two firesprays. Sprays jousted, and fenn flanked. I flew away from fenn with awings and turned toward sprays. The stop + PA is priceless on Vennie. I attacked one spray, then did the stop focus and the spray tried to ram me but landed range 1 of vennies front arc. Awings just kept plinking away. Im a huge believer in adv optics. Its so consistent with dmg output on these Awings who shoot every single round. Enemy ships are just constantly bombarded with shots. Anyways. Dropped the spray. Fenn killed an awing, but i drew fenn away from my bomber who was now coming up behind fenn. My other two awings blocked fenn. Vennie hit him for two dmg. Then the awings blocked fenn again, and vennie finished him off. Third spray couldnt handle all the arcs and dropped a few rounds later. I was worried about facing fenn, but the awings rear arc allows them to fly away or over him and preventing range 1.

Third game was imp aces Vader Soontir Whisper.

Aces came straight for the bomber. My awings flanked.

First round was a bloodbath. Vennie ate tons of dmg and crits 6dmg total. Vennie double tapped soontir to death and awings took a couple shields from vader. After that it was vader wrecking vennie. I had a range 1 on vader, but vader crit me for Blinded pilot. Vennie did 0 dmg on no shield vader. That was probably the game right there. Rest of game my three awings blocked and maneuvered beautifully. Whisper did nothing all game. Vader was just on fire. I roll 2 hits and crit and he gets all paint. I couldnt put another dmg on vader and he took out an awing eventually. I called the game there as 2 awings aint gonna beat vader and whisper.

Felt good all game. Just dmg was not going through. Probably should have gone for vader first since he hits harder than soontir.

Love the list. Seismics did nothing in all games but i like the threat.

Going to try a Han with the awings to help against aces and what not. Han w/ Rey gunner, c3po, tact officer. Gives me i6 coordinate with the awings to help em arc dodge a bit.

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Question about Vennie since this seems like a good enough thread without starting a new one.

Just to confirm (or correct) my understanding of Vennie's ability. My current understand is that only turret arcs proc his ability. I mean, that's the symbol that says is needed... His front arc does not proc his ability (assuming the turret is facing side to side).  For that matter his ability can only be procced from Bombers (turret arcs), A-Wings, and YT-1300.

I'm just doubting myself because a guy who normally judges at the store I play at seemed to be playing it wrong last night i.e. having Vennie proc from his from arc.

 

Edited by Skitchx

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On 2/6/2019 at 9:01 PM, Captain Lackwit said:

...man i'm still confused. So primary arc allows paige to take a spin, eh?

Not only the primary (front V) arc. Paige Tico card says "after you perform a primary attack...". A Primary Attack on the Starfortress can be from the front arc (3-dice V) or the turret (2-dice bowtie). Primary attacks come from primary weapons which FFG states are "the red number and firing arc symbol on a ship card" and "each ship has up to two primary weapons". So, for example, the turret on a Starfortress is primary in addition to its primary front arc, the turret on a Resistance A-Wing is primary, the turret on a YT-1300 is primary, the turret arc you would gain from a Dorsal or Ion Cannon Turret is not primary.

That being said on a Starfortress with Paige and a Vet Turret Gunner you could technically fire from the turret twice at the same target if the enemy overlaps two arcs. Of course, you would never want to do this if they are in front of you since you have your 3-dice front arc available.

On 2/6/2019 at 12:16 PM, punkUser said:

No, the front 3 die is not a [mobile arc] attack so can't trigger off of VTG.

And here is the confirmation to my question.

Edited by Skitchx

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This has been a great thread for me...built a Double-tap Vennie list after reading through it (see below) and it's been fairly successful so far.  The version you're going to see is not the one that I've played, but what resulted from the play.  I think this one might work better.

I did want to jump in on whether Vennie's ability works on the front arc, @Skitchx - no.  The ability says turret arc (however, it doesn't say another friendly ship's turret arc, so it can be triggered by Vennie's own arcs).  I've got the reference included.

T-70 X-wing - •Nien Nunb - 71
    •Nien Nunb - Sarcastic Survivor (55)
        Marksmanship (1)
        R3 Astromech (3)
        •Black One (2)
        Integrated S-foils (Closed) (0)
        Ferrosphere Paint (6)
        Heavy Laser Cannon (4)

MG-100 StarFortress - •Vennie - 93
    •Vennie - Crimson Cutter (62)
        Perceptive Copilot (8)
        Proton Bombs (5)
        Veteran Turret Gunner (6)
        •Paige Tico (7)
        Pattern Analyzer (5)

RZ-2 A-wing - Blue Squadron Recruit - 35
    Blue Squadron Recruit - (32)
        Intimidation (3)

Total: 199/200

View in the X-Wing Squad Builder

I had a version done up with Talli Lintra, but I find that this one matches more closely with my play style, so I discarded the Talli one and focused on developing this one.  It's Hyperspace legal, rather than extended, as I find I like the Hyperspace format for list-building and take it as a challenge to build lists I want to play with the build restrictions.

 

 

Edited by feltipern1

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