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Maktorius

Ardus Ix' Erebus (community errata discussion)

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45 minutes ago, Xelto said:

I understand and agree with the small changes thing. My problem with using the skill option is that I'm concerned that it's to passive. You end up not moving or positioning while you do it, which might keep him from joining the fray in a timely manner.

The idea was that it is a minor buff for the consistent situation that Ardus finds himself in where he is looking at losing a charge, won’t get a counter melee since his is so early, and his only option (currently) is reform+armor up. This gives him a way so that the situation is more of an inconvenience than crippling. 

 

This is ability does jack when he’s in open field or already in combat and that’s fine. In my eyes he doesn’t really need help there. 

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I think the Skill: Protected 2 is a good one to try.  I usually vaporize him on a charge that he has little response for.   Commonly he can be in range of CI Archers -- so if he survives the charge, he's blighting and locking down the unit with his counter attack -- which seems good.

It also improves his existing dial, without changing the actual dial.

 

 

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Yeahhh the theme of it really doesn't appeal to me, but in terms of helping him survive in a world with a terrible dial, it's pretty good. I will continue deliberating, see if inspiration strikes.

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On ‎1‎/‎22‎/‎2019 at 8:50 AM, Bhelliom said:

22 points and 4 trays of archers, you mean. Getting access to the upgrades is nice, and being able to fit in smaller terrain can sometimes be a big deal, but the fact remains that you're spending points on Ardus instead of on boots. That 2x1 unit is 4 damage from dropping to threat 1 and virtual irrelevance, which most ranged units can manage quite handily, whereas the 2x2 can weather anything but a spike from a 3 threat unit with Tempered. This is more true of melee units than ranged since they'll be up fighting, but certainly the feeling locally has been that the points are better spent on trays than on Ardus (outside of niche builds like double deathcaller).

If the archers are just blight batteries, 1 tray or 2 doesn't matter.

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It would require a dial change, but an i7 attack action would be great.  I think tacking protected on is the easier, and probably better option though.

What if his card and figure upgrade card both had the text: Skill; if an opponent charges you, perform a melee before they perform their melee.

Almost is file leader, but means Ardus is never caught off guard, he will always take a swing first.  It also improves reanimated embedded with Ardus significantly, as they can melee/skill, and become a deadly reactionary unit.

Too much perhaps?

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2 hours ago, Jukey said:

What if his card and figure upgrade card both had the text: Skill; if an opponent charges you, perform a melee before they perform their melee.

Almost is file leader, but means Ardus is never caught off guard, he will always take a swing first.  It also improves reanimated embedded with Ardus significantly, as they can melee/skill, and become a deadly reactionary unit.

Too much perhaps?

I like this approach better than skill --> protected. If it's too strong, it can probably be dialed back a bit by having any damage happen simultaneously.

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8 hours ago, Jukey said:

What if his card and figure upgrade card both had the text: Skill; if an opponent charges you, perform a melee before they perform their melee.

Almost is file leader, but means Ardus is never caught off guard, he will always take a swing first.  It also improves reanimated embedded with Ardus significantly, as they can melee/skill, and become a deadly reactionary unit.

5 hours ago, Xelto said:

I like this approach better than skill --> protected.

 

So... is this guy (see below) back on the table (I'm all for it)?

 

On 1/22/2019 at 2:01 PM, Maktorius said:

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This "File leader" ability would be really good for Ardus. He has an early attack, but he has no way to fend of being charged from initative 4 or higher. This should make him less of a "victim", and give him more opportunities to trigger his surge borrowing ability. A nerf on this ability could be that he recieves a Stun token.

The card needs rewording I'm sure, writing rules in english is not my speciality :D

Edited by Maktorius

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6 hours ago, Maktorius said:

So... is this guy (see below) back on the table (I'm all for it)

Well, it's worth a look-at. But this conversation has sort of skipped all over, sometimes at high speed. I think it's probably time to take the best ideas, and give people plenty of time to vote on which of those ideas they think are test-worthy, and the specific one or of the test-worthy ones they would prefer seeing tested.

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Skill - File leader might be too strong.  Ardus can do some nasty damage, especially with Dimodian Blades, plus he'll be armor 4 for that charge.   The other issue is, if he is in range of CI reanimate archers, he's going to trivially lock down the charging unit.  They will charge him and he will use Ardus Fury + Dimodian Precise rerolls to blight their attack, and then he'll  be attacking at init 3 on subsequent rounds with 2 surges minimum to keep reapplying the blight.   Seems pretty strong.

 

 

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18 minutes ago, Glucose98 said:

Skill - File leader might be too strong.  Ardus can do some nasty damage, especially with Dimodian Blades, plus he'll be armor 4 for that charge.   The other issue is, if he is in range of CI reanimate archers, he's going to trivially lock down the charging unit.  They will charge him and he will use Ardus Fury + Dimodian Precise rerolls to blight their attack, and then he'll  be attacking at init 3 on subsequent rounds with 2 surges minimum to keep reapplying the blight.   Seems pretty strong.

We must not forget that he is a 37, 42p with the blades, hero. Another 24p with the CI-Reanimate archers. Thats 66p, it MUST be powerful for anyone to play! That is why noone plays him in tournaments as is.

And I don't see that as abusive, because it is not a very mobile and therefore aggressive thing. What you are describing is if someone charges him. What about someone shooting at him, flanking the archers, attacking the other 134 points etc. There are plenty of ways to handle this 66p blob, just don't do it head on charging it :)

Also note that he can't use the hit or surge modifier as this would be a skill action and not a red attack action. And if he gets stunned after (baby step), he can't use those the following turn either.

Edited by Maktorius

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What if we reduce the effect of losing him?

Something like...

When Ardus Ix'Erebus is removed from play, you gain 10 victory points.  That way, he still costs you 42 points to run him with the blades, but effectively you only lose 32 when he dies.

I'd feel a lot less bad if Ardus gave up less points.  By not making him cheaper, you don't get a bigger force, you just give up less when he dies.

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11 hours ago, Darth Matthew said:

What if we reduce the effect of losing him?

Something like...

When Ardus Ix'Erebus is removed from play, you gain 10 victory points.  That way, he still costs you 42 points to run him with the blades, but effectively you only lose 32 when he dies.

I'd feel a lot less bad if Ardus gave up less points.  By not making him cheaper, you don't get a bigger force, you just give up less when he dies.

What's story behind? Powerful leader that puffs into smoke when killed but his soul finds another corpse within 10 miles and start gathering another army? 

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6 hours ago, Skaflok said:

 

What's story behind? Powerful leader that puffs into smoke when killed but his soul finds another corpse within 10 miles and start gathering another army? 

What's the story behind being 37 points?  Storylines and point values don't ever intersect; so you don't really need a story to explain it.  

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Recently played against weird list: 6trays of reanimates with dispatch, 2*1 CI MCW worms, 2*1 RArchers Vorunthul with obcasium and thirst and ardus with dimodian blades and ardus fury. worms succesfully escorted their load for 100 points, but point difference was terrible for me. I totally was outplayed with terrain. Ardus supported by dispatch did terrific job - with 3 crossbow belts sticking from his undead chest he reached line of my spearmen with zachareth and single-handedly decimated them, achieving 12 damage/attack with 3 attacks. of course his army was just perfect for this result, anyway I am impressed.

My first game against vorunthul . terrible experience. 

P.S. in some builds ardus is just perfect as is. You only have to protect him and make him reach enemy. and have dispatch

 

Edited by Skaflok
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