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It isn’t Guardians of the Republic.

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6 hours ago, Hiemfire said:

Man, that is gaming forums in general...

Isn't that the internet in general?

7 hours ago, hargleblarg said:

Also, don't forget that they can rotate out specific pilots, sort of like how renegade U-Wings are in but not rebel pilots.

Indeed. Yavin-format events are a case in point where they've done that, where your only legal TIE/x1 pilot is Darth Vader.

(I mean, the others are pretty terrible so you probably wouldn't anyway, but you get what I mean)

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Actually, a general point. In the horrible, horrible thread that was luckily closed, the point was made I think by @SOTL that people make wrong assumptions and are then disappointed when that does not happen.

We see the exact thing already after this article.

Apparently the article implies but does not say that there will be regular rotation after 6 months. Over on reddit I've seen several people agreeing that the article implies different point changes for hyperspace and extended. Of course, both of these are possible and even cool. But are they true? Who knows at this point. (Edit: actuall, we now do about the rotation) So maybe we should jump less to unfounded conclusions, speculate less about the future and just enjoy the ride.

Hyperspace allows for more viable options. Extended has more options period. Both are fun. There is no reason to "pick a team" or decide between the two. Simply enjoy the game.

Edited by GreenDragoon

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Yes, and I've been on the rotation speculation train early on. I guess this points a bit more in this direction.

However, 'redefined' would also be technically correct for newly added releases or point changes. The overall theme of the article is meta-changes and true differences between hyperspace and extended. I read 'redefined' as another way for meta change. Which is already achieved by rereleases and point changes.

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26 minutes ago, SOTL said:

It has been clarified this morning that 'Hyperspace will be redefined for each season'.

 

 

18 minutes ago, GreenDragoon said:

Yes, and I've been on the rotation speculation train early on. I guess this points a bit more in this direction.

However, 'redefined' would also be technically correct for newly added releases or point changes. The overall theme of the article is meta-changes and true differences between hyperspace and extended. I read 'redefined' as another way for meta change. Which is already achieved by rereleases and point changes.

Preceding that entry by a little bit:

"Because changes in the metagame are driven by changes to the available products, there are three primary ways to drive change—add to the existing product, redefine the number of available products, and edit the available products."

Underlined section looks to imply that the list of what is and isn't permitted will change. Point changes would fall under edit I think.

The section that SOTL's quote came from:

"Here, the Hyperspace game mode—with its tailored squad-building guidelines—introduces an entirely new metagame, and it can stand alongside the metagame that players can enjoy at their regular in-store events and at the X-Wing System Open Series. Additionally, because the Hyperspace game mode is redefined with each season, you will be able to enjoy more changes in the metagame, and you can expect to see new ships, squadrons, and strategies rising to the fore with every new Hyperspace season (two per year)."

It is also interesting that they emphasize that Hyperspace will make it easier for newer players to enter the game a bit below that. Unless they're planning on continually reprinting the same ships for every season, a rotational list seems very likely, possibly with X-Wings and TIE/Lns being ever present in the list due to them being in the Core Set (atleast those pilots that are available in the Core Set).

 

Edit: Missed this part and it is very applicable (underlined for ease of focus):

"At the same time, by redefining and truncating the list of potential squad builds within the Hyperspace game mode, we make it easier for newer players to explore these options—and, importantly, to afford the starship expansions that introduce the pilots and upgrades they hope to fly."

Pairing how they first used "redefine" with "truncating" rotational lists seems to be what they're doing. Hard to keep the list of what is allowed truncated if it is just added to with every new season.

Edited by Hiemfire

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5 hours ago, TheHumanHydra said:

Come to Kitchener April 6 too! The (your faction) needs you! 

Been a while since I've hit Flints. It's marked and locked into the calendar.

3 hours ago, GreenDragoon said:

And keeping the core set forever legal makes sense

This could be a complete flop if FFG didn't keep the core legal in Hyperspace... I mean, I could be wrong... but something feels really bad about not allowing X-Wings and TIE Fighters in this game about X-Wings and TIE Fighters. I realize it's implied in the writing, and it fits along with my own personal expectations. I'm very curious to see how FFG rolls this all out.

5 hours ago, GreenDragoon said:

people make wrong assumptions and are then disappointed when that does not happen.

This needs to be more prominent. Don't care where the original quote came from, for what purpose or context.

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6 hours ago, GreenDragoon said:

I'm also cautiously optimistic that it means rotation.

Especially the 'truncating' is important, I missed that initially. And keeping the core set forever legal makes sense, too, from the way they wrote it.

IMHO, if you still don't think this means rotation, you just don't want to see it.  I think FFG is couching it in the most gentle of ways to let it sink in, or to give themselves wiggle room.

And, since this is meant to be a gateway to new players, the core set will have to be forever legal.  No one in their right mind would buy an illegal component to get started in a game!!

What I find interesting it that the rotation might not even be chassis-by-chassis, but actually pilot-by-pilot.

Not exactly what I was hoping for in terms of Narrative Play, but it is actually a step in the right direction.  FFG can craft "seasonal scenarios" with some pretty fine degree of control.

The dream:  HyperPacks of cards that add pilots to existing ships each season without needing to constantly rerelease old chassis.  For example, what if the YT-1300 was the Last Chance and flown by Platt O'Keefe for a year?  In fact, it would still drive sales of the ship expac, because to fly the new pilot, you would need the old chassis.

Edited by Darth Meanie

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9 minutes ago, Darth Meanie said:

The dream:  HyperPacks of cards that add pilots to existing ships each season without needing to constantly rerelease old chassis.  For example, what if the YT-1300 was the Lady Luck and flown by Platt O'Keefe for a year?  In fact, it would still drive sales of the ship expac, because to fly the new pilot, you would need the old chassis.

I'm not... against this idea.

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3 hours ago, LagJanson said:

I'm not... against this idea.

I am just because I've browsed around for some Rebel Ys and in most places they're out of stock. Hyperspace card packs and not continually printing those ships that are legal if they don't rotate out ships would result in what new players have to deal with now when trying to get into extended with some of the ships now. The cardboard is there but no stock of the legal ships they're after.

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10 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:

I am just because I've browsed around for some Rebel Ys and in most places they're out of stock. Hyperspace card packs and not continually printing those ships that are legal if they don't rotate out ships would result in what new players have to deal with now when trying to get into extended with some of the ships now. The cardboard is there but no stock of the legal ships they're after.

Well how is this any different for new players than having one of only 4 ships available to the faction be unavailable? It seems to me that a new player is equally hosed in either case.

The net effect is the same. They want to fly a ship they don’t have, and can’t get. So rejecting the idea on that premise doesn’t hold for me.

Rejecting it because you don’t think FFG would do it however? Completely different, and I’d agree.

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12 minutes ago, Hippie Moosen said:

Whats up @Rexler Brath? Your confused face has me confused. I'd love to clarify anything, but I can't do that without knowing what is causing your reaction. Help me out, my dude. 

That's just how he reacts to everything.  Personally, I think he's become so confused that he's permanently confused the Confused reaction with Like.  So whenever you see Rexler Brath react with Confused, you should interpret it as, "I, Rexler Brath, really love this post and wholeheartedly agree with it!"

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25 minutes ago, millertime059 said:

Well how is this any different for new players than having one of only 4 ships available to the faction be unavailable? It seems to me that a new player is equally hosed in either case.

The net effect is the same. They want to fly a ship they don’t have, and can’t get. So rejecting the idea on that premise doesn’t hold for me.

Rejecting it because you don’t think FFG would do it however? Completely different, and I’d agree.

Lets step ahead 4 Hyperspace seasons. You're a new player. The original list of ships for the factions has stayed the same but there hasn't been a restock on the Hyperspace legal ships from FFG since their original release (so upwards of two years for many ships). FFG releases this season's pilots and upgrades pack. Do you even bother? One of the intentions of Hyperspace format is to, in their own words "The Hyperspace game mode will offer newer players easier entry into competitive X-Wing." Does releasing only the packs fit that statement consistently down the line? I don't think it does, which is why I don't like or agree with Darth Meanie's suggestion. Hyperspace will likely be a rotational list format with few exceptions (X-Wing Core set ships and pilots), as it should be unless they plan on keeping all of the Hyperspace legal ships on the shelves constantly.

Edited by Hiemfire

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1 minute ago, JJ48 said:

That's just how he reacts to everything.  Personally, I think he's become so confused that he's permanently confused the Confused reaction with Like.  So whenever you see Rexler Brath react with Confused, you should interpret it as, "I, Rexler Brath, really love this post and wholeheartedly agree with it!"

Is it weird to feel disconcerted that they've kicked a couple of my posts likes?

Edited by Hiemfire

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3 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:

Lets step ahead 4 Hyperspace seasons. You're a new player. The original list of ships for the factions has stayed the same but there hasn't been a restock on the Hyperspace legal ships from FFG since their original release (so upwards of two years for many ships). FFG releases this season's pilots and upgrades pack. Do you even bother? One of the intentions of Hyperspace format is to, in their own words "The Hyperspace game mode will offer newer players easier entry into competitive X-Wing." Do releasing only the packs fit that statement consistently down the line? I don't think it does, which is why I don't like or agree with Darth Meanie's suggestion. Hyperspace will likely be a rotational list format with few exceptions (X-Wing Core set ships and pilots), as it should be unless they plan on keeping all of the Hyperspace legal ships on the shelves constantly.

That makes sense, but I think they could get around it somewhat by only releasing packs for a ship when they reprint it.

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3 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:

Lets step ahead 4 Hyperspace seasons. You're a new player. The original list of ships for the factions has stayed the same but there hasn't been a restock on the Hyperspace legal ships from FFG since their original release (so upwards of two years for many ships). FFG releases this season's pilots and upgrades pack. Do you even bother? One of the intentions of Hyperspace format is to, in their own words "The Hyperspace game mode will offer newer players easier entry into competitive X-Wing." Does releasing only the packs fit that statement consistently down the line? I don't think it does, which is why I don't like or agree with Darth Meanie's suggestion. Hyperspace will likely be a rotational list format with few exceptions (X-Wing Core set ships and pilots), as it should be unless they plan on keeping all of the Hyperspace legal ships on the shelves constantly.

I'm glad you reposted, because I could not tell what your original concern was.

Personally, Hyperspace should make it much easier to see all Hyperspace ships stocked.  Where I would be concerned is new players trying to pick up ships that only play in Extended.  Those SKUs might languish.  However, I think that FFG has no choice.  With 7 factions in print, SKUs will need to go dormant.  It is the state of the market:

Quote

You were talking primarily about the state of the market for board games.  You're obviously in other categories: card games, miniature games, and now collectible games.  Any differences that you're seeing in those different categories, in terms of health of the market or growth?
Petersen:  The whole idea of having a lot of SKUs being offered affects everything.  Since the stores only have so much space, whether it's a blister pack, or whether it's a miniatures box or whether it's a board game box, the bloat of products affects all the categories, in my view.

You have a store who looks at, for example a miniatures section for Privateer Press, thinking "Does that section make me a good return?  Do I get foot traffic in that section?  Or should I put in another line of board games?  Would that give me a better section?"  Or vice versa.  That's a consideration stores are facing frequently now.

There is a store limit now.  It used to be capital requirements that would limit the amount of inventory hobby stores could take in.  With the growth in the industry the last 10 years, that is no longer the case.  Stores have been doing really well.  It's not so much the capital anymore.  It is, in some instances, but now it's actually physical space.  Where are they going to put the 50 new boardgames that came in this week?

Underlined for emphasis on my part.  Full article here:

https://icv2.com/articles/news/view/39079/icv2-interview-asmodee-execs-state-market-part-2

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14 minutes ago, Darth Meanie said:

 

I'm glad you reposted, because I could not tell what your original concern was.

Personally, Hyperspace should make it much easier to see all Hyperspace ships stocked.  Where I would be concerned is new players trying to pick up ships that only play in Extended.  Those SKUs might languish.  However, I think that FFG has no choice.  With 7 factions in print, SKUs will need to go dormant.  It is the state of the market:

Underlined for emphasis on my part.  Full article here:

https://icv2.com/articles/news/view/39079/icv2-interview-asmodee-execs-state-market-part-2

I had thought I was clear, but I'm glad to clarify to the best of my ability where I'm not. I don't have an issue with card/cardboard packs going forwards as an option for someone to pick up to be able to make use of ships they already have (veteran players need some love too), but if it was the only way to get access to what is supposed to be a new player friendly format I see major issues. As for the section you quoted from that article, I think a rotational Hyperspace format would do a fair bit to alleviate stock bloat while keeping the shelves fresh. It may not completely eliminate it though, and card/cardboard only packs might increase that bloat.

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1 hour ago, Hiemfire said:

I am just because I've browsed around for some Rebel Ys and in most places they're out of stock. Hyperspace card packs and not continually printing those ships that are legal if they don't rotate out ships would result in what new players have to deal with now when trying to get into extended with some of the ships now. The cardboard is there but no stock of the legal ships they're after.

It’s not without problems, I will give you that. There are some other issues tucked away below the surface, I’m sure, but it’s a neat idea that I might give some thought to later.

Anyway, not putting effort in because it’s out of my control and not even something I can implement locally myself.

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28 minutes ago, Hiemfire said:

I had thought I was clear, but I'm glad to clarify to the best of my ability where I'm not. I don't have an issue with card/cardboard packs going forwards as an option for someone to pick up to be able to make use of ships they already have (veteran players need some love too), but if it was the only way to get access to what is supposed to be a new player friendly format I see major issues. As for the section you quoted from that article, I think a rotational Hyperspace format would do a fair bit to alleviate stock bloat while keeping the shelves fresh. It may not completely eliminate it though, and card/cardboard only packs might increase that bloat.

Ah, I see what you mean.

No, I would see them as concomitant releases.

A ship cycles in (say, the Y-Wing} and thus sees a big reprint run to get ready for Hyperspace.  New players have stock.

Also, a card pack is released that adds Tiree and Pops to the mix.  And maybe stuff for other ships and other factions, mandatory or suggested secondary weapons, themed ship titles, whatever.  The whole kit is labeled "2019," and printed for that season.  Extended gets a boost, casuals get some new stuff, and FFG can try out some "fluffier" ideas like making the Y-Wing a BTL-S3 for a season, either as a title or by reprinting all the pilot cards.  They don't need to change the expac; you get bonus materials for the season that are then used in Extended or casually.

Another idea would be to create squadrons; the T-65 is always Hyperspace legal (and in print}, but this year you can only fly Blue Squadron--pick up your 2019 Hyperspace pack now for Merrick and crew!!

Edited by Darth Meanie

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1 hour ago, JJ48 said:

That's just how he reacts to everything.  Personally, I think he's become so confused that he's permanently confused the Confused reaction with Like.  So whenever you see Rexler Brath react with Confused, you should interpret it as, "I, Rexler Brath, really love this post and wholeheartedly agree with it!"

That's different, but at least it makes a little more sense lol

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